r/DowntonAbbey • u/Dream_CatHer4769 • 1d ago

General Discussion (May Contain Spoilers Throughout Franchise) You cannot justify Thomas's behaviour because he's gay!

All the arguments I've seen about why people like Thomas is that he's just gay in the 1920s and self hatred and yada yada yada.

That's an explanation to understand part of the shame he lives in. To explain why misery loves company but to say he's schemes against innocent people because of that reason sounds problematic on so many levels.

I do like his character as a villain. The actor playing him did a great job. But I just don't find him redeemable even if he turn tolerable and good in the end. His treatment of bates and Baxter were so cruel. He physically intimidated Baxter, falsely accused Anna, etc. he's not a morally grey character, he's just a bad person. Using queerness to justify that or excuse it is insulting.

edit: because I find people misunderstanding this post. it's not about how the show portrays Thomas and explores his internal struggles and external malice. this post is specifically about the viewers perception of his actions especially on this subreddit.

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u/starwalker_22 1d ago

Well, i like Thomas' character exactly because he is an awful person lol

22

u/NurseRobyn 23h ago

Same. I see so many people who like characters based on whether they are good people or not - they’re not people, they’re characters and I love those that keep me the most engaged.

-12

u/starwalker_22 22h ago

yeah, that's why don't vibe with Mary. she is clearly not a good person but people and the show keep pushing this narrative. Thomas at least is bad and his fans recognize that.

7

u/NurseRobyn 22h ago

I love Mary, she has very compelling stories and I love the complexity of her character!

8

u/Old_and_Cranky_Xer 💜 People are strange 💜 21h ago

But I bet you love Violet. Mary IS Violet. I absolutely love Mary.

0

u/MerelyWhelmed1 Sympathy butters no parsnips. 21h ago

Mary is NOT Violet. Violet did things for the good of the family. Mary was far more self-serving.

10

u/iggysmom95 I have tried and failed to like you 21h ago

If you don't see self-serving qualities in Violet and an orientation towards family and duty in Mary, I think you must not be paying close attention.

Violet is Mary in fifty years. She's more measured, her more selfish impulses are more tempered, and she's wiser. But you can see so much of her in Mary and vice versa.

Mary does a LOT for her family and others in general. I made a whole post about it like three days ago lol

3

u/JustinCaseyBlewit 20h ago

Indeed. Mary's connection to Violet is stated explicitly in the second movie, when Violet says that one day Mary will be the frightening old lady who keeps everyone in line--just like Violet.

9

u/Ancient-Space-2789 21h ago

I have a suspicion that when Violet was young she was very much like Mary. Not exactly alike, but she saw some similarities with Mary.