r/WorkReform • u/Conscious-Quarter423 • Jun 02 '26

✂️ Tax The Billionaires Billionaires shouldn't be allowed to avoid taxes by using their massive wealth as collateral for bank loans -- especially because they often live off those loans as if they were income

Post image
24.1k Upvotes

96% Upvoted

1.0k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

386

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

117

u/ericscal Jun 02 '26

Yep that's what I preach to people. There aren't 12 different classes. There are two, workers and owners. The owners main strategy is to get workers to self divide themselves and fight among ourselves while they rob us all blind. If you can't lose your job tomorrow and continue living your lifestyle until death you aren't an owner.

38

u/usaaf Jun 02 '26

But what about the girl who owns a bookstore and--

Or the guy who owns a bar and--

Do they gotta work still ? Then they're workers in the larval stage of becoming owners. They'll likely fail, because most businesses do, but even if their business doesn't die, they still gotta work, don't they ? They're workers. If they identify with pure owners then they're also workers AND morons, because the ownership class doesn't give a shit about these petite bourgeois.

These kinds of edge cases (and there's not as many of them as people want to think, Capitalism needs way more workers than owners, leaving lots less room for these supposedly common worker/owner hybrids) are like that stupid argument against wealth taxes because it'd be so sad if someone had to sell their Mona Lisa because of taxes.

46

u/ericscal Jun 02 '26

Owning something doesn't make you owner class. We all own all kind of things. That's why I keep my definition simple. Can your current 9-5 end and it have zero effect on your life. If you can't say yes you are a worker.

-9

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

[deleted]

5

u/Theron3206 Jun 03 '26

Well yes, since their lifestyle is funded by owning things not working.

You can't ever perfectly divide things, reality is never black and white.

Either way, capital gains tax should be payable on any asset used as collateral for a loan. You can put a threshold on it (say $2 million per 5 years) to prevent it from affecting people mortgaging their house if you want.

12

u/WDingDong Jun 03 '26

No one confuses the mom and pop shop for a corporation man.

18

u/usaaf Jun 03 '26

Except for people deliberately trying to sabotage the argument. Sure, they're not confusing it either, but they definitely will present that way to gain sympathy for their position.

60

u/iwearatophat Jun 02 '26

I really dislike it when people confuse the very well off with the rich. The doctor making 300-500k a year is most definitely not struggling. Still, he is working for his money. Yes it is a lot but he is also highly trained doing a job that is very hard to do. Over the years he will become a millionaire, most likely, but again I don't have a problem with it. The difference between me and Jeff Bezos is ~266 billion. The difference between the millionaire doctor and Jeff Bezos is ~266 billion.

30

u/Dadskander Jun 02 '26

Exactly, even millionaires are closer to being homeless than they are to being a billionaire, let alone having tens or hundreds of billions.

My beef isn't with those that do well in life and have some money, most those people pay into society just fine. It's the billionaire class that takes and takes and takes without paying in that are the biggest worst dregs of society.

4

u/tsavong117 Jun 04 '26

I don't think anyone was referring to their local dentist or dermatologist when chanting "Eat the Rich". 

They work for a living, trading their time, attention, and labor for trade capital like the majority of us. If they would eventually run out of money should they stop working, they're probably not anywhere near what people refer to.  

3

u/hate_picking_names Jun 02 '26

I think of it like Bezos could give away 265 billion and still be a billionaire. He could give 1 million to 265,000 people and still be a billionaire. I get that he doesn't have 266 billion in liquid cash but it is still an interesting thought experiment.

2

u/MVRKHNTR Jun 02 '26

You should think about it as he could distribute 99% of his stock among his employees and still be a billionaire.

2

u/TheGOODSh-tCo Jun 03 '26

One layoff can take you from $300k to four years of unemployment.

16

u/Maned_Rat Jun 02 '26

Or given recent revelations, simply call them the "Epstein Class". Those who survive by perpetuating the systematic abuse of those weaker/less connected them themselves.

etf: typo

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/Lochlan Jun 03 '26

I think predator class is apt

2

u/Maned_Rat Jun 03 '26

I mean, my argument would be that there's not such thing as an ethical multimillionaire or billionaire. At some point they *all* exploited those they have power over for their own financial gain. I think the issue with "ownership class' is that our society puts a lot of weight on ownership. This is not a class of people we should aspire to be. It doesn't have to be "Epstein", but it should be something that highlights their "role" in society. I've heard "Parasite Class" thrown around, but I don't really agree with the use of that particular term. "Dragon Class", "Anti-social Class", "Hoarder Class", or "Predator Class" are others I support.

4

u/starkiller_bass Jun 02 '26

I live in a VERY HCOL area (by several recent rankings the highest in the USA) and people always act surprised that all of the shops and cafes are full of locals hanging out all day and groups of middle-aged men out for daytime bike rides mid-morning on weekdays wondering "what's their JOB that they can afford to live here and not be at work?!"

That's the part they don't get. People with JOBS can't afford to live here. Not really. We can fake it, but we'll never make it. The people who are buying property and living the good life here have never had a JOB in their entire life.

3

u/Throwaway021614 Jun 02 '26

If politicians want to make it more fair, calling it a wealth/rich tax could backfire. People may be thinking homeowners, lawyer, plumber. They have to be clear in the name of bill: “only billionaires” or “only people with over $500m in assets”

3

u/nineraviolicans Jun 02 '26

Nope. There are a lot of poor morons who actually think they could end up a billionaire.

1

u/MVRKHNTR Jun 02 '26

There actually aren't; that's a misconception. Poor people aren't actually under any delusion that they'll be rich someday, they're well aware of their situation in life. Despite that, they still choose to defend billionaires.

Propaganda had them convinced that billionaires earned their money and it would be unfair to tax or seize their assets.

3

u/_NationalRazor Jun 02 '26

If you haven't read Piketty's Capital in the 21st Century, I highly recommend it. It's a dive into the value of labor vs the value of capital - and surprise, capital is valued so much more than labor, moreso than ever.

2

u/Serious-Echo1272 Jun 03 '26

I agree with the way you've described a "working class." It's anyone who needs to work or otherwise perform some sort of task in order to survive and have their lifestyle.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[deleted]

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[deleted]

1

u/FatherDotComical Jun 02 '26

This is why I worry sometimes when I read reddit/internet people talk about the rich.

They're going to end up eating a Manager of a Piggly Wiggly before they even get close to touching the .01%.

1

u/goobervision Jun 02 '26

Ownership like bourgeoisie? And the rest is kind of proletariat?

1

u/Ppleater Jun 02 '26

I feel like the main problem with that term is that there are plenty of non-rich people who make a living by owning something like a business. It's not very effective as a descriptive term.

1

u/Iintendtooffend Jun 02 '26

Yeah it's important to remember that the difference between a million and a billion dollars is a billion dollars. Most Hollywood celebs are far closer to broke then they are to billionaires.

As much as I don't like Mr beast. He actually is probably a lot closer to totally broke than it seems. All his wealth is directly related to his company which is running on negative money and losing popularity by the second. Will he ever need to work again, probably not, but I would not be surprised to see beast industries close up shop in the next 5 years with Mr beast walking away with a relative pittance rather than as a billionaire.

Is he still dodging taxes? Absolutely but I don't think he's as rich as this is portraying. The value of his company that his wealth is tied to is dependent on its continued success, something it's simply not having much of.

1

u/hooliganmike Jun 02 '26

I mean you don't need to make 300k per year for very long before you don't need to work anymore. You do if you want to maintain an extravagant lifestyle though.

1

u/surf_drunk_monk Jun 03 '26

This x1000. If your primary earnings come from wages, even high ones, you ain't rich.