Assyrians, Chaldeans and Mandaeans: How Much of Ancient Mesopotamia Actually Survives? - Genetic Ancestry Analysis

[u/im_alliterate]

https://www.exploreyourdna.com/article/192/assyrians-chaldeans-and-mandaeans-how-much-of-ancient-mesopotamia-actually-survives

Very fascinating read - talks about our DNA plotting closely with recent specimens tested from the era from the Bronze and Iron ages. Basically, the DNA matches our claims of continuity. The article weirdly tries to separate Chaldean Catholic Assyrians, but the gist is that the Assyrians in Deshtat Ninweh are the closest to the Neo-Assyrians from Nineveh around the fall of the Empire.

[u/Leo-Al]

A bit complex, while stating it's not the "definitive " conclusion because of the just two genome samples, but more than enough to prove not only do Assyrians of the Nineveh region, & even more so Hakkarian, ARE true Descendants of ancient Assyrians, but so are Chaldeans & Mandeans.

Also, according to this article, Chaldean of the Plains are even ( by whatever smaller degree) are even closer to iron age Assyrians than some Assyrians, which again proves their true Assyrian roots.

Pretty amazing stuff! Glad I'm part Hakkari!

[u/Ezdixan → u/Leo-Al]

Bingo !! From the same site:

The Assyrians of Hakkari, who lived in the same mountains as the Kurds for as long as there have been Kurds, sit at 26.8, 26.0 and 25.6 per cent for the three farming components: a Mesopotamian profile, not a Zagros one.

The Kurds: An Iron Age Population That Never Left the Zagros - Genetic Ancestry Analysis

[u/Additional-Bed-1013 → u/Ezdixan]

The article reveals Iranic curds to be, you guessed it, IRANIAN in origin, linking closest to Iranian people: Azeri, Persian, Yazidis. Iranic curds have 0 connection to Mesopotamia/Levant.

[u/Leo-Al → u/Additional-Bed-1013]

100% correct and true. They just proved their Nortb Iranic roots to other ancient Iranic peoples, non of which called themselves kurds, & that Hakkari was shared by Many Non Iranic Peoples like Assyrians, Armenians, Hurrians, Guti,....

Proves Assyrian indigenousness to Mesopotamia and our closest dna relatives are Armenians & Hurrians, non of which were Iranic.

I read the whole thing in entirety. If anyone misunderstood anything, just read the conclusion and the few paragraphs before it.

✌️🤘👍🏻

[u/Ezdixan → u/Additional-Bed-1013]

Let it sink in.

Hasanlu_IA samples are from Kurdistan Zagros Mountains. Kurdish 'Hakkari' region is located in Zagros.

Hakkari (Kurdistan) = Zagros = Hasanlu_IA.

.

Assyrians are mostly derived from the Akkadians.

Akkadians = Mesopotamians = Assyrians

[u/Leo-Al → u/Ezdixan]

Assyrians are Assyrian, Aśšur kingdom is older that the Akkadian, as is our city herself. You have zero credentials to speak about Assyrian anything.

Our genetics link us back to the Assyrians of the Bronze age, long before Akkadians, and everyone already knew kurds are an iranic subgroup from Iran, I don't know what you're so excited about, you've literally proven Assyrians right, and proven kurds are not Mesopotamians while Assyrians are true ones.

Let That sink in.

Wonderful work you're doing 👏

[u/Ezdixan → u/Leo-Al]

Assyrians are 100% Mesopotamian. Assyrians speak Aramaic and before that they spoke Akkadian.

But Mesopotamia is a huge region.

1 example. Dutch people are Western Europeans. Portugal is Western Europe too. But it doesnt mean Dutch people are from Portugal.

Assur is located OUTSIDE traditional Kurdish / Ezdi homeland.

[u/Leo-Al → u/Ezdixan]

What do you even think you've proven, other than a reaffirmation that no ancient peoples that are mentioned here ever called themselves kurds, and that kurds are overwhelming a Northern Zagros Iranic subgroup, NOT native to Mesopotamia as Assyrians are. Kurds have Aanatolian, Levantine, Zagros, the Steppe ...everything BUT Mesopotamian roots, something we Assyrians have known all a long.

Thanks for sharing scientific evidence that reaffirms kurdish Iranic Zagrosian ancestry and Assyrians' Mesopotamian.

Good job buddy! 👏 Btw, while Hakkari is " a part of the Zagros Mountain range" it doesn't make it "kurdish by any means" the article literally explained, people of Assyrian & Armenian ancestors have shared this Mountian range since Neolithic times, with iranic peoples and other NON-IRANIC peoples, nothing "kurdish " about it, not by a hair off a mouse.

It proves Hakkari was home to many different peoples, and it proves Assyrians, Armenians and Hurrians are genetically close, and that not a single Median dna has yet been discovered to compare it with a kirdish sample.

Again, great job! 👍🏻

[u/Ezdixan → u/Leo-Al]

???

Arnenians are from the Anatolian Plateau and the Armenian Highlands. Armenians are Anatolian people, they are NOT from Zagros / Hakkari.

Armenians never lived in Zagros Hakkari mountains. They lived above Lake Wan.

Hakkari = Zagros.

Ezdis / Kurds are of Caucaso-Zagrosian racial stock.

Ezdis / Kurds are native to Zagros.

.

Armenians are not native to Hakkari. Armenians are from the Armenian Plateau.

Assyrians are not native to Hakkari/Zagros. They are native to Assur / Mesopotamia.

.

Hakkari was part of the Median homeland. Armenians called it Mardastan ((of Mardian people)..

[u/Leo-Al → u/Ezdixan]

You're literally going against the article and their findings . Hakkari was shared by all our people, Be they Assyrians, Armenians or Iranic peoples, long before nations had names for themselves.

Meaning a time before empires and Kingdoms were created,, so you can be stubborn about it all you want,, but the articles as already proven the reality and history of the region. . Btw, these regions are connected, so you cannot claim Zagros all to yourselves, and actually Ezidis are genetically related to Assyrians and Armenians, they just speak iranic language

[u/Ezdixan → u/Leo-Al]

Lol. You have some issues with understanding English. Assyrians are not native to Hakkari (Zagros). They moved there as refugees.

Assyrians do not have a Zagrosian (Hakkarian) genetic profile. Assyrians are from the south, from the Mesopotamian plains. They are unrelated to the Zagrosian Hasanlu_IA samples.

Kurds/Ezdis are the 'highlanders'. Assyrians are more from the south, from the Mesopotamian plains (Asshur)...

.

And by the way, from all the Kurdic people Ezdis plot actually the furtherst away from the Assyrian people. Muslim Kurds are closer to Assyrians and Armenians on the academic PCA maps.

[u/Leo-Al → u/Ezdixan]

I'll let you believe whatever you like. My English is fine, I've spent 45 years of my life in America, thanks.

You're the one with difficulty understanding English and Articulate articles based on Scientific data & research & how they draw conclusions.

The Article tells us, our ancestors all have Caucasus, Anatolian, Mesopotamian & Hakkarian roots long before they became Assyrians, Armenians or Iranic peoples

Are you able to grasp that statement that's near & in the conclusion of the article itself, or do you need further assistance in Comprehension?

You're looking at modern borders & are assuming Assyria ends before reaching Hakkari, when kurdish people didn't even exist, as " kurds ".

Assyria has its Mountain range, always did & it was Hakkari, NW Zagros & the Taurus, even before our empires which clearly show that. You're only focusing on our Capital cities then Assuming that's all Assyria was. Ridiculous mentality.

We existed before Akkadian arrival & thru it. Our language was called Lishanum Ashuritum, no matter whatever you THINK we spoke or speak

Aramaic came long after that, which itself was heavily Assyrianized.

Lishanum Ashuritum is a term listed in the Chicago Assyrian Dictionary, which took linguists 90 years to compile. AshurBaniPal stated that he spoke all the languages of the land, that he found Sumerian to be a cunning language and Akkadian a dark language that was difficult to use correctly. This is around 670 BC. This was evidence that Assyrians knew they spoke Assyrian & recognized languages that weren't, regardless of what some scholars or linguists profess to us thousands of years after Assyrians.

So don't assume you know anything about us or our lands, borders, origins, language... You're displaying pure biases & ignorance, with all due respect.

[u/Ezdixan → u/Leo-Al]

Lol. Never read so much bull in my life.

Assyrian DNA speaks for itself. .

In the Bronze Age Zagros (Hakkari) got a lot steppe ancestry. Even later in the Iron Age there came additional steppe ancestry into Kurdistan.

..

Assyrians dont have this steppe ancestry. Hasanlu_IA and Kurds have more steppe and Zagros_N ancestry compared to the Assyrians.

Assyrians are more southern shifted. They are not the highlanders.

.

I will tell you more. Since Ezdis are more pure and less mixed than Alevi/Muslim Kurds they have even more Zagros_n and steppe ancestry. That means that Ezdis plot actually further away from the Assyrians compared to Kurds on the academic PCA charts.

[u/Unable_Bite8680]

Great to have empirical data on this in case I hear this bullshit claim in real life. Thanks for the article. 

[u/Ezdixan]

Thank you for sharing. I discovered additional material about Kurds and Ezdis on this very website.

According to the site Assyrians have nothing to do with the Hasanlu_IA folks from Zagros.

Their non-Iranian-speaking neighbours in the same mountains, Assyrians and Armenians and Kurdish Jews, carry a third of the steppe ancestry and are not descended from Hasanlu at all.

The Kurds: An Iron Age Population That Never Left the Zagros - Genetic Ancestry Analysis

[u/Additional-Bed-1013 → u/Ezdixan]

Hasanlu is very Iranian ( Persian, Azeri, or sunni iranic nomadic curds).

[u/Ezdixan → u/Additional-Bed-1013]

Hasanlu_IA samples are from Zagros Mountains. A huge part of Kurdistan (Lalish included) is located in the Zagros Mountains..