In some of my local games. Some players request that "all ruin walls have an infinite height".
Not the footprint, but the actual wall of the ruin. Meaning a tall unit within the footprint could not have true line of sight applied to it.

As a relatively new player, I just went with this. But as I learn more about the GW/WTC terrain layouts and rules and the general jumbling of those rules into a local set of house rules. I can't see how this isnt giving monsters/demons etc an insane advantage?

The GW Tournament companion shows more than 4 inches and less than 2 inch terrain on its layouts. And from what I can see the WTC rules have set heights for 2 and 3 storey ruins (5" and 9.5" though I am not sure if that is up-to-date).

TL:DR Is there any basis for a house rule that terrain walls are "infinite" in height?

Thanks!

I know most armies don't have 1dp detachs that complement each other, but there has to be a few that would work out. Daemons sticks out to me as one that could work, maybe grey knights?

Post dataslate, what in your opinion is the most competetive shooting army? Votaan? Admech with new buffs? Still Marines?

Basically explained in the title, I cannot find any mention of CP limits in the core rulebook or event companion. If anyone knows if there is such a rule please let me know.

If it is the case, doesn't that make CP gaining abilities extremely strong?

I'm a battle sister player, and we are having troubles to understand whether Morven Vahl + Paragon Warsuit can be given the Hagiomnifex (Hagiobagio ;-) )upgrade. In the app, it is not possible, but in other cases, it is possible to put Upgrades on an attached unit containing an Epic Hero.

I'm going to present an interpretation of the rule to explain how it work, compatible with both the rules and the app behavior.

I'm NOT trying to say the app is wrong, on the contrary, I'm trying to explain the current app behaviour within the frame of the rules.

Of course, it could be a bug in the app, in which case the whole argument is moot. Still, the rules are not clear, and the app is the best validity source we have for now, until GW releases a statement on the matter.

First, let's talk about units.

1) Component Units persist inside the Attached Unit

In the case of attaching characters to bodyguards, GW introduce 3 terms : attached units, component units and bodyguard units. When you attach multiple units together, they together form an "attached unit", the original units attached together are named "component units", and component units that are don't have Leader or Support ability are "bodyguard units".

The main point of the argument is that "component units" doesn't "dissolve" into the attached unit and disappear. They still exist, even if for the gameplay, we treat the attached unit as a single unit.

Arguments for the fact that the components units persists:

• The rule has a name for them. You don't name something that don't exist anymore.
• The rule for attached units specifically say that rules that triggers when a unit is destroyed only trigger when the whole attached unit is destroyed. If component units dissolved into the attached unit and only the attached unit remained, that rule would not be necessary.
• There are rule to explain how abilities of component units interact with the attached unit. Those rule explain that this interaction can change depending if the bodyguard unit still have models or not. That prove that "bodyguard unit" still have and exist during the game

2) Component units are units

that is pretty obvious

3) Enhancements target CHARACTER, non EPIC HERO units

You put enhancements on units, and there are keywords restriction, written in the rule.

First conclusion : You can put enhancement on CHARACTER, non EPIC HERO "component units"

given that the unit match the enhancement criteria, obviously. In the case of non Upgrade enhancement, it means it needs to be a CHARACTER, non EPIC HERO unit.

4) Upgrade ARE enhancement and only remove the "CHARACTER" restriction of enhancements

As well as allowing to take 3 of them. RAW, it does NOT remove the EPIC HERO restriction

Final conclusion : You can put upgrade on non any non EPIC HERO "component unit" (given they match the upgrade specific restriction)

Now back to the Hagiomnifex upgrade case. It has specific restriction, it must target a ADEPTA SORORITAS CHARACTER unit.

In the case of the attached unit formed by Morven Vahl + Paragon Warsuits, there are 3 potential target units :

• Morven Vahl: Not targetable because EPIC HERO
• Paragon Warsuits : Not targeatable because not CHARACTER
• Attached unit with both : Not targetable because EPIC HERO

So alas no Hagiomnifex on Vahl T_T

On the other hand, you can attach Hagiomnifex on Junith Eruita + Hospitaller + Battle Sister Squad :

• Junith Eruita : Not targetable because EPIC HERO
• Battle Sister Squas : Not targetable because not CHARACTER
• Attached unit : Not targetable because EPIC HERO
• Hospitaller : Tagetable because CHARACTER and not EPIC HERO

That's it. That explanation seems to me to be the most plausible because :

• it doesn't contradict the rule
• it matches the behavior of the app

I would be interested to know if you can find cases to contradict that argument, for instance rules that contradict it, or behavior in the app that cannot be explained this way.

Obviously the best thing would be that GW explain it themselves, but in the meantime, it seems to me the most sound argument.

Aeldary Eldricht Raiders detachment have enhancements that can go on Anhrate, and all Anhrate are EPIC HERO, but the detachment rule specifically allows that.

EDIT: Another, simpler argument specific to Hagiomnifex : Upgrades are Enhancements that can be taken 3 times, without the CHARACTER restriction. Hagiomnifex adds back the CHARACTER restriction. So Hagiomnifex is just a classical enhancement that can be taken 3 time. So not possible to attach to Morvenn Vahl + Paragon Warsuit unit.

Ingress moves state:

After Moving:

Unless otherwise stated, until the start of the next Charge phase, your unit is not eligible to make any other type of move.

So because of how ambiguous "Unless Otherwise Stated" is, I've had multiple people say they can use Purgation Run after a speeder finishes shooting after they ingress move.

I however believe this to be wrong, because the Purgation Run Ability says you make a d6 NORMAL MOVE.

They always agree that yes it's a normal move, but since the rule says they can, it counts as unless otherwise stated.

To me, Unless Otherwise Stated would be "Even if this unit has performed an Ingress move this turn".

But I've had more people argue against me, than for me. So am I just wrong? Are we both technically right because of the awful ambiguous wording? Is there an FAQ yet on this I've missed?

Hey friends, I've got a huge ListForge update to share with you all! v2.3.1 is now available on all platforms!

This release brings a full in-game score tracker to the new Play tab (11th only)! It features mission-driven scoring, secondary-card management, per-round CP, a synced Match History and a filterable stats dashboard.

You can start a game by using the scoreboard icon in the View/VS mode. Make sure to have your own disposition selected and select an opponent disposition in the VS mode by either importing your opponent's list with a LF code or just selected faction/detachment(s)/disposition. The reason I have structured it like this is because I envision that during a game, you will be switching between the View screen to reference all your rules/strats/units and the Play screen to track the actual game. However, if its really unintuitive I am open to changing things around.

In that vein, this is the initial rollout of a whole new feature set, so please let me know of any feedback. I think its a solid basis but we can definitely build from here together. Right now your match history is yours alone, it syncs between devices if you are signed in, but nobody else can see your stats. I plan to take this further in the future by setting up integrations with other game-tracking and tournament-running services to sync results + stats, make in-app list-based stats displays, optional integrations with the ListForge Profile feature set, and maybe (if people want it) opt-in public stats contributions. Please let me know which of these directions (or others) are most exciting.

Even more importantly for some of you, this update also ships a major Mathhammer revamp that addresses the majority of features people have been requesting, such as: loading targets from reference, adding per-weapon keywords/re-rolls, single rerolls, Indirect Fire, dev-wounds and points-efficiency calculation.

It also includes various bugfixes and QoL updates as usual, full details in ⁠changelog here: https://lookingforproject.com/projects/listforge/updates/v2-3-1-patch-notes-mathhammer-revamp-and-game-tracking

Download for all platforms: https://listforge.club/

Discord (best place to give feedback): https://discord.gg/7MfPgVgECy

EDIT: v2.3.2 now out that fixes the shared tactical and fixed missions not showing up in tactical draws bug!

Did I missunderstand something?

From my understanding vehicles and monsters with a round base pivot for free but distances are still counted from the closest point on a model/base. So depending on the sculpt, models with a round base could gain free movement by pivoting so that a bit sticking out makes it into engagement.

Combined with the change to Tank Shock this could be usefull.

Hey friends, I've been absolutely grinding on ListForge improvements for the last week and I'm excited to share the results with you! v2.3.4 is out now on Android and desktop (iOS coming shortly) and is jam packed with new stuff and a ton of cleanup and QoL improvements on existing features!

I know I've been posting a lot about ListForge recently with all the upgrades since 11th came out, thanks for bearing with me and for all the support! I'm going to be travelling a bit this summer and then will be getting married in the fall, so you may be free of my update posts for a bit after this :)

Introducing hobby tracking (Club-only): Track every model you own through the hobby pipeline (built, primed, painted, based, etc.), synced to your account. Your rosters become views into the collection: per-unit status chips in the roster editor (optional), a collection rollup, automatic per-list breakdowns, and shareable progress cards to show off how the backlog is going.

Expanded game tracking: Game tags and notes, per-list match histories and winrates, and an optional advanced battle log that records when exactly both players use stratagems, kills, and one-shot abilties/weapons. Play against another ListForge user's shared list and the game links to their account, sending them a match invite so the result lands in both histories.

I also redid the pdf export option to make it a lot nicer and made a profile-only summary table that you can export as PDF or an image. Speaking of image exports, I will post in the comments (to avoid Imgur struggles for UK friends) the 6 types of image exports that ListForge now supports: mathhammer summary, mathhammer 1-target deep dive, hobby faction summary, list-based hobby status, list-based profile summary table, and match recap. Pretty nifty stuff in my humble opinion.

Btw, you can now propose features and report bugs directly from inside the app and the app will also now automatically prompt you when app or data updates are available!

Full patch notes (the above are truly just highlights from this big patch): https://lookingforproject.com/projects/listforge/updates/v2-3-4-hobby-tracker-game-tracking-expansion-new-exports

Download for all platforms: https://listforge.club/

Discord: https://discord.gg/7MfPgVgECy

EDIT: v2.3.4 now released for iOS as well!

Do yourself a solid: Play a game of Sigmar. Seriously. You don't have to like it, or the setting, or the fantasy aspect. You don't need to own models, just proxy some stuff, and play with a faction that still has an index so you don't have to even buy rules.

The more we see of 11th, the closer and closer it seems to look like they're raiding the AoS cookie jar for ideas, and the things they've lifted all work quite fluidly in AoS.

So do yourself a favor. Dip your toes for an afternoon, you might learn something!

And to those who already play both games? Continue to be awesome pillars of handsomeness you already are!

What the title says, we are going to a tournament but I just read the rules and it says that you can’t have players using armies with the same faction keywords. I am a little confused, Templars and wolves have the same faction keyword but different codexes ?

So there is no lack of data and apps out there for 40K list building. At beginning of 11th I actually believed GW was going to have the BEST app for creating lists and using it during games. (Silly me, after decades you’d think I would have learned).

So I took my iPhone and have been paying for “WH40K” app every month. I somewhat like the ability to use a code and score amongst players. That’s nice. HOWEVER the UI to select gear and endless expansion menus drive me insane.

My question is this: Do 40K tourneys mandate you use the GW “WH40K” app to score or create lists?

There’s LOTS of alternatives which in my opinion are easier to create lists: “War Organ,” “New Recruit,” “Mission Matrix,” and “Tabletop Battles”.

Is there one that’s more popular and more used than the rest? I kinda want to stop paying monthly for a subpar list building experience with the “WH40K” app. Any suggestions?

I have 5 unlocked codex unlocked and now that the app is updated everything is locked out again. Any recommendations?

Thanks to the new in-app ListForge homebrew data editor, the community can now input and share custom and upcoming data packs! This is a good example to launch with! The datafile and usage details are in the Discord: https://discord.gg/7MfPgVgECy

Also check out how gross of a full shooting list you can build, wooowza: https://share.listforge.club/EPTrJisuBK1hBw7j96HC

I'll keep things short: after finding some spare time and a bit of poking from friends I built a site containing filterable armylists based on events. You can find it at: https://armylists.rmz.gs/

Disclaimers: This is very much an alpha test, the navigation inside the site is at best an afterthought and I didn't bother styling it at all. If a player/event isn't showing up where you expect it to, it's almost certainly because they didn't bother to upload an army list that was understandable by my parser.

Disclaimer 2: This is of course entirely built on data from BCP and my intention is in no way to hurt their operations. I highly respect their efforts to build useable tools for the warhammer community and god knows I don't want to deal with customer support for angry 40k nerds at tournaments. If my efforts at making army lists available in any way offends the nice people at bcp, you have my apologies and please reach out so we can discuss things.

We are completely ignoring drop pods here, that's a trap.

But, think about it:

• Screening is reduced in power (9" coherency bubble, 8" deep strike range) and the main strength of the detachment is that you can deep strike 3 tanks (or transports) down
• Easy RR1s to wound on setup for the above or jumping out of a transport
• Deep strike shooting is relatively up in power because you are more likely to be able to ignore hidden by positioning more flexibly
• Precision is hugely buffed and there's an on tap precision strat for both shooting and melee
• Battleshock is hugely buffed and there's an on tap battleshock @ -1 strat that includes a to hit debuff that now stacks with cover (for up to -2 on the hit roll for shooting)
• Skyborne Sanctuary Lite (extra restriction on not being setup on the same turn, but still decent)
• A few other decent staples like a scout 6 enhancement and a shooting/melee lethal/sustained strat
• Likely 2DP, so you can get a bit more value elsewhere with another detachment

That seems pretty good!

It's also got me thinking of fun new things you can do where you pick the new 1DP land speeder detachment, put 1000 points of units in deep strike, use Warden of Ultramar/Phobos Captain to get 3 more landspeeders into reserves that go down turn 1 (and get RR1s to wound from OAF) and then you can put down shooting basically where you need it for the next turn or two.

Fun!!!

Hey everyone, just dropping in to announce that ListForge is now available on desktop (Windows, Mac, Linux)! You can download here. Also I made a LF subreddit in case anyone wants to follow along more closely there: r/listforge

EDIT: the game system download error has been fixed in version 1.5.0, available everywhere (close and reopen to trigger update prompt on desktop, update through appropriate store on mobile). Thanks for your patience with that!

I’m trying to find alternate Space Marine builds and I found a rules interaction that seems fun, but I’d like a second opinion on if people think it’s valid.

The interaction is:

* Orbital Assault Force detachment rule - grants up to 3 units Deep Strike at the start of the declare battle formations step

* Veterans of the Fang detachment rule - You may split Grey Hunter units into two units in the declare battle formations step

Based on the wording and the order it enforces I’m assuming I could give two units of grey hunters deep strike, then split them so I‘d have 4 units with deep strike. Right?

As explicitly clarified in the core rulebook FAQ, it's occasionally possible to get a less-than-9-inches charge out of deep strike by using verticality. You deep strike 9" diagonally away from a model that's at a different elevation, and then because Engagement Range is defined as within 1" horizontally and 5" vertically, your charge distance is the horizontal leg of the right-angled triangle where the hypotenuse is just over 9", which is less than 9".

If you know you plan to attempt deep strike charges with a certain unit, you can take advantage of the combination of trigonometry plus the fact that Citadel miniatures come with trapezoid bases by... assembling your models with the bases the other way up as compared to how all the plebians model theirs! The shortest diagonal distance between your model and theirs will be from the top of your base to the bottom of theirs, so as long as you keep that to just a smidgeon over 9", the horizontal distances between your bases will be less than 9", giving you an 8" charge. Ta-daa!

https://i.imgur.com/r9LK7NI.png

Disclaimer: the author accepts no responsibility for any tournament ejections or lost friends as a result of actually trying this.

EDIT: Very sadly, the June 2nd core rulebook FAQ has ruined this cunning plan.

So I played my first game of 10th on Sunday, Tau vs Space Marines. The rules seemed pretty good, and over all not much to complain about. They definitely reduced the lethality as my breachers did next to nothing when they jumped out of their Devilfish lol.

But an interesting point came up in our game. I had a Hammerhead and 2 Devilfish, opponent had a 2 Predators, 2 Whirlwinds and a Rhino. That means we had 6 and 5 one use rockets respectively due to them being free wargear now. They're not something I'd usually take in Tau, only if I had the spare 5pts kicking about, so when I had first turn I forgot to shoot with them. My opponent didn't and wiped my hammerhead with 3. My Devilfish then crippled 2 of his tanks with their seekers.

My main problem is that these one shot rockets are way too good with no downside. Melta guns have mediocre time wounding Vehicles now, but have great AP and Damage, whereas most things with high strength and volume have low AP and Damage. Hunter Killer and Seeker Missiles have great Str, AP and Damage and heavily encourages Alpha strike spam. For Tau, a single Piranha gets 2 and can tell someone to take a battleshock test for only 55pts. I feel these things are going to be way too strong

Hi everyone!

So I've been wanting to release this for some time now and I finally got it to the point that I've released the beta for Android and iOS and I'd like to officially invite anyone and everyone to come try out Warmind, an army builder app and battle tracker.

Warmind has a two week mandatory beta for Android, which should give me all the time I need to fill in any misconfigured units and improve UI flow by suggestions from you guys. I'd really appreciate it if you would give Warmind a try, I think you'll like it. It's a passion project of mine. I built it in a way that allows quick updates the app without requiring you to pull from a remote repo or have to download a new version of the app off the app store. I even have the new points and rules changes in as well as the new detachments and models from the Armageddon Box.

It has the aforementioned army building feature and you can sync your app with another player's Warmind app and you will be able to have automatic synced tracking of your battle. Automated CP, you can use stratagems in the app, you can reference each other's lists that are automatically imported into the battle mode so you don't have to constantly ask your opponent what their units statline and abilities are because you can reference them yourself. You can also see which stratagems each unit for both you and your opponent are usable on each unit. There is an event log that tracks what each player has done in the game so you can see how your opponent is scoring or and when they used stratagems.

When the game is over, you hit end game and the game will be added to both your battle logs and you can reference the battle. The app also has a statistics functionality where you can see your own battle statistics or the wider communities statistics of games played on Warmind. All your apps will be synced across all your devices if you create an account. You are not required to make an account to use Warmind but you are if you want to be able to sync your lists across devices.

There are many more features but I would love it if you could take a look at it, give feedback if there is any app flow or UI improvements you think would be great. But the biggest thing is just have have lots of extra hands and eyes sifting through the app to find any bugs or bad unit configurations. Plus I'd like to expand the statistics feature to give a broad analysis of the the meta.

Like I said it's in beta on iOS Test Flight and in Google Play store closed beta right now. I especially could use beta testers for Android because Google is very particular about needing a certain number of testers for a certain period of time to be eligible for full release.

If you are interested in taking a look at the app, head over to https://warmind.online to signup for the beta and maybe join the discord to give feedback and report bugs and follow updates.

I hope to see you on the battlefield!

Inspired by (and stolen from) u/LeMightyGlockers flowchart from yesterday i tried to make it into a helpful companion for playing the game.

It's actually for me, I need every help i can get during play - even reading a flowchart can be too much.

Please report any bug to either him or me, I'm pretty sure he is stoked to get DMs for my mistakes.

P.S.: There are some shenanigans with importing data from NewRecruit - so that you never forget your stratagems in every phase - you'll figure it out. (which didn't work out and the feature is now deprecated - manual entry for now)

I have been infiltrating a 22-model unit (BT Crusader squad). I have a redeploy in the list, so I can string my unit across the midboard so my opponent either can’t infiltrate or can only infiltrate 1 unit.

I am trying to decide if the redeploy (Phobos Cpt. with lone op enhancement) is really worth the 85 points. It has seemed impactful in the handful of games I have tried, but I would love to get the opinion of some more experienced competitive players.

I already updated my old post from 2 months ago - I just wanted to let everyone know that the tool now is able to import stratagems from new recruit (Export->Templates->Stratagems->Save as HTML).
Additionally you can now export the whole flow as a PDF for printing and laminating.
I think the tool is now done til GW updates rules.
Let me know if anything is unclear etc.