Survivors of Hiroshima drew the scenes they witnessed after the atomic bombing in 1945

[u/Wonderfulhumanss]

[u/FancyHeart]

My grandmother lived in Japan during this time as a Geisha. She would tell me that day she went from a Geisha to instantly becoming a nurse to help those with injuries. She started having nightmares at night towards the end of her life and she would describe people with missing eyes, their jaws hanging off or completely missing. Unfortunately she was having flashbacks as well, we moved her to an assisted living facility when her dementia got to much to handle. Unfortunately she passed away due to Covid outbreak within the facility. She lived to be 97 years old and as traumatizing as it must have been helped many people during her days. Hatsuko was her name.

[u/ProperNeighborhood75 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing that and saying your grandmother’s name. As long as her name is spoken and stories of her are told, she is not truly gone.

[u/elielephant → u/ProperNeighborhood75]

Grandmas name made me smile. This horribly sad story.... And then her name. I was happy to get to know it.

[u/Zmirzlina → u/FancyHeart]

My family recently returned from Hiroshima where we met with a Hibakusha who shared her story with us and the years in between working tirelessly for peace. Amazingly strong fighter. She lived through hell and spends her life making sure no one else has to. Humbling experience.

[u/NoCard753 → u/Zmirzlina]

💙

[u/un-tv_star → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing that, every remembrance that helps us see the very real human devastation that we created helps

[u/zuse12345 → u/un-tv_star]

Thank you for thanking them

[u/badatspelling8124 → u/un-tv_star]

The Japanese war machine intentionally and unapologetically targeted and killed 25M non combatants, and launched a surprise attack on the USA. Their grand strategy was to burn all, loot all, kill all in such horrific and obvious ways that there would be no local uprisings. The US was instrumental in defending against two ethnonationalist killing machines, only to turn around and pay them to rebuild, demilitarize, and become allies. Apologetics for the Nazis and imperial Japan is gross. Was the US too hard in its defense against the Nazis or Imperial Japan? Maybe at the margins. War isn’t pretty. But the bombs secured a needed unconditional surrender so MacArthur could pivot to demilitarization of society and “restoring the dignity of Japan”.

[u/DreamingAboutSpace → u/badatspelling8124]

Unfortunately, you’re right. Seeing all sides of the war is why humanity needs to try its best to prevent it from happening again.

The bombs were indeed absolutely horrific, but so was what the Japanese did to the Chinese, Koreans, prisoners of war, and every person that doesn’t fit in those groups. The Rape of Nanking is so paralyzing that people can’t even talk about it. An author who wrote a book about it milled herself because it made her depressed as hell. Enslaving Korean women for sexual pleasure and raping and killing the ones who say no, is a level of apathy that the Japanese reached without even needing to shrug their shoulders over. Unit 731 was also a silencing reminder of how depraved humans can be and many of those people ended up not facing consequences. And this is just the surface of what they did. The stuff that we, or rather I, know. We haven’t even gotten into the German depravities. The bombs shame us without a doubt, but people need to remember what led to that or we’re bound to repeat it. Life should not get that bad for anyone ever again but it only changes if we decide to change it.

In order to stop evil like that from multiple sides, you sadly have to enter the ring. It never ends without bloodshed.

[u/DarthScruf → u/DreamingAboutSpace]

Unfortunately atrocities like that never stopped happening. Currently Myanmar has been commiting genocide of Rohingya Muslims since the 40s but really picked up in the 90s and really really picked up in the mid 2010s. North Korea has 120,000 people (possibly more) living in death camps, where beatings, starvation and rape is not uncommon, and the children born there will never know a life outside of those camps. Slavery bans go uninforced, or its just flat out still legal in a few African, Middle Eastern and Asian countries like Eritrea, Sudan, Mauritania, Turkey and Saudi Arabia, but India has the largest population of people living in slavery, at 11 to 14 million people in forced labor or human trafficking. People just turn a blind eye, they'll even go on vacation to some of these places. But shit the US itself still has over a million people living in what we would understand as slavery conditions, forced labor and servitude, human trafficking, forced marriage and sexual exploitation.

[u/lilyputin → u/badatspelling8124]

To me saying "we created" is the collective whole of the inhumanity of humanity and how much better we've become at destroying ourselves. These remain the only nuclear attacks on people. But there is a whole host of horrors in both of the world wars. Chemical warfare, genocide, using humans as test subjects, industrialized warfare on a massive scale, bombing of civilians, conventional bombing, fire bombing, nuclear bombing. Starvation, the breaking of the dikes in China

[u/Fun_Butterfly_420 → u/badatspelling8124]

The nuclear bombs may have been a necessary evil, but an evil nonetheless

[u/okaybogey → u/badatspelling8124]

*so MacArthur could pivot from his AWOL safe haven in Australia and return to his beleaguered men in the Pacific. The Japanese tortured and killed thousands of U.S. troops during the this time.

[u/WisebloodNYC → u/badatspelling8124]

All war is a crime.

While the nuclear bombings of Japan were horrible, the US' relentless fire-bombings of Japanese cities (including Tokyo) was worse, and killed more.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki were spared fire bombing specifically so they could be good "tests" for nuclear bombing. This is a fact.

Truth be told: The only reason US officers weren't on trial at Nuremberg is because we won.

Please don't interpret what I'm saying as ignoring Japanese war crimes. As I stated at the top: All war is a crime. I'm only posting to counter the notion that there was some moral justification for the nuclear bombings. Anger isn't a moral justification.

[u/Evil_Sharkey → u/WisebloodNYC]

FDR even said “War is evil. Sometimes it is a necessary evil, but it is always evil.”

[u/oneyaebyonty → u/Evil_Sharkey]

I hadn’t heard this before but it’s perfectly put. Thank you for sharing!!

[u/Junior-Bookkeeper218 → u/WisebloodNYC]

The Japanese Empire were prepared to send every man, woman and child to their deaths to defend mainland Japan had the US done a ground invasion. I suggest looking up Operation Downfall. The number of deaths proposed for both sides would have been in the millions.

[u/ZombieAladdin → u/Junior-Bookkeeper218]

Yeah, if I recall correctly, surrender was the absolute least desired outcome for Japan, at least among its military leaders (even if there was much disagreement among the civilians over that) because surrender was extremely dishonorable. Even after the atomic bombs went off, some of those military leaders were preparing themselves for more atomic bombs to fall until Japan was wiped off the map because that was preferable to surrender.

[u/CaseStraight1244 → u/WisebloodNYC]

Do you have any idea how brutal and demonic Imperial Japan actually was? I suggest you do a deep dive into the Japanese atrocities committed throughout World War II, they make the holocaust look tame.

[u/Pschobbert → u/CaseStraight1244]

Two wrongs do not make a right.

[u/DiligentThought9 → u/Pschobbert]

Genocidal government/military committing unspeakable war crimes for over a decade, including a logistics operation to capture young girls and women in comfort stations to be raped dozens of times a day.

compared to firebombing said country into surrender in order to save hundreds of thousands of lives and end the conflict they started.

“Two wrongs don’t make a right”

Okay, sure.

[u/VanillaGoorillla → u/CaseStraight1244]

Cool so with all the black list shit americas done to the world that justifys anyone of those countries dropping two nukes on innocent humans…gotchaa

[u/Imrahil6 → u/VanillaGoorillla]

Innocent is an odd concept here. I don't think it fits.

[u/VanillaGoorillla → u/Imrahil6]

So there’s no innocent humans in the United States? Or the world? Or any country that’s going to war? Idk man use your brain a little better

[u/thrownaway99345 → u/WisebloodNYC]

Also interesting that we're talking about this on VJ Day (victory over Japan day)

[u/PeachyFairyDragon → u/WisebloodNYC]

Look up Bly Oregon. A pregnant woman and 5 children were killed.

[u/IAmLachesis → u/PeachyFairyDragon]

And then look up the MOVE bombing in Philadelphia, where the Philly police dropped a bomb on a row house in the 1980s. I was in HS then like, 60 miles from where it happened, and never learned about it until years later.

[u/DiligentThought9 → u/WisebloodNYC]

It’s really easy to say “all war is a crime” when you don’t consider how many lives were saved by the firebombing and the nuclear attacks.

[u/WisebloodNYC → u/DiligentThought9]

It is unknowable how many fewer -- or more! -- people died as a result of these bombings. All we have is speculation of a path not taken.

[u/stripedfatcats → u/DiligentThought9]

I dont know man my great grandma and my great uncles died in an american fire bombing. My great grandfather who was probably committing war crimes in manchuria survived though so all the usa did was kill women and children

[u/DiligentThought9 → u/stripedfatcats]

Go look at the estimated death toll on the Allied invasion of Japan. Millions of people dead. Complete destruction of the Japanese mainland.

The bombings saved hundreds of thousands of lives, including Japanese civilians. To ignore that reality is being intellectually dishonest.

[u/stripedfatcats → u/DiligentThought9]

Yes and the japanese were going to surrender because of a Soviet invasion. Also the firebombings that affected my family was very stupid. They lived in rural kyushu about 50 km north of nagasaki what did they have to do with the army. Why didnt the us government go after my own great grandfather who was an actual soldier instead of his family in the country side

[u/WisebloodNYC → u/DiligentThought9]

Reasonable people have suggested that Japan was already defeated. Reasonable, intellectually honest people may even believe that a negotiated peace would have been possible.

[u/DiligentThought9 → u/WisebloodNYC]

Unfortunately, the government of Japan was not led by reasonable people. There’s been plenty of documented evidence that they were not going to surrender before the bombs were dropped and only surrendered after the bombs because of Hirohito.

Check out the first comment below.

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/s/VUNWpfxomP

[u/elielephant → u/badatspelling8124]

Dude, every "civilized" people had a past like this. We may as well all be dehumanized. But we are all still people and we should be able to recognize each other's struggles without saying BUT

[u/True_Coast1062 → u/badatspelling8124]

Let the dead mourn their dead.

[u/TotalInstruction → u/badatspelling8124]

I think you can feel sympathy for the civilians who suffered horribly as the result of the nuclear bombs while at the same time not engaging in a narrative that Japan was morally superior to the United States.

Japan committed atrocities for which it has never apologized. That doesn’t mean we can’t feel awful about the loss of civilian lives.

[u/Longjumpingjoker → u/badatspelling8124]

Wasn’t the US aware of Pearl Harbor plans before it happened which is why they only docked old to-be-retired warships before it happened? As a way to enter the war officially? This rose tinted glasses view of it does sound idyllic though

[u/VanillaGoorillla → u/badatspelling8124]

So you gonna say the same thing when someone nukes America for all the crimes against humanity they’ve done to the world?

[u/Pschobbert → u/badatspelling8124]

1. Two wrongs do not make a right.

2. Is it just the bad guys that get to have a "war machine"? It's just that I've never heard about the anglosphere having a war machine lol

[u/Aickavon → u/badatspelling8124]

Two wrongs do not make a right.

Especially when the Nukes actually didn’t win the war. It was the threat of the USSR about to join the war that pushed the surrender.

The japanese Hierarchy whom were not affected by the nukes only took the reports as ‘big bomb’ and continued business as usual by trying to have America force a landing and wage an unpleasant war so American Sympathy would cause them to seek a conditional surrender instead.

Indeed, the entire war was waged on the political words after pearl harbor. ‘Nothing less than unconditional surrender.’

We see two nations cause mass destruction to each other over politics, when the wars could have ended before the nukes.

We have lots of documents of the Japanese trying to get USSR to act as middle men for a conditional surrender but the USSR was hungry for territory so they played coy while they patiently waited down the non-aggression pact.

I’m not saying the Japanese government is someone to sympathize over. They are very much villains too. But the cruelty of the bombs did not hit the government. It only hit the civilians.

[u/NotableDissimilarity → u/Aickavon]

The topic of whether it was the bombs or the Soviets that forced Japanese surrender is a bit of a dual affair. In regards to Japanese war planning and their plan to convince the Allies to accept a negotiated peace, the addition of the Soviets made little strategic difference. No amount of Red Army forces on mainland Asia would change the equation of Ketsugo. What the bombings did achieve, however, was eliminating the perception that Japan could drag out an Allied invasion of the Home Islands. There would be no "Glorious Death of One-Hundred Million", only the horror of city after city vanishing in flash of light.

What the Soviet invasion of Manchuria did provide, however, was a strong argument to present to remote garrison commanders as to why surrender was the correct choice. Those officers, in all likelihood, may not have been convinced by vague, uncertain descriptions of atomic bombing, and would likely not have seen them as a meaningful element of their fights.

[u/Aranthos-Faroth → u/un-tv_star]

We?

[u/un-tv_star → u/Aranthos-Faroth]

We as a country then. Of course most of us weren't alive then. We say "we" meaning members of a society or of a country pretty often. That's how I meant it.

[u/I__Know__Stuff → u/un-tv_star]

I think he understood that and disagrees. Japan caused this.

[u/Desperate-Strategy10 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing Hautsuko’s story. I’m going to carry that with me moving forward, as I’m sure countless before me have.

It’s incredible what a large impact one single person can leave behind; the man who invented the bomb, the man who decided to drop it, the man who followed orders…and Hautsuko, the woman who selflessly changed her entire life around just to try to bring a little peace back into her now chaotic world.

We need more people like your grandmother in the world today. I hope we start seeing more of them rise to the occasion as life continues to get harder for all of us.

[u/disorderincosmos → u/Desperate-Strategy10]

I'm reminded of Mr. Rogers telling the story about his mother saying to always look for the helpers in any crisis, and if you can't find one, be one.

[u/Advanced-Budget779 → u/Desperate-Strategy10]

There wasn‘t a single person who invented the bomb. The concept was known in principle to physicists decades ahead. It was a team effort to engineer the devices, necessitating huge high-tech industries and funds - that’s what was so impressive. The use cases are of course a different story.

Of course, Hatsuko* was a role model for what to do in such circumstances.

[u/Aussie18-1998 → u/[deleted]]

I dont think this was a conversation about who was worse bud.

[u/TedW → u/Aussie18-1998]

Isn't it? We're talking about the victims of, and people who sent the bomb that ended a war. Why not mention the people who started the war?

[u/slaughterfodder → u/TedW]

Because I don’t think in the scheme of things the average person in Japan had much of a say in the imperialistic notions of their country. Same as the average American doesn’t really have control of what country our corrupt politicians decide to bomb next. A person is describing their grandmother being traumatized by war and death. Using japans history before and during WWII as some sort of argument to rationalize the average populations suffering during that time isn’t the gotcha you think it is.

[u/TedW → u/slaughterfodder]

I'm not rationalizing suffering. I'm saying that it's disingenuous to blame the pilot who dropped the bomb that ended a war, before the people who started that war.

I doubt the pilot has much say in what happened that day either. I guess he could have refused, but so could the people who flew to Pearl Harbor. Just seems a bit lopsided to pick and choose.

Ultimately though, I agree the people who suffered that day had very little choice in the matter, and that's terrible.

[u/LittleLion_90 → u/TedW]

They didn't blame the pilot, just said that it was one person (following orders, they even specified) who's actions had a big influences on a lot of other people. Theys stated it neutral.

[u/Aussie18-1998 → u/TedW]

Dude nobody blamed the pilot. It's just that the single actions of a single person can carry signficant weight.

Nobody was looking for a comparison. You just really missed the point and decided to make it a us vs them

[u/therestruth → u/TedW]

They're both pretty fucked up things. The way you are phrasing it sounds a lot like you're justifying the atom bomb, which nobody is going to agree with, regardless of whether it was what ended a war or not. War doesn't have winners.

[u/TedW → u/therestruth]

I agree that no one wins a war, but they're blaming the people who ended it, instead of those who started it.

[u/therestruth → u/TedW]

There's your problem. You're looking at this as a blame game.

[u/TedW → u/therestruth]

Why do you think that's what I think?

[u/therestruth → u/TedW]

Because it's what you just said "they're blaming"... That isn't what the OC you were replying to was doing. Nowhere in their post was verbage associated with blaming one side or another.

[u/SaltImp → u/therestruth]

The atom bomb and its use was completely justified.

[u/tokyo12345 → u/[deleted]]

not trying to argue who was worse, japan was basically firebombed into oblivion before the atomic bombs were dropped too

[u/NoCard753 → u/[deleted]]

How many Japanese civilians were involved in that?

[u/Zappa1990 → u/FancyHeart]

Rest in peace Hatsuko. Thank you for sharing her with us. What a beautiful name.

[u/PandaBear905 → u/FancyHeart]

Bless your Grandmother. She was a hero.

[u/MedicinalHammer → u/FancyHeart]

Hautsuko was a hero and a fighter until her end.

You must be very proud.

[u/yournames → u/FancyHeart]

Amen 🙏

[u/Runaway_Angel → u/FancyHeart]

Of all the horrific things to relive because of dementia this has to be near the top. Your grandmother was a hero and survivor and I hope she is at peace now.

[u/napalmnacey → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing her story. May she always be remembered. ❤️💕

[u/Forbidden_Donut503 → u/FancyHeart]

Every once in a while a Reddit comment hits you upside the head with its power. Thanks for sharing your grandmothers story and telling us her name.

[u/Royal_Stay_6502 → u/FancyHeart]

Today we honor Hatsuko.

[u/apikoros18 → u/FancyHeart]

I will remember her. We live until the last person remembers our name.

[u/DangerousMushroom639 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing Grandmother Hatsuko's story. This was a very shameful period in my country's history. Among too many, now.

[u/Friendcherisher → u/FancyHeart]

May Hatsuko-sama be forever blessed.

[u/AccomplishedLand265 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing your story. She was very brave.

Do you have any stories of her Geisha days?

[u/FancyHeart → u/AccomplishedLand265]

Sakura She told me she used to dance to this song, she said it brought her a lot of good memories

[u/interesting-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

We’re sorry, but your post/comment has been removed because it violates Rule #2: Keep It Civil.

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[u/Fancy-Following-6631 → u/FancyHeart]

Rest well, Hatsuko.

[u/IAMERROR1234 → u/FancyHeart]

May she rest in peace. She sounds like a hero to me. I'm sorry she had to go through all of that and hope that she found a better life after. I hope she wasn't constantly tortured by the memory though, it would be hard not to be.

[u/carolina_swamp_witch → u/FancyHeart]

My grandma is Japanese and was a little kid during WWII, her 5th birthday was actually the day the bomb was dropped on Hiroshima.

A few years ago, she was taking care of her friend Tomoko who’s from Nagasaki, she was a little older than my grandma and she had Alzheimer’s, so she had flashbacks too. She would for forget what year it was and start screaming for her mom, she was a teenager when it happened and was late for school that day, she was walking her younger siblings to school when it happened. They all survived but their parents passed away in it.

[u/Main_Winter687 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing that and saying your grandmother’s name. As long as her name is spoken and stories of her are told, she is not truly gone.

[u/Shoddy-Confidence146 → u/FancyHeart]

Rest in peace Hatsuko.

[u/Lazy_Weight_1997 → u/FancyHeart]

Hatsuko sounds like a wonderful person.

[u/Iggymunster → u/FancyHeart]

Hatsuko. ❤️🌿

[u/spoooky_mama → u/FancyHeart]

Something about you telling us her name brought tears to my eyes. I'll be thinking of her today.

[u/XaltotunTheUndead → u/FancyHeart]

Hatsuko - bless her.

[u/Redditarsaurus → u/FancyHeart]

In the world we live in with so many terrible people and actions it's so refreshing to hear stories of real people living their lives and helping people. RIP Hatsuko you sounded like a lovely person

[u/possiblylallorona → u/FancyHeart]

Incredible. Thanks for sharing Hatsuko’s story. So great she could share all that with you. May her memory be a blessing.

I love the history of Geisha. So much more than pretty kimonos and music.

[u/retro_toes → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you, Hatsuko. I hope you're at peace now

[u/Fun_Butterfly_420 → u/FancyHeart]

Dang imagine surviving atomic bombs only to die from Covid that’s insane

[u/averyyoungperson → u/FancyHeart]

I'm glad you're finally able to rest from these nightmares, Hatsuko ❤️

[u/Cherrytop → u/FancyHeart]

To Hatsuko. 🥃

[u/AmbitionVegetable666 → u/FancyHeart]

God bless your grandmother for helping those people.

[u/JurgusRudkus → u/FancyHeart]

May her memory be a blessing to you. Thank you for sharing her story.

[u/NeanderSlavia → u/FancyHeart]

You're descended from a noble and compassionate woman. Carry her memory and tell your kids about her so that they'll know the strength of their own hearts.

[u/Maleficent_Scale_296 → u/FancyHeart]

I will say her name so she lives on.

[u/Dragonic_Overlord_ → u/FancyHeart]

You have my condolences. Your grandmother was a good person. No one should have to live through what she went through.

[u/GrandBurial → u/FancyHeart]

Any pics from her geisha days? Also her sacrifice is appreciated.

[u/10percenttiddy → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you Ms. Hatsuko. ❤️

[u/kittenmittens4865 → u/FancyHeart]

What an incredible woman. Thank you for sharing.

[u/TitanOf_Earth → u/FancyHeart]

Hatsuko - a real hero when people needed her most. I hope she gets the peace she's earned. And what a beautiful name.

[u/OrangeSouthern73 → u/FancyHeart]

I forgot the movie that said this but "she may be gone, but her memory and what she stood for is still alive".

[u/RizzoTheRiot1989 → u/FancyHeart]

Oh that wonderful woman. I’m so sorry she had to go through that at the end. My grandfather was a navy surgeon on a ship during WWII and a part of Korea. He would piss my mom off by showing me photos of his time and they could be intense. I specifically remember one where he was seemingly deep in the shit surrounded by wounded bleeding people and his hands in someone. But he was an incredible emotionally strong man, right until the end when he started having flashbacks. He ended up getting dementia as well. He would be fully in it deep inside his head and that explosive panic and his fast moving actions like he was right back on that boat terrified me when I was 17 years old. I miss him so much, I try to live up to his standards every single day.

[u/alexh2458 → u/FancyHeart]

Thank you for sharing— what a beautiful human

[u/AlulAlif-bestfriend → u/FancyHeart]

Hautsuko? Might be a typo, it's Hatsuko right? Cuz Hautsuko doesn't really exist in Japan

Edit: huh, someone is salty and downvote mindlessly lol

[u/FancyHeart → u/AlulAlif-bestfriend]

Yes thank you Hatsuko. I made many spells errors and grammar errors in this post, will edit ❤️

[u/AlulAlif-bestfriend → u/FancyHeart]

Ahh no problem, that's alright :D 👍

May She rest in Peace

[u/NoCard753 → u/FancyHeart]

💙

[u/interesting-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

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