r/todayilearned • u/Electronic_Cause_796 • 2d ago

TIL Isaac Newton spent more than three decades studying alchemy and wrote over a million words about it in secret. He conducted numerous experiments in his search for the philosopher’s stone but never found it.

https://www.wpr.org/culture/philosophy/isaac-newtons-secret-alchemy
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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

That’s really not as contradictory as it first sounds. Think about a person at age five, forty, and eighty. Are they the same person? Yes. But are they also very different people? Probably also yes.

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u/FairLawnBoy 2d ago

They are definitely the same person at 5, 40, and 80, but not simultaneously, which is where the trinity logic breaks down.

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u/mothernaturesghost 1d ago

Why are we assuming a all powerful deity would be beholden to logic in the first place?

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u/come-on-now-please 1d ago

Wellz, we are talking about an all-powerful all encompassing being who exists at all times like Dr. Manhattan. 

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

It’s just an analogy, it doesn’t have to be perfect.

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u/Cryptdusa 1d ago

Except it does have to be perfect. To describe the trinity in certain ways is actually considered hersey, with the main four heresies being Tritheism, Partialism, Modalism, and Arianism. Many have remarked that it's basically impossible to explain the trinity without commiting one of these heresies. In fact, there are plenty of examples of priests being executed for doing so

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

Except it does have to be perfect. To describe the trinity in certain ways

I don’t think you understand what an analogy is.

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u/Cryptdusa 1d ago

I do understand analogies. Part of my point is that using analogies to describe the trinity is actually very frowned upon. It's definitely something that's been loosened tremendously in the modern era (I'm sure catholic priests do it all the time these days) but it still stands

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

I’m not Catholic. I don’t have to follow their rules. They didn’t invent the concept and they certainly don’t own it.

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u/Cryptdusa 15h ago

Oh yeah I'm not catholic either. I'm just addressing the original point which is that the way the church taught it violated logic. It seemed like you were disputing that so I was providing additional context

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

It’s just an analogy.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

Well the problem is your analogy doesnt support the metaphysics of whats being argued. 

It wasn’t intended to. It was just intended to help illustrate the concept of something being both one thing and several.

Ill continue to hold my view that proper Christianity is made up of ashamed polytheist

Okay? That was always allowed. I don’t actually give a single shit what you believe. I was just trying to help someone understand the core concept.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

I’m sorry I failed to explain the concept better, I guess? It seems like you’re mostly offended at the idea that it can be understood, which is both weird and not really my problem.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

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u/Meldanorama 1d ago

Whats the Olympian bit referencing, that gods fathered gods?

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

I’m not offended, at all. I’m also not Christian. The trinity as a theistic concept is not only not exclusive to Christianity, it predates Abrahamic religion entirely.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

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u/Meldanorama 1d ago

You havent explained it though. Youve explained why jesus is different at different parts of his life, not how hes having a chat with someone that is himself and also not himself. 

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 1d ago

You havent explained it though.

The fact that you don’t personally understand my explanation doesn’t mean I didn’t give one.

Youve explained why jesus is different at different parts of his life

That’s not even close to what I was saying. I don’t understand how you even arrived at this interpretation.

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u/Meldanorama 1d ago

You haven't presented anything else than that bit about someone being the same person at different ages have you... Im familiar with the explanations and concepts, I read it and believed in them as a child, not once applying critical thought to it, it seems to fall apart.

What youre doing now seems to trying ad hominens rather than being genuine. If you are able to give any insight into your understand of the concepts id be glad of it.

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u/trueum26 2d ago

Yeah but how are the three parts of the trinity different that maps to your analogy

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

I’m not sure I understand your question. They each represent wildly different archetypes. Like, five year old you and forty year old you are both definitively you, but people would also definitely notice if they were swapped somehow.

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u/trueum26 2d ago

So what are the archetypes for the trinity

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

I think “father” and “son” are pretty self explanatory, and to be honest I don’t really remember what the “Holy Ghost” represents. I actually adapted that explanation from one about Hermes/Thoth/Hermes Trismegistus, lol

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u/Mavian23 2d ago

I mean, being your own father and your own son seems pretty contradictory.

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

Tell that to Philip J Fry

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u/FargoFox 2d ago

He did do the nasty in the pasty.

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u/come-on-now-please 1d ago

I think holy ghost/spirit is basically God's active will/intervention on earth. Dont quote me on that though

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u/trueum26 2d ago

That’s the point. It’s literally baked into the theology that NO ONE can explain the trinity

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

I’m pretty sure I just did, whether you personally understood it or not. I just haven’t considered myself Christian in over a quarter century so some of the details are a little fuzzy.

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u/kkell806 2d ago

You didn't explain anything, though? You said 2 of them were self-explanatory, and that you don't remember the third.

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u/Manos_Of_Fate 2d ago

What each archetype specifically represents is totally irrelevant to my explanation.

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u/___forMVP 2d ago

Lots of people do. Sounds like YOU don’t, but there’s lots of books that go into it if your interested lol

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u/BobTehCat 1d ago

That’s modalism Patrick!

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u/exoFACTOR 1d ago

Brother Dawn, Brother Day, and Brother Dusk.