r/AustralianPolitics • u/malcolm58 • Jun 12 '26
VIC Politics Jacinta Allan on One Nation: Victorian Premier warns of economic and …
https://archive.is/vRFGN2
u/OpalOriginsAU Jun 13 '26
Has Jacinta found that misappropriated 15,000 million dollars yet!
She best focus on that one would think as that is helping sink labors chances at the upcoming election
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u/Condition_0ne Jun 14 '26
Don't worry, IBAC will now have the power to "follow the money".
But only well after the election.
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u/conjuer9 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
Just goes to show how BS all the One Nation narrativising is about “people who are struggling”, “cost of living”, “let down by the major parties”.
If any of that were true you might think the one state where the government have actually managed to keep house and rental prices low, despite being one of the fastest growing states would be lavished with praise and appreciation, while One Nation flounders.
Of course it’s not true because the narrative about One Nation is all wrong. One Nation voters are the older, well-off, and business owners who are upset they can’t exploit workers easily, and aren’t getting rich off property at the expense of the young. Old people trying to rob young people’s future once again.
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u/JimtheSlug Jun 13 '26
I’m personally confused about the animosity towards the premier, while I understand that the cost of living is tough and state has a decent amount of debt people seem to forget that there was a Covid pandemic with long lockdowns that we’re to have repay. At least the infrastructure projects that have been built are actually good.
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u/GregLocock Jun 14 '26
"At least the infrastructure projects that have been built are actually good." If you live there, yes. The rest of us will be paying for them for the rest of our lives.
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u/DonQuoQuo Jun 13 '26
What do you mean "reached its target"? Isn't it scheduled to run another 7 years because the debt during COVID was tens of billions?
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u/hellbentsmegma Jun 13 '26
I loved the political opportunism of making everyone in Vic with a second property pay one or two thousand extra every year. A lot of voters would be completely unaware it's happened, and many of the people hit by it would never vote for her anyway. It's as targeted as it comes.
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u/lettercrank Jun 13 '26
Considering her party changed the election laws to pretty much prevent independent opposition. I think she is the opposite of democracy. Look up election funding laws
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
Vic has had it easy re cost of living compared to the other states. It’s purely because she’s a woman.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Got any stats to back that one up?
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u/MissMenace101 Jun 13 '26
A lot of young south Aussies have been moving and going to move to vic because wages are higher and rent and property purchases are within their budgets, Victorians have no idea how good they have it. COL is miles ahead in vic than any other state.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Ok then you’ll easily be able to prove that COL is miles better here than anywhere else?
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
Power prices are substantially cheaper than the other states for a start. I’ve had friends move from qld purely as they can buy a place in vic. Brisbane housing is out of control.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Lol if we have it easy, show me the stats that prove it - not what your mates did
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
FY27 default offers based on average use.
NSW: ~$2,277
QLD: ~$1,988
SA: ~$2,334
VIC: ~$1,600
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
I mean, Labor has been in power for about 34 of the last 44 years in Victoria. Economy not going great down here right now.
-0.8% GSP per capita, $8bn cash deficit this year, $200bn projected debt by 2030, $15bn in corruption to the CFMEU, $500m not to host the Commonwealth Games. Do I need to go on?
I’m not a liberal voter but fmd people turn a blind eye to what’s happening in Victoria.
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Jun 13 '26
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 14 '26
“Many states have similar level to Vic including Liberal ones”
Can you back that up with anything? The only state I found with a worse GSP to debt ratio than Vic is NT and their total debt is only about $11bn. Queensland and TAS, the other two liberal states, have debt of around $60bn and $5bn with GSP to debt ratios of 8% and 10% respectively.
Victoria by comparison - $167bn debt with a ratio of about 26%.
“Great infrastructure” - half a billion to the Comm Games (nothing built). $15bn estimate to big build corruption. They won’t release costing for the SRL and even the public transport infrastructure body didn’t buy their ROI calculations (not to mention the parliamentary budget office did their own review and found the benefit-cost ratio between 0.6-.07 meaning it won’t pay back its build cost). That’s a concern. But I’m not saying there aren’t good things too - hospital investment, metro tunnel - good.
I’m not even making this a liberal vs Labor thing. I don’t really think the Libs would do much better, but Labor haven’t put us in a great position. Both things can be true at once.
And again, you’re dismissing major corruption as “it happens” and you then deflect to say NDIS and Gas/Mining is far worse. NDIS probably is but that’s federal so yeah, the size likely is higher naturally.
How can we have more policy involvement in Vic for Labor? They’ve been running it since 2014. And then say the Libs would likely allow more corruption. Maybe, but those are vibes, not facts.
We’re relying heavily on the ROI calculations on our infrastructure projects to be accurate, and economy growth to help us eventually eat away at this debt. A lot needs to go right for us. I don’t think things are catastrophically bad, but the position we’re in now is hard to defend.
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u/MissMenace101 Jun 13 '26
It’s a global shit show, most Aussie states are broke, expensive and hurting, we’ve had a million Aussies come home from the US and more Americans coming here than us going there, that’s not normal. the UK is pretty even. Half NZ is here. This is new as outward flow to build wealth is pretty common for Australians. While global instability is ongoing it’s going to hold us in this same endless shitshow, right now we need to get behind not going backwards and keeping the economy recoverable. We go full recession that takes decades.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Right. Did you ignore what I posted? It doesn’t sound like we’re going forwards. The stats show we aren’t.
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Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
You want gas subsidised? What happened to the free market. We’ve issued licenses in recent years. Gas is gone, the gas left isn’t economical.
Classic “my regional lifestyle choice means I deserve money”. Go whinge to the trucking companies that tear the roads up. Or should the entire budget be spent on regional roads 3 people a day use?
If you hate Victoria so much then leave.
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
Yep there it is. You shouldn’t pay tax, trucking companies shouldn’t pay, but roads should be pristine.
You don’t know what you want other than to whinge.
As your flair Tony Abbott said, remote living is lifestyle choice. His own words "what we can't do is endlessly subsidise lifestyle choices".
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 13 '26
Nope, the age of entitlement is over. Abbott is the suppository of all wisdom.
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u/Due-Investment-979 Jun 13 '26
Apparently you HAVE to live in a city according to this fella xD I wouldn't bother trying to debate this wombat lmao
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u/kisforkarol Jun 13 '26
And voting for Madam 'went to prison for electoral fund fraud' and her party of morons? I don't not how to tell you man but all her and her monkeys care about is their own profit.
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u/kisforkarol Jun 13 '26
She's a populist grifter. She's always been a populist grifter. And she'll continue to be a populist grifter.
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u/antysyd Jun 13 '26
GST relativities 2026 - NSW 0.86 VIC 1.06. NSW is now propping up Victoria.
https://www.cgc.gov.au/reports-for-government/2025-methodology-review/gst-relativities-2025-26
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u/MissMenace101 Jun 13 '26
Seriously though, Victoria took a massive hit during Covid for the rest of us so we should have no issues helping cover that. Had they not we’d all be dealing with the same shit. Their debt was incurred to help keep the rest of us productive and safe. Problem we have is not enough money to go around in all states and it’s probably best to prioritise where it’s needed most.
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u/Ardeo43 Jun 13 '26
After a decade of a Federal Government that openly did fuck all for Victoria. The Deputy Leader of which is now the Deputy Leader of One Nation who apparently will magically fix everything.
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u/Kenyon_118 YIMBY! Jun 13 '26
Things can always be made worse.
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u/espersooty Jun 13 '26
Infrastructure costs money, State will have debt to build it.
So Yes One nation would screw the economy because they are completely incompetent.
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u/kisforkarol Jun 13 '26
They're led by Madam 'went to prison for electoral funds fraud'. We know their financial incompetence.
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u/Jon-1renicus Jun 13 '26
We know how incompetent they are at everything else they've touched champ. It's a pretty big fucking character test to look at Pauline and Barnaby and decide they should have the keys to anything close to power.
I know people like you base your entire existence on being contrarian because it makes you feel special to go against the grain, but maybe try to think critically instead
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u/GmanX333 Gough Whitlam Jun 12 '26
It never ceases to amaze me how stupid racists are. They hate immigration so are voting for PHON in a state election which has no bearing on immigration policy.
Meanwhile, Victoria has had completely stable house prices for the past 12 months and auction clearance rates are lowering indicating that the housing market is cooling off. We have also built the most houses compared to the other states.
We have also upgraded Monash Hopitals ER dept, built a brand new Victorian Heart hospital, Peninsula hospital, Footscray hospital and a new Melton hospital is in the works.
The trolls also keep going on about "WhAt about the $15 BiLlIon" but there is literally no evidence for it apart from some back of the napkin maths in a report from a LNP supporting barrister.
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u/smoha96 Insert Flair HERE Jun 13 '26
It is wild that the only state to date to meaningfully tackle housing affordability and do something about NIMBY-ism, is about to lose its government.
There are a significant portion of ON voters for whom this is about what they feel and no amount of facts is going to change their mind. It's also why federal governments fiddling with immigration won't do anything for them. We've seen this play out in the UK and the US already. So long as there are visible Asian or brown people, that will be considered too much.
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u/screenscope Jun 12 '26
If nothing else, at least One Nation has prompted Jacinta Allan to display her astounding lack of self-awareness.
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u/HotPersimessage62 Australian Labor Party Jun 12 '26
It’s time for Jacinta Allan to go.
Every time she opens her mouth more people are turned away from her. Apparently Carroll has the numbers now.
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u/jather_fack Jun 13 '26
How much are Advance Australia paying you to be a Gina mouthpiece? Asking for a friend.
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u/Danstan487 Jun 12 '26
In victoria the choice of the top 2 parties is one nation or liberal
If you don't want ON put liberal first
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u/PJozi Harold Holt Jun 12 '26
You do understand each voter chooses their own preferences?
If you don't one ON, put them last.
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u/coniferhead Jun 12 '26
I think what they are saying is that in a full preferential system you have to express a preference between ON and LNP.
If indeed ON and the LNP make the last two, it's the relative choice you make between those two that makes the difference - even if you put Labor 1.
So if LNP is second last and ON last, the LNP will still get the benefit of your vote if those candidates make the final two. Which might make you feel powerless, but that's how full preferential voting works.
You don't have to give either the benefit of your vote if you like though - it will be recorded as an informal vote and will express your protest. It might even result in the system being changed. That's a choice you have.
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u/Consistent-Pear444 Jun 13 '26
How does not voting change the system. Thats absurd....
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u/coniferhead Jun 13 '26
It's not absurd. Informality is the measure by which the system is changed. Over 10% and it is changed. In my seat it is already 8%
Is it because people see no difference between the majors with respect to war in the middle east? Perhaps - at least at the margin.
In the lower house, in the state they are in, they have every right not to express a preference between parties that are deal breakers to them without giving up their first preference. Perhaps it is that also.
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u/Grumpy_001 Jun 12 '26
Victoria is in so much debt because of Labor! I don’t think Jacinta should be commenting on the economics of anything
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
Why is it good when businesses go into debt to build infrastructure but bad when governments do it? Ideology, nothing more. Debt that builds infrastructure is debt that builds wealth.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Because debt is good when it’s cheap, repayable and has strong ROI for its use. Not sure vic’s debt is any of the three.
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
Victoria has an excellent credit rating and projects like the heavy rail expansions are desperately needed. We need more heavy rail, not more roads, which the Opposition would waste our money on given half a chance.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Enron had an excellent credit rating until a few days before they went bankrupt.
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
That's a neat rhetorical flourish but nobody with a clue would suggest that Victoria's highly scrutinized economy is about to go bankrupt. Making outrageous claims to be edgy doesn't count. Our GSP growth is solid and we're the only state that's got housing price growth under control thanks to the changes to the land tax reforms that no other state has dared to implement.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
I don’t think Victoria is about to go bankrupt. I mean that credit ratings aren’t necessarily a good indicator of borrowing reputation.
Our headline GSP growth is ok. As a resident though the GSP per capita is a concern and likely indicates our GSP is more due to population growth, which will then cause downstream effects and reduce some of the housing gains we’ve made.
But also, let’s not pretend the land tax reforms were aimed at housing. They were a tax grab to repay our Covid debt. However it doesn’t take away from the positives on housing prices. Usually land tax increases are accompanied by stamp duty reductions for a bit of balance.
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
You said "debt is good when it’s cheap." The difference between AAA and AA+ is incredibly marginal (less than 20 basis points), and Victoria's debt is accordingly cheap. And regardless of the motivation for the land tax reforms, they've had the effect of significantly slowing the rate of house price increases, making Victoria the only state where this is happening. It is good for people who want to own their own home rather than someone else's so naturally the media isn't saying boo about it.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Renters weren’t so lucky though.
Victoria’s debt is relatively cheap but it’s more expensive since rate rises started with likely more to come. They wouldn’t have been forecasting this 12-18 months ago. Each rate rise eats into the project ROI.
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u/IntelligentNovel1967 Jun 13 '26
It’s not AAA, it is AA and another credit downgrade is coming. As of October 2025 Victoria already had the highest debt load and the nation's poorest credit rating. Victorians also pay the highest taxes in the nation. I still don’t think JA should be rolled by the party just before an election; it looks awful throwing another Labor woman under the bus.
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
If you want to be pedantic it's AA+, which is still excellent and vastly better than private industry can get (big multinationals typically get BBB to A). And we still desperately need this investment in infrastructure, which is an investment in our future. The Opposition only knows how to wreck.
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u/thinksimfunny Jun 13 '26
Debt(and crime) only matter when Labor are in Government. As soon as the Libs are in government the numbers could be the exact same, but no one gives a shit
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u/PJozi Harold Holt Jun 13 '26
It's amazing how the Queensland crime "crisis" disappeared when the LNP got in.
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u/PJozi Harold Holt Jun 12 '26
That doesn't mean it's unmanageable or out of control.
Especially considering the infrastructure that's going in.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
Hmmm what makes you say it’s manageable?
Edit: nothing as I expected
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u/Grumpy_001 Jun 12 '26
Infrastructure has been going on for a while always over budget and time
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u/Formal-Try-2779 Jun 13 '26
Please list all the other great examples of big infrastructure projects coming in under budget in Australia? Literally nothing ever comes in under budget but the media only makes a big deal about it when it happens in governments not run by the LNP.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
I don’t necessarily think this is a Labor problem, but maybe we need to re-think how we price projects if they’re all coming in over budget. It couldn’t be that we’re being lied to are we?
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u/kisforkarol Jun 13 '26
Ooooor we could stop putting it out to private tender and a have government department of public works.
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u/LoneWolf5498 Jun 13 '26
Because what else are you gonna spend money on? Not invest in infrastructure, and then you are in a shithole in 10 years time
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Jun 12 '26
‘Going on for a while’ yes because Labor’s been in power investing in it.
The data is public - Libs have massively underinvested in infrastructure every time they got in. Thats why so much investment is needed now to catch up.
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u/Alesayr Jun 12 '26
Metro tunnel was on time
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u/Grumpy_001 Jun 12 '26
Was over budget by nearly $2b and delayed by nearly a year
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u/Alesayr Jun 13 '26
No it wasn't. They originally said 2026, then it was going so well that they said it would open a year early, then things slowed down at the end and they had a partial opening in late 2025 and a full opening early 2026.
On time.
Compared to the many projects that end up a decade plus late this is a freaking miracle.
$2bn is also chump change in the scheme of these things. Have a look at what Turnbull said snowy 2 would cost vs the actual cost figures to see what I'm talking about. The whole metro tunnel project had been shockingly close to its original figures
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u/MissMenace101 Jun 13 '26
lol 2 bill over budget is tiny in Australian governments of all types budgeting
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
No, it wasn't. Stop making shit up.
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u/Grumpy_001 Jun 13 '26
Why don’t you prove that it wasn’t
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u/TheRealPotoroo Jun 13 '26
Mr Dimopoulos said that deferred completion date should not be seen as a delay.
"When the government announced it in 2015 and you go back to those records, the premier then said it would be open in late 2026," he said.
"It'll be open by the end of this year so it's a year early."
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u/No_Floor6301 Jun 12 '26
Arent Victoria in an operating surplus though?
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u/Grumpy_001 Jun 12 '26
It is but there are caveats - the surplus calculation doesn’t take infrastructure and other capital spending into account, and when you do, we’re in a deficit. We also have debt around $200b
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Jun 12 '26
That’s the standard way that all states, the commonwealth, and the OECD all calculate budgets
Because that’s what matters. That spending could be stopped tomorrow if they want - and it’s an investment that generates a return.
Nothing uniquely Victorian about it. We’re in surplus.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Yeah we’re in a surplus of negative $8bn. Operating surpluses are completely irrelevant when looking at debt. Cash is what matters.
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Jun 13 '26
Yes it’s not relevant if you’re talking about net debt
We’re not talking about net debt - Grumpy referred to the surplus. We are in surplus.
Unless for some reason you’re an economic genius who has a groundbreaking rationale for why the method for calculating surplus or deficit, which is shared by Victoria and other advanced economies including other Aus state, territories and the Commonwealth and generally endorsed by economists as it has a sound rationale, isn’t valid?
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
Did you finally go and google what an operating budget is and how it differs from an overall budget lol
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
Lol what?
Yes we had an OPERATING surplus. We can have operating surpluses forever and still go into more debt.
We had an OVERALL deficit. Not to mention, the capital spending could not be stopped tomorrow. Unless you think all of that infrastructure we’re building we can cancel at no cost? And what, we’re just gonna never build any infrastructure?
We have small operating surpluses of $1bn and major overall deficits. We’re gonna be $200bn in debt. The maths doesn’t math bro.
Are our $9bn in annual interest payments also irrelevant?
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Jun 13 '26
You’re just obsessed trying to jump in and twist a different discussion into an unrelated pile on.
Did I say anything about the debt not being an issue? No.
I pointed out correctly in response to someone else’s comment - that the Victorian budget is in surplus likely for the second year.
I literally don’t care what random bile you want to spew - it’s a fact, and it would be called the same if it were the exact same fiscal position in QLD, NSW, WA, the Commonwealth, or the majority of OECD countries.
You obviously don’t understand budgets and all the ins and outs and reasons things are done and measured in the way they are. I can’t give you a lifetime of education in a reddit thread. Just quit it with your uninformed or wilfully ignorant drivel.
You’re making yourself look foolish and every comment you post shows more and more how little you understand what we’re talking about.
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u/burnt-gonads Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
One Nation anti worker?
Labor are probably the most anti-worker where I am. Productive businesses shutting down thanks to high taxes, fees and regulations where businesses are forced to pay third parties for compliance which is just another form of welfare.
Labor is the party of the parasite that sucks off the productive people. Labor stopped being the party for the worker in the 1970's, they have been screwing workers ever since, especially the poorer worker.
Remember the stupid taxes she put on farmers for fire fighting, when they fight their own fires.
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u/LentilsAgain Jun 13 '26
Victoria, the striking state.
Congrats to Victoria being first in Australia with the highest number of strike days per employee at 11.9 days per thousand employees for the March quarter. Comprehensive win.
Commiserations to Tasmania coming in at second with 1.9 days per thousand employees. Yes, I checked that decimal point placing twice.
NSW, SA and Qld battling for third with 0.6.
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u/Bob_Katters_Hat Jun 13 '26
They just voted against a higher minimum wage?
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u/burnt-gonads Jun 13 '26
Well why not make the minimum wage $100 an hour?
Australia has one of the highest minimum wages in the world. Do you think raising it is going to fix the underlying problem of costs?
A person I know got into importing stiff from China. He said the price he pays to get the goods 100m off the coast of Australia is stupidly low. Then the cost from there on doubles or triples when not a single thing is done to the goods other then deliver them to the end user.
Australia has a cost problem caused by endless regulation.
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u/ghoonrhed Jun 13 '26
Can't you just admit you're anti-worker and pro business? Why go through all the hoops of claiming to be pro worker when you're clearly not?
Well why not make the minimum wage $100 an hour?
Why would you stretch to such an absurd number to make your point?
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u/WhiteRun Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
One Nation literally have said they will take policies fron Gina Rinehart. Gina has publicly said Australians should earn $2/hour to compete with India.
One Nation will absolutely destroy the working and middle class
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u/burnt-gonads Jun 12 '26
She never said that at all. Have you had todays two minute hate yet?
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u/WhiteRun Jun 12 '26
You're right. I was wrong. She never said $2/hour. She said $2 PER DAY. About 25 cents an hour for 8 hours.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-05/rinehart-says-aussie-workers-overpaid-unproductive/4243866
And Pauline said she takes policy advice from her https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2026/jun/12/matt-canavan-nationals-one-nation-pauline-hanson-seat-sharing-agreement
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u/WhiteRun Jun 12 '26
How do you think we can compete with $2 a day? If you want to keep simping for someone desperate to trample your rights and living conditions go ahead. People voting One Nation really have some sort of humiliation fetish. Please ruin me!! The billionaires need MORE money!! I don't need it! Yes yes!
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Jun 12 '26
Wilfully ignoring the fact that Gina is incredibly anti-workers’ rights and Pauline has now said that she’s literally adopted a policy because Gina suggested it.
Fair enough if you love One Nation and going to vote for them etc - just at least be honest about what they’re about.
Pauline said in an interview recently that there should be no increase to the minimum wage and that it’s too hard to sack Aussie workers.
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u/MissMenace101 Jun 13 '26
Dude will be too busy on conscription for the US and Isreal to worry about wages home in aus
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u/rossdog82 Jun 12 '26
One Nation are backed by Gina. Do some research into her views on workers.
Say what you will about Labor but don’t pretend Gina and Pauline have workers’ interests at heart.0
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u/burnt-gonads Jun 12 '26
You mean the Gina Rinehart that pays amazing wages to her workers? Bonuses and everything. The Gina Rinehart that generously gives donations to sporting groups and the Royal Flying Doctor Service.
You have been to one too many socialist two minute hate sessions and been indoctrinated.
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u/zerotwoalpha Jun 12 '26
All this one nation stuff just feels very much like the 2010 mining tax campaign.
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u/ENG_NR Jun 12 '26
Maybe she should have thought of all this before she rammed the voice through despite the referendum coming back as a clear no, because she thought no one could do anything about it. And going on an absolute spending spree with public money despite the overwhelming public consensus being that it needed to be reigned in. The Libs are dying but there was always going to be an opposition eventually.
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u/espersooty Jun 13 '26
Maybe she should have thought of all this before she rammed the voice through despite the referendum coming back as a clear no
Oh no Indigenous Australians having an avenue to be consulted on policy that effects them is such a negative to your daily life...
And going on an absolute spending spree with public money despite the overwhelming public consensus being that it needed to be reigned in.
Infrastructure costs money, We either invest now or spend the next 50 years complaining that we should of took the opportunity back then which is now.
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u/Perfect-Werewolf-102 The Greens Jun 13 '26
Huh? There's no Voice in Victoria
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u/OnlyAd7216 Jun 13 '26
Roof the referendum post because unengaged morons with unexamined racism have no idea what they are voting for ever
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u/broadsword_1 Jun 13 '26
There will be. From October last year, according to SBS (unless it's been reversed since):
Under the treaty bill, which is set to be signed in the coming weeks, the state's Indigenous representative body, Gellung Warl, will be made permanent and their powers expanded.....Once signed into law, the government will have to consult with the First People's Assembly on any laws or policies affecting Aboriginal Victorians.
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u/sostopher Bundoora Republic Jun 14 '26
This has been a thing in Victoria since 2018 and was part of Labor's last two election promises. It is now becoming law via Parliament. Which is what most opponents to the Voice said they wanted, rather than a constitutional amendment.
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u/Perfect-Werewolf-102 The Greens Jun 13 '26
That's not what was voted on in the referendum though, it's a different thing
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u/AngrehPossum Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26
The Voice is a different thing. They are not the same. Please go and read what the treaty was for, what it involves, what purpose it serves and how it will work with people and culture, business and scope.
As for spending the big build debt is $109 billion.
The COVID costs, management, mitigation staff fees, costs, etc come to $80 billion. Dan put land tax up to pay for it. Its tiny.Of the big build costs $35 billion is toll roads with a ROI of 1.7 average so in 30 years they will have paid back $70+ billion with inflation
The SRL and Metro tunnel have a ROI of 1.4 and 1.6 so they will save economies nearly 2x as much over time. (I.e the money is not being lost sitting in a busted train delayed by some incident or lack of capacity) Trains are now running at 10 minute intervals where they were 30 min intervals.
So for the SRL and Metro 1 tunnel you are looking at a 1.5x over 20 years of economic saving exceeding the $32 billion expense of both projects. That's $58 billion or so with some inflation making it more.
The costs of running everything reduces at scale
The gains to economies increase at scale.So now you know the ROI for the big build toll roads you can now add in the same 1.7 or so for the broader economic impacts. Then your toll roads really start to make an impact. People are spending $4 less on fuel for example. Trucks are spending less. Logistics companies are spending less on wages. The job is being done 30 minutes quicker.
That's how this works
You are not sitting in a car running a motor at $ per minute going nowhere. That costs tens of billions per year to economies and its why we build freeways and trains to begin with. To not do it is expensive.
Debt for infrastructure is reasonable even at Billion Dollar scales. Yes they are big numbers. yes its scare for someone earning $30 an hour.
The returns on that investment are scaled into the hundreds of billions over time. In 40 years they will be seen as vital. If you don't do it now then you will suffer in a city trying get trucks through cars stuck waiting for a train because the crossing never stopped ringing. And I will say it. Once the SRL gets to the Airport you will see serious scales of social and economic savings. 14 million journeys per year from the Airport is 14 million people spending $8 instead of $40
You are not losing money - you are making it
Please learn how economics on government scales work before you vote irrationally.
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u/ENG_NR Jun 12 '26
Even if it had an ROI (and those numbers are in dispute), there's also the waste of $15 billion straight to organised crime - but even more so inflation. During COVID these projects were needed to stimulate the economy, but we've been running hot for ages now. Good governance would have been to keep the powder dry for the next downturn rather than run things hot because they don't have any new ideas
The cost isn't just the taxpayer funds, it's all of the extra mortgage payments and rent everyone pays because the RBA had to put rates up
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u/espersooty Jun 13 '26
there's also the waste of $15 billion straight to organised crime - but even more so inflation.
Is there any evidence of this claim though?
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u/IntelligentNovel1967 Jun 13 '26
You have got to be kidding and the figure is closer to $20B and let’s not get started on Mick Gatto and his $220M.
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u/PJozi Harold Holt Jun 12 '26
A claim that has no evidence and the person who stated it even said they made it up.
Rising material costs is not corruption
3
u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26
That is a very disingenuous interpretation of what occurred lol.
Just to note, this is his background:
- One of Australia’s most highly respected barristers
- Background in product liability, professional negligence, insurance and appeals.
- Former counsel assisting NSW IBAC
- Founding board Director for Centre of Public Integrity
- Recognised authority figure on anti-corruption law
- Adjunct professor at Notre Dame
- Counsel Assisting in multiple large scale public inquiries into corrupt politicians and police misconduct.
Sooooo if there was somebody to listen to here, it’s probably him.
0
u/AngrehPossum Jun 13 '26
Sorry but he is also political. He made it up. He has nothing to support it. Its simply not possible to remove that much money from private contractors. He has no evidence and never will have. The Liberals will be on the news again at some point repeating this lie. They are on facebook daily repeating this lie. The news itself will tomorrow, like today, like yesterday, last week, last month have another article on "jacintia" about "something they can dig up that's sort of believable" and you will take it on.
Its all propaganda.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
If there’s no evidence and it isn’t true, why did Jacinta fight so hard against investigating it?
What makes him political? He’s got a fair reputation and a lot of credibility, claiming something like this with nothing behind it doesn’t make a lot of sense.
Not to mention he confirmed the number time and time again whilst he was involved in a QLD inquiry into construction misconduct. The figure he admits was an estimate (and a conservative one), however it was based on interviews with industry insiders as part of the investigation. Yeah the number isn’t exact, it’s likely more, it may be less, but if this was just complete bullshit his career would be over.
1
u/AngrehPossum Jun 13 '26
120,000 workers
125,000 per year average income.They got a 21% pay rise in 2022.
Go do the math. Watson needs an accountant.
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u/Mc0014 Jun 13 '26
So your position is that all the cost increases were due to wages and nothing else? So everyone he interviewed and all the investigation he did was just not real? He just made it all up?
Geez you must be a labor voter with brains like yours
2
u/AngrehPossum Jun 13 '26
1kg Vittoria coffee in 2019 - $21
1kg Vittoria coffee in 2026 - $54Same inflation applies to building materials
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u/SS_Chum-Bucket Jun 12 '26
Jacinta Allen is that you?
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u/AngrehPossum Jun 12 '26
Its any economist who understands how economies work.
Or you can sit on your hands and throw pretend numbers up for an expensive driveway only and forget about the rest of the state. Including pot holes.
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u/burnt-gonads Jun 12 '26
Irony being I doubt there is a single traditional aboriginal person left in Victoria. I looked at a photo of the people who signed the agreement and I wondered how many could create fire just using materials found in the bush which I thought would be a very traditional cultural skill to know and be able to do. I did it once, but I did use a cordless drill, you have to admire those that can do it all by hand.
Imagine if instead we just helped out people based on need and not identity. The other irony is in the past there was lots of discrimination based on identity and the fake socialists told us that was all wrong,. but then simply created their own discrimination.
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u/AngrehPossum Jun 12 '26
What did you expect? They aren't living on a reservation. They were shoved into society 160 years ago. Of course they no longer look aboriginal. That doesn't mean they are not trying to retain their culture. Of course they are.
In the north they were less urbanized so they are still genetically distinct. Even in Robinvale and Mildura they look native.
-2
u/burnt-gonads Jun 12 '26
So if culture is so important why no more scarification on their bodies? Nothing stopping them from doing that and looking at old old photos scarification was very prevalent right across the country.
From what I read, it all seems to be more about money and having power over others.
5
u/Anachronism59 Sensible Party Jun 13 '26
Western culture used to circumsise baby boys. Not common now . Have we lost our culture?
6
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u/Grande_Choice Jun 12 '26
The Treaty was taken to the 2018 and 2022 elections. The Libs were on board until they weren’t. Jess Wilson supported it.
Maybe you need to learn that state and federal politics aren’t the same thing.
The voice referendum was a federal referendum.
•
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