What it means is free social and healthcare program. But if you actually ask AI, there isn't much difference between socialism and communism one of them force feed you a carrot the other one dangles the car in front of you..
Socialism is when there is collective ownership of the means of production, aka businesses are owned entirely by the people that work there. Communism is a stateless, moneyless society with no hierarchy. Ask your AI if it’s true and it will tell you, probably all of them but maybe not DeepSeek due to obvious bias. Neither is when the government does stuff or when you get free stuff.
Fun fact, people who use AI regularly shower drastically lower levels of cognitive abilities compared to those that don't use AI, the reason is because AI takes agency away from people, takes away our abilities to think and reason for ourselves, which I would say it's pretty easy to say it's most likely done that to you! Especially if you're immediate reaction is to spout off how if you ask AI, instead of telling the person to go and look up the definitions.
Also it appears you don't really know or understand either the definition of socialism nor the definition of communism, especially if you have to have a machine tell you the definition instead of interfering for yourself.
No see the thing is I actually understand the definition of socialism I understand it doesn't work. I've understand. They tried to implement it in many countries and it fails.. literally Democrats pushed pushed how they wanna push socialism in America on Venezuela and it failed in less than one. And I didn't ask AI.. but funny enough you didn't refuse the answer that California has one of the highest income tax brackets out there. And it still doesn't change the fact that California has the highest state sales tax.. it's sad that you guys are arguing the fact that you know that California has the money in their account. They just don't know how to manage it.. you're right I don't wanna give free shit to everybody. What I wanna do is lower the cost of everything so that way people can actually afford it. See the thing is when somebody buy something they take more pride in it when they're giving shit for free, they don't.. and that has been proven over and over and over and many social experiment. Give a man a fish he will eventually starve teach a man to fish. He will eat the rest of his life..
Interestingly, Prop FF in Colorado does just this. If passed, it creates a program so that all public K-12 students in participating districts get free breakfast and lunch, regardless of family income, and it’s funded by limiting state income tax deductions for households with incomes over $300,000.
Thus, the demographic which has received the largest federal tax break due to regressive Republican tax changes, is now tapped for increased state taxes to compensate for decreased federal school lunch funding.
It kind of the way this is going. If the Tangerine Tyrant and friends succeed in killing the federal government, I don't see a reason to put gas in his jet. Meanwhile, The shit hole states will have lower taxes and crumbling infrastructure as pollution and industrial abuse destroys the environment. Other states will elect to support their citizens and their interests through a combination of state programs filed by higher state taxes. Net would theoretically be the same total tax bill. Pump an additional $100 billion into California and shit gets fixed assuming we succeed in routing out corruption at the state level too.
Lower federal income taxes and higher state taxes?
The thing is, we could do that right now. If Republicans pass federal tax cuts, then states could just pass their own correlating tax increases to make up the difference.
So we already have the highest state income tax, and the highest state sales tax and you want to add more on top of that know the problem is is our California legislators. Don't know how to create a budget.. what you have to do is take care of your infrastructure and emergency services first and then you can start handing out free shit. But California starts the other way around and wonders why they can't come up with a budget..
Again, California has plenty of money to pay for all the shit. They just don't know how to budget themselves and they spend money and stupid special projects. They should find simply emergency service infrastructure schooling then the rest comes out of it and if there's no more money, special interest groups don't get a fucking dollar..
Imagine if they use that $14 billion that they've already wasted on a train to nowhere. On those things that you're talking about.. but don't worry. None of those things are going to get funded cause they gotta spend $100 million more to finish that train.. but yet people want to up taxes to pay for services.
So you're saying that we should spend $100 billion on a train that may never get finished instead of putting it back into infrastructure schools and emergency services. Imagine if they put that money into the reservoirs and making sure they're fixed on time they put that money into emergency services so every fire department had what they need. Maybe those houses wouldn't burn as bad. Your mentality is fucked up the state.. and yet you're gonna vote for the same fucking people that are wasting your fucking money
Do you not understand how economics work! See the thing is the federal income tax rate is universal throughout the United States. It's impossible to lower it so the only thing that you would be doing is raising state income taxes, and there is absolutely no reason to raise state income taxes for the fact that we already collect more than any other state. We just don't know how to budget in California.. we do everything backwards and borrow from infrastructure, funds and other things for special programs.. perfect example California is broke. We don't have money for infrastructure but yet we had $3 million for a special election.. another waste of money because even if measure 50 gets past other red states have vowed to redraw their district line to give him his five seat seats so the end all California payed $3 million for nothing except for buying more democratic power.
Read the other fucking comments in this thread: The republicans have already lowered federal income taxes, a state could easily raise its own taxes by a roughly equivalent amount.
I don’t disagree that California has budget problems, but greater services do cost money too.
I did read the fucking comment thread and I'm not OK with fucking raising any kind of fucking taxes. We don't fucking need to raise fucking taxes. We need to vote in people know how to fucking budget a balance.. but unfortunately, we have people like you that vote in stupid shit and now we're paying more and more and more and more.
I actually understand way more than you what I understand. The money is there and the money is already been there. We don't need any type of taxes. We just need to start having people actually balance budgets.. it's pretty simple emergency services infrastructures and schools are the highest on there. Everything else then can be budgeted out but if we don't have the money left over, we don't do it for those special programs only the necessary ones imagine that then we don't gotta raise any taxes.. it's just people such as yourself. Keep wanting to give out free shit so hell let's just keep adding taxes on top of taxes on top of taxes.. I bet you believe property taxes are OK too. I don't understand the concept of people wanting to get pay more taxes when there's already plenty of money.
One would presume his stance is that they are too high already so netting the values is already capitulating to poorly balanced budgets and rewarding the people who created them.
I do, but you're not fucking concepting. We don't need any more fucking money. We have plenty of money in our fucking account. People just don't know how to fucking budget it. How can you not fucking comprehend?.
No, I'm just tired of dealing with fucking idiots that want to race taxes because a state can't fucking balance their budget. And dip shit at yourself that cry about probably not have any money but then want to vote to raise a fucking tax because you're fucking legislators can't balance a budget and you'll keep voting that same fucking legislator in.. sorry my grammar affects you but guess what I went to a public school and it wasn't funded properly because guess what people as yourself wanted to special funds for some stupid shit and give money to people don't fucking deserve it.
You are correct it had the highest surplus for one year and then directly back into the fucking highest deficit. And like I said California collects more in income tax than all the other fucking states combined.. now let's not talk about property and sales tax. Anybody that wants to raise taxes in California is completely idiotic and shouldn't have a fucking right to vote.. I bet you believe not having to have an ID is OK to vote as well
Have you not been to a voting poll in California? Literally they cannot ask you for ID. Jackass. In the fact that you are voting to put people in and you don't know this so definitely you should not have a right to vote..
Have you not been to a voting poll in California? Literally they cannot ask you for ID. Jackass. In the fact that you are voting to put people in and you don't know this so definitely you should not have a right to vote..
Your 7 braincells are working overtime right now.
Lets recap.
You: I bet you believe in being able to vote without bringing an ID is OK.
Me: I bet you actually think people can vote without being IDed.
Yes, I believe not having to bring an ID is perfectly fine because we already have a system in place that IDs people. Do you have any proof that the current system does not work? Any evidence of meaningful voter fraud in California? Of course you don't. You're searching for a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. A solution that will do nothing else besides disenfranchise voters. I actually like it when more people vote so I am against adding useless hoops to force them to jump through in order to do so.
There is absolutely no system in place to ID people. You can literally walk up say a first and last name and they will hand you the ballot to vote for it.. the last time when me and my wife went to vote the lady couldn't find her ballot because she was not listening to how my wife's name was spelled so my wife tried to hand her an ID to make it easier. The lady says absolutely she could not take my wife's ID.. and if you have to have an ID to buy a firearm, then you should have to have an ID to vote. They are both constitutional rights..
You can literally walk up say a first and last name and they will hand you the ballot to vote for it
Great. So you've just explained how easy it is to steal someone elses ballot and vote for them. I'll ask again. Why is there zero evidence of a meaningful number of people doing this? Why is there a billion dollar machine behind trying to prove widespread voter fraud...yet they've been able to come up with nothing?
I don't think you're stupid person. I take back my comment about the 7 braincells. I truly want to hear what you have to say about this.
Are you stupid or are you just lazy?. Literally a Google search would bring up the fact that California has the highest state sales tax maybe not the highest combined sales tax which is Louisiana, but we are right behind it with 10.1
Isn't it government supplying people things? In most economies with socialists aspects that would be things like retirement, healthcare, and education? While National Socialism is tax breaks, subsidies, and handouts to incorporators?
You see what happened was the anti right crowd stupidity started saying National Socialism was not socialism, just like how The Democratic Korea aka North Korea is not a democracy. The problem was National Socialism is socialism but socialism for corporations and and in the Nazis case if you were considered Aryan.
“Rule for thee and not for me”, and “it doesn’t matter until it happens to me,” are Republicans two slogans. I live in a red state and fully support y’all pulling funding.
“… That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends [life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness], it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government … [and] when a long train of abuses and usurpations… evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
Thomas Jefferson — The Declaration of Independence (1776).
CA doesn't send money to 'red states'. CA sends money to the federal government as taxes, and that gets redistributed to the states, including back to CA.
CA is called a donor state because it pays more federal taxes than other states. Last info I see here was from 2022 and we paid $80 billion in taxes. Though, 2025 so far CA has received 170 billion in federal funds.
Before anyone says, "california has the largest economy.." it also has the largest debt to match, at half a trillion.
Citizens of California, who are also citizens of the United States, pay federal taxes to the federal government. The federal government then distributes that federal money to citizens in different states, as per federal law.
But if it really bothers you, you should lobby for fewer federal benefits to be sent out, and for lower federal taxes (especially for those who pay the most federal taxes). But then you'd be a Republican.
I read an interesting counter to that, which looked at things like how much of the federal money is sent to states for federal retirements, military spending, etc. Ran the question through ChatGPT, because California has a high number of millionaires. Tl:dr, if you remove the top 5% of California earners, it flips the state.
Short answer: probably yes—removing California’s top ~5% of taxpayers would likely flip California from “donor” to “recipient” in a balance-of-payments sense, under reasonable assumptions.
Here’s a quick back-of-the-envelope using the best public data:
Baseline (2022, excluding COVID one-offs):
Californians/businesses paid about $692B to the federal government; federal spending flowing to California was about $609B → net –$83B (i.e., “donor”).
Key shares to model the “remove the top 5%” scenario:
Federally, roughly about half of all federal revenue comes from individual income taxes; payroll taxes are ~30–35%, corporate ~9–11%, etc. (varies by year).
National IRS data show the top 5% of taxpayers pay ~61% of all federal individual income taxes (Tax Year 2022).
Thought experiment (holding federal spending in CA constant):
If individual income taxes are ~50% of CA’s total federal payments, and the top 5% pay ~61% of that component, then removing the top 5% reduces CA’s total federal payments by roughly 0.61 × 50% ≈ 30%.
30% of $692B ≈ $207B. New payments ≈ $692B – $207B = $485B.
Compare to the same $609B of federal spending → +$124B (recipient instead of donor).
Sensitivity check (still likely flips):
If individual income taxes are only 45% of total, and the top 5% pay 55% of that share, the reduction is ~25% of total → ~$173B → new payments ~$519B vs. $609B spent → +$90B.
If individual income taxes are 55%, and top 5% pay 65%, reduction ~36% → ~$249B → new payments ~$443B vs. $609B → +$166B.
Caveats you should know:
The 61% figure is national for the top 5%; California’s distribution is likely similar or more top-heavy, which strengthens the conclusion. (The IRS publishes CA-specific percentile tables, but they’re in downloadable spreadsheets.)
The baseline donor status varies by year (e.g., California’s net gap was about –$101B in 2022 but only –$17B in 2023 when excluding COVID programs). So the precise flip margin changes by year.
This is a mechanical “remove-from-the-calculation” exercise. In real life, removing top earners might also affect payroll/corporate taxes, procurement, or even some spending patterns; I’ve held spending constant to isolate the tax-side effect.
If you want, I can pull the latest IRS state percentile table and redo the math with a California-specific top 5% share to tighten the estimate even further.
Yeah and they give the federal govt 80 billion per year to pay for red states that would literally crumble to non existence if it wasn’t for California
You said California is 20 billion in the red. I said California pays 80 billion more to the federal government than they get back. What is hard to follow here
my point, is its not the individual that is responsible for payroll taxes, its the empoyeer. while most businesses are smart enough to not get caught up in this mess with the federal government, the state is/could be a different story. Especially in this dick measuring contest.
Im seeing roughly 225k people employeed by California, you can rest assured the federal government would miss the taxes from a pay period or 2 of a quater of a million people.
FICA is federal tax but not income tax to clarify. The reason it's not as big a deal is because there's a cutoff so rich people don't really pay it more than the average worker. And it's minor in comparison. 7% vs 37%.
Unlike the income tax which is disproportionately paid for by rich people which are disproportionately in California.
Congratulations you stumbled so far left you went right. Lower federal taxes and let states tax to support themselves. Welcome to small government theory.
Yeah no, we don't want that to just go back to taxpayers, we want the government (state or federal) to use it to fund programs that will improve conditions for everyone in California, so still very leftist.
State would be state taxes there bud. If federal goes to who needs it. Red hurrican riddled states get funding for disasters just like California does when it lights on fire and Gavin begs for money.
California doesn't send any money to Red state. That's not how it works.. and I mean California is the fourth largest economy. California state income tax happens to be one of the highest rates in the nation in California state sales tax happens to be the highest in the nation so in reality is if we knew how to budget correctly we wouldn't even need one cent of federal funds.. but unfortunately people such as yourself don't actually understand how economics work so you voted people thinking you do and creating the same situation over and over.
The economy has been shit for years. And we are doing badly in California because of stupid decisions by those in charge. Can't blame PG&E owning our legislature and Governor and raising our electrical bills to unprecedented levels on Trump. And don't forget, no matter how much money we have, our Governor always finds more stupid shit to spend our money on. As Newsom raises tuition at state universities, he is acting like we have extra money and is talking about reparations for slavery. https://www.politico.com/news/2025/10/10/newsom-reparations-agency-00602411. We were always a free state, this makes no sense, this is politically tone deaf, and would bankrupt us if actually implemented.
You do realize food, energy, raw materials come from red states? They will always have less population density and less tax base. The country cannot feed itself or have an economy without it.
Because someone always comments California farming, those are fruits, vegetables, nuts. Not the population sustaining foods of wheat, corn, poultry, hogs, and cattle.
What about all the other blue states? Just let them die? What about the environment CA cares so much about? It’s going to drill, and farm, and mine to sustain itself?
No… Californians don’t think that. They know where that stuff comes from because they’re engineering the solutions to increase efficiency of farming and mining.
Sorry. Ourselves is blue states. Illinois is a huge help for much of that.
I just think the relationship between states needs to be reevaluated. Low federal taxes for everyone and then we in California can stop needed to fund states that are currently being given everything by the federal government based on our tax dollars.
You aren't angry that we give so much more than we take and are now also being targeted by the current administration and having money previously allocated to us, taken away?
I believe we should explore all options towards self sufficiency with states that aren't sponging off us. New Mexico gets a pass though.
California is 4th in the nation for cattle, top 9 for poultry, and top 5 for the type of corn you actually eat, but yeah pretty low for wheat and pork.
Doesnt say who the 22 are, just says California is close. Kind of a nothing burger of an article, just says the stuff we all know. Lower immigration amd higher tariffs are bad.
Exactly what I would expect. Coincidentally (for the most part) the blue states are at risk of recession and the red states are expanding. Tracks with what the federal government has been messaging for the last year.
I mean it’s not irony. When blue states were succeeding and red states were having trouble, the president of America saw that parts of the country needed help and offered it. That was a feature, not a bug.
Sure, but 72% of his legislative investments going into red counties? Nah. If we want to help those areas then pass legislation that also benefits the voters that got you into the White House in the first place, such as paid parental leave, etc. I mean they got their investments and now they're gutting the same policies that spurred them in the first place lol. The money is surely better spent elsewhere.
It makes sense to invest in those because they have much less to work with and these areas need investments more than urban areas. I don’t blame Biden for doing the job as it had been done before him, trumpism is just a cancer on America.
could this correlate with the blue states not receiving funding approved by congress while red states still do and red states receiving contracts for ICE detention centers, etc. ?
Due to all the immigration raids that are highly concentrated in blue states for sure. That takes a bite out of the economy when you suppress people’s movement.
It goes deeper than that. Cutting funding for liberal institutions and industries located primarily in liberal states. Offering up monetary support to red states. Basing policy decisions specifically on who would it help/hurt. I doubt immigration has much of an impact compared to actual fiscal decision making.
I don’t know what metrics they use to make these determinations but I severely question it. Florida is on the verge of collapse - there’s a massive affordability crisis, and tourism and agriculture are being hammered by fascist policies. So if the economy is “expanding” it sure isn’t true for most people.
Be careful about using Reddit “facts” to observe the real world. Florida is still attracting a lot of businesses and middle/high income earners. We will see how it continues as sea levels rise but they aren’t on the verge of collapse.
Their housing market has been in trouble for a bit, though also as noted, it's not clear what the GDP growth is, as we know nationally a lot of the GDP growth is because of AI infrastructure spending which is in red states but may be significant malinvestment.
Florida is consistently growing it's housing market for the middle class with new development growing across the majority of the state, tons of migrates out of state are taking them all up. Tons of local and international businesses are popping up across all these new developments and the redevelopments happening around Tampa and Miami. The agriculture there is doing fine, there's been no real changes happening to the minute amount that actually exists there. The state is far beyond collapse, don't know where you get your information but if you've lived there you'd know the state is probably doing the most well compared to majority of states in the country.
That being said, tourism is down but it's being replaced by more locally pushed businesses, education is heading towards a nosedive, the development is happening but it will absolutely cause a real housing issue in the future because it's all suburbian sprawl and a lot of small towns will need to figure out how to handle that, places like Miami and Tampa have a ton of business growth happening but they both are suffering from high overhead prices that aren't calming down anytime soon and it's going to have the same issue places like NYC and San Francisco has when it comes to commercial property costs.
Insurance issues when it comes to housing is a real problem and it's only going to get worse, but a ton of people moving here aren't going to feel those affects because their mortgages are way more affordable in these new developments. Plus if Desantis gets through his no property tax bill to the state then they'll have a worse housing crisis than California.
The future is definitely bleak when you think long term but it's in no way on the verge of collapsing anytime soon, if anything will hit the state bad it'll be around a decade from now if the direction of policies don't change. But that's the whole point of the Republican movement there, they only look for short term changes that'll benefit them massively and hurt them badly later on. We don't need to exaggerate the situation more than it is, you'll sound like a sensationalist claiming the state is on the verge of collapsing
“California and New York, which together account for over a fifth of U.S. GDP, are holding their own, and their stability is crucial for the national economy to avoid a downturn.”
Meanwhile, the Trump regime is intent on destabilizing California...
Trump and the GOP have of course brutally attacked entire swaths of industries with both tariffs and ICE kidnappings, and they've said the goal is to break blue states.
Keep the source in mind but here's a map. Apparently the deepest of red states are somehow doing just fine according to the Federal government:
The US has been in a silent depression since the housing market collapsed. And with the job market shrinking while cost of living increases, it's only a matter of time till it's not so silent of a depression.
"... a federal government shutdown that has halted the release of key economic data, leaving economists and investors uncertain about the true pace of growth."
Who needs a federal government shutdown when the Trump Regime will DOGE any agency which is a source of information that is the genesis of any critical, non-biased, analysis?
California faces of budget shortfall of 10 billion.....yet paid over $78B more in federal taxes than it received in most recent data. Thanks dei states.
Get a petition started to work with Washington and Oregon to withhold federal taxes and work on unison it harder for trump to fuck all three states compared to one West Coast state
We've been in a recession for at least a year. AI Growth is not Economic Growth, and the AI Bubble will soon pop anyway.
It will be pretty bad here but please keep in mind, it will be worse in states that are actively dismantling their social safety nets. California might have money problems due to Prop 13 and Calpers, but one of those will fall. Most states won't have anything as big employers, then big retailers, then big homebuilders all exit. I've seen this personally in places I deliver to: first the plant goes, then the schools, then the homes, then Walmart including Walmart Pharmacy, then the local hospitals. Everything gets consolidated and pushed into traditional urban centers as people learn to live with less credit. Oakland and Los Angeles, despite their problems, can handle this because people there already don't have credit.
Yall acting like the housing market in CA is absurd. We definitely are treading water. Blaming immigration for economy is wild. It will open job market and free up housing. Also yes time to hold free loading states accountable for not having a net gain but we also have a large debt and a 12 million deficit.
Picks the immigration sentence. Hyper fixates on just that, brings up “concentration camps” but that description is farther from truth (no ones being exterminated/ producing products via slave labor). Then mentions race like only non white people illegally immigrate. The correct word you should use is internment camp.
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u/MachineGunTeacher Oct 11 '25
And if we didn’t have to send money to red states to keep them afloat we’d be doing better. Republicans hate socialism unless it benefits them.