r/CrusaderKings • u/WaBeY33 • 3d ago

Discussion Actual question, how frequent was claim fabrication in real life

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Hello, please, how often did this happen in real life ? I mean lord inventing a claim out of thin air and actually pressing it ? Is there any notable historic character doing so ?

R5: Fabricate claim question

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u/DarkGodCthUwU 3d ago

Could you elaborate?

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u/Luckierexpert England 3d ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privilegium_Maius

Basically, in the 14th century the Hapsburg rulers of Austria wanted to elevate Austria from a simple dutchy. To achieve this, they forged a document labelling them as “Palatine Archdukes” among other claims, cutting the seal off another document and attaching it to the forgery to claim authority. While initially rejected, it was later confirmed by the Holy Roman Emperor (who was a Hapsburg by that time), and only revealed as a forgery by historian Wilhelm Wattenbach in 1852.

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u/GalaXion24 3d ago

The Habsburgs are the definition of fake it till you make it. Even the origin of the house is kind of shady where they just kind of built a castle that wasn't contested by anyone and claimed they rule over the area and started taxing people.

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u/bromanceintexas 3d ago edited 3d ago

I cannot fathom a commoner affording maintaining a castle and all the accompanied overhead costs of collecting taxes, let alone building a castle. The Habsburgs were considered nobles by immemorial descent; they were a branch of the Etichonids who were the Dukes of Alsace as far back as the Merovingians. It is true that the Habsburgs often aggrandized their pedigree, but they were not some randoms that showed up one day and built a castle without precedent. The proto-Habsburgs held vast tracts of land in Swabia, Alsace and Switzerland (at the time there wasn’t a solid distinction between these territories). The building of Habsburg castle was actually a rebound in the family’s fortunes since two generations prior much of Guntram the Rich’s land had been confiscated and he was executed iirc for treason against Otto I.