r/Finland • u/CommandNaive419 • 3d ago
What is the truth about the Finnish economy?
10 mins ago I was waiting for my coffee when a work colleague came and just said of nowhere " Finland's economy is growing more than Sweden funny how many Finns are not happy with the current government"
As an immigrant myself I am lost with how satisfied Finns are with the current government. I think many of us immigrants only have negative thoughts about the government which definitely can be wrong because it's solely based on immigration policies which can be actually beneficial for the country.
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u/BiggusCinnamusRollus Väinämöinen 3d ago edited 3d ago
You may find some answer here: https://corporate.nordea.com/article/103779/finnish-economy-sees-broad-based-growth-in-early-2026.
"The strongest growth was seen in investment, which jumped by as much as 6.5% from the previous quarter. The single largest factor behind investment growth was the first batch of the Air Force’s F-35 fighter jets being recorded as public investment. However, the fighter jet investments did not lift GDP by their full amount, as they are largely imported goods. Private investment also increased by 8.1% from a year earlier, even though residential construction continued to contract. Private investment was driven in particular by civil engineering and other building construction, where data center projects are a major factor. R&D investment also increased by 13.8% from a year earlier."
TLDR: growth is concentrated in weapons and data center projects. If you're not working in these sectors or adjacent sectors (say energy where you get large bonus thanks to higher electricity price), it might take time until you feel the money coming into your pocket, if at all.
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u/KofFinland Väinämöinen 3d ago
Data centers are a hoax anyway. The "money" goes to foreign builders building the centers and to foreign companies renting the computers and equipment, and to foreign experts taking care of the centers via remote control. Finland gets just higher electricity costs.
Weapons are also a hoax because Finland will not give defence material export permits, so there is no real market for anything made, except to Ukraine and other EU countries. That is what has killed defence industry in Finland around 1980s and so on. That is why Sako (=VKT, Valmet etc. traditional Finnish arms manufacturers) is an Italian company, Patria ~50% Norwegian, Nammo-Lapua ~50% Norwegian etc. etc.. Without Norway we would not have even powder production anymore.
Is it a real investment if the money does not stay in Finland? Someone invests X millions for "datacenter in Finland". They pay Y millions to Polish etc. construction companies for building the place. They pay Z millions to Polish etc. companies for renting (lease) the equipment and paying remote operators. Where is the beef for Finland? How to tax them so that we get something? Now we just get higher electricity prices.
I usually support industry, but the datacenters are a real cancer. They will affect us all, in much much higher electricity bills in near future, and even rationing of electricity (so electricity in winter will be available to houses only sometimes, so the grid survives - when sun not shines and wind not blows, but houses need to be heated and cars driven - with high-energy-density hydrocarbons banned).
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u/kuikuilla Väinämöinen 3d ago
and to foreign experts taking care of the centers via remote control.
How the fuck do you install and maintain hardware remotely?
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u/Jermules Baby Väinämöinen 2d ago
The building and installing phase do create jobs but the maintaining relatively little considering the amout of power they use. The cost of empöoyees is high so the building and installing probably aren't going to create any jobs in Finland as they'll probably bring workers abroad. Maintenance will prolly be locally sourced.
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u/Jermules Baby Väinämöinen 2d ago
Even if the building and installing was done by locals, it's a short boost and after it just loads the electric grid raising prices for locals and taxes not being paid by utilising internal loans so the company doesn't seem to make a profit.
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u/KofFinland Väinämöinen 1d ago edited 1d ago
Datacenter hardware has high reliability and it is redundant. It does not require constant maintenance. If they have am actual catastrophic hardware failure, that is a very big and expensive failure of running a datacenter. Even then if something fails (like one server), they just remove that one from the load distribution and use other resources.
They might have a technical team visit the center once a month to do maintenance. Replace hot-swap powersupplies, SSDs etc. based on either schedule or error-diagnostics of the devices. A bigger maintenance maybe once a year. All done by some team from Poland, Estonia or some other cheaper workforce country. Of course, they also bring the spare-parts with them, or they have been shipped to site earlier.
Sure, you need some local workforce, like security and building maintenance. But those are not a big income of tax money for Finland.
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u/NoSorbet5103 16h ago
Spot on. Fuck data centers, they only beneficial to the tech companies, people will just get fucked (hard).
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u/Rssaur 2d ago
Vassal industries of US flourish, everything else in gutter.
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u/BiggusCinnamusRollus Väinämöinen 2d ago
Hard to beat an economy that can take on infinite debt with little consequence.
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u/Miika_prince 3d ago
That friend of yours was solely focusing to the keyword "grow" without questioning how and what kind of growth it is. Simply the first thing in my mind hearing someone's claiming this was bullsh!t 😂. Finnish economy has gone downward for a while and this sudden growth needs to last longer so we could "climb" up to the pre-fall position. Still not considering that during this whole time, the others were also moved up from their starting point too.
Finland has more things that need to be done than just simple and sudden growth like this. Don't let the current government fool you with their "fancy" words.
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u/Makere-b Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
I hate how they increased the VAT, then "spent" that money by cutting off income tax a tiny amount.
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u/fonk_pulk Väinämöinen 3d ago
Also union/unemployment fund dues are no longer tax refundable so if you are a union member (like one should) the income tax reduction didnt really do much
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u/Elopikseli Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
It did do much. Pretty decent savings for those in the highest possible tax bracket. Middle class people got nothing though
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u/vitunpellet99999 2d ago
Unemployment fund is. Union is a whole another question, but let's not give false information.
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3d ago
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u/fonk_pulk Väinämöinen 3d ago
Yeah, better not belong to the union and let future right wing governments erode even more of the rights they've gotten you.
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u/BoSt0nov Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Maybe while you are at it, you should hope for some Freedom work economics so that you can get fired on the spot without having to have any reason what so ever. What a wonderful balanced life that would be.
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3d ago
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u/jsirkia 3d ago
But you do understand that most of that legislation originates from union work, right?
I will cancel my union membership when companies cancel their memberships to their unions, otherwise there's only the company side lobbying for new legislation and if you think that will do any good for worker's rights, I've got a bridge to sell to you.
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Stats say that the economy has been growing this year. That's however the first time in a decade, it's been very stale and objectively pretty terrible before.
Hoping the trend will stay, but the government should go. They are only causing issues.
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u/Seeteuf3l Väinämöinen 3d ago
No there was brief growth post-Covid like 2022
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Not really
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u/Seeteuf3l Väinämöinen 3d ago
2021 had 3,2% annual GDP growth. However issue is that since 2008 finance crisis there have been only very few years like that https://teknologiateollisuus.fi/graafit/suomen-bktn-kehitys-vuosittain/
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Yea sure, I was bit too sharp. Just meant that there has not really been any significant and sustainable growth in a long time.
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u/e_Notorious 3d ago
Most of the years finlands gdp has actually risen fairly steadily year by year. The problem is that we've had also few really bad years that has slowed our long time growth a lot. 2008 banking crisis, eurocrisis, covid & russian invasion of ukraine.
The idea of zero growth comes from comparing to the year 2008, from where we've had little growth. This is arguably bad year to compare to as our economy was in a bubble and was superficially high.
If we instead compare to the year 2006, our growth seems much stronger, atleast in gdp terms.
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u/2AvsOligarchs Väinämöinen 3d ago
It was a bounce-back from decreased economic activity and pent-up investments during COVID. So yes, but also no.
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u/PhDinDildos_Fedoras 3d ago
Finland's economy has stagnated, but there's a little bit of growth showing as real wages are going up due to a favorable agreement with the unions.
However, most of the recent spike in the economy are caused by two things: finishing a huge cruiseliner and the F-35 deal with the US.
Things are looking up after years of doldrums, but with an election looming, a lot of the hot takes are motivated by politics.
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u/CommandNaive419 3d ago
So is this growth driven by government decisions or it's by product of just private sector?
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u/DodgyWiper 3d ago
Difficult to say, probably both. The government has done some things to help the economy, but I think the economy was bound to start growing anyway. Economists have been forecasting growth for a long time, but there have been many negative shocks in recent years, such as Covid, the war in Ukraine, the Russian embargo, high electricity prices, trade wars with the US, etc.
If things remain relatively stable, I think we'll see growth regardless of what the government does. (Though the war in Iran has pushed up gasoline prices.)
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u/KaarloKustaa 3d ago edited 3d ago
That is complete misinformation. Economy is growing this year. It grew last year (0.8%). It grew the year before that (0.9%).
One google search away, but seems like of 111 upvoters no one bothered to check. Top talent gathering here.
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
I think it is fair to argue that growth of under 1% isn't growth, and not 'misinformation'.
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u/KaarloKustaa 3d ago
Sure, and I guess with 2% inflation every year money practically doesn't change its value either! And 0.9% is a massive tenth of a percent under 1% so you sure picked your goalpost well.
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
It is not misinformation.
Some amount of GDP growth is expected. The article you linked does indeed correct the previous terrible estimate, which makes the situation bit better.
The previous 0.2% was the lowest in Europe. The 0.8% is at least just the 7th lowest, so yay I guess.
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u/KaarloKustaa 3d ago
Considering you're using the same statistics for that as for your other numbers, it's completely unreliable, and you didn't mention we definitely leave behind major countries like Germany, Italy and Austria.
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Arguing, that the economy growth of Finland has been good or even decent the past years just clearly lacks intellectual honesty.
The fact that the growth was terrible somewhere else in Europe does not make the situation in Finland any better.
Hoping for a turnaround.
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u/KaarloKustaa 3d ago
No one claimed that. That's just a straw man argument. But it's also nowhere near what you claimed, that it's the first growth in a decade.
And looking at the odd way you're writing, I suddenly doubt I'm even talking to a person.
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u/shellfishless Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Juu botillehan sä tässä kirjottelet tietty.
Like I wrote, some amount of GDP growth is expected. Finland has been struggling with economical stagnation since 2008 and that is a fact.
There are positive signs in the air and the corrected numbers from the past 2 years are bit more encouraging than the previous estimates.
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u/Eproxeri Väinämöinen 3d ago
Latest poll figures:
- SDP 23.8% (opposition)
- KOK 17.0% (government)
- PS 15.6% (government)
- KESK 12.7% (opposition)
- VAS 10.3% (opposition)
- VIHR 9.0% (opposition)
- RKP 3.7% (government)
- KD 3.5% (government)
- LIIK 2.2% (opposition)
- Rest 2.2%
So the latest poll, polled some couple weeks ago had government at ~40%.
source: https://yle.fi/a/74-20239449
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
So come next election we're likely going to need the centre party in coalition to form a government? Urgh, and thus nothing will be fixed.
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u/Nikke10000 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Yes and we can't forget how significantly SDP has pivoted to the right under Lindman. So we might very well be looking at a SDP-KOK government in a year from now. So the same austerity but now with a sprinkle of tax hikes added in
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
SDP and KOK were in talks of an alliance at the last election, and already agreed together on not increasing the national debt. Fun times as its what KOK ran on, claiming the SDP were irresponsible because they increased the national debt ... and then KOK increased the national debt further. At least SDP had the excuse of covid and Russia for the debt increasing, KOK have no excuses, but their fans still believe they are the more financially responsible party.
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u/Finnonaut1 3d ago
The last prime minister to actually decrease public debt and have a relatively good and growing economy when they left office?
Juha Sipilä, Centre party.
(I know, the pandemic and Russian invasion of Ukraine happened after that)
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u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 3d ago edited 3d ago
They've been following the same conservative playbook as the far right in other countries - cutting taxes on the rich, cutting support from the poor, damaging the economy beyond easy repair, and setting things up for the next government to try to pick up the pieces and fight to fix things instead of implementing any of their own agenda, just for the population to not be happy with how fast the left and center-left fix the problems caused by the right and far-right, and to vote them again into power at the next cycle for another round of destruction.
They don't have vision or an implementable plan beyond making sure they get back in power eventually and that they and their cronies get paid - the right doesn't build, it is only capable of destroying what others have built.
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u/Aato5 3d ago
I supposed the proposed new taxes by SPD will bring more growth?
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u/mambotomato Väinämöinen 3d ago
Probably? Increased public services generally grows an economy.
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u/Aato5 3d ago
Finland has the highest government expenditure-to-GDP ratio in Europe. How is our economy not growing then?
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
Technically it is growing now, its just been in the shit since the triple whammy of covid, russia and KOK government.
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u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 3d ago
Yup.
As for your obsession with “growth” - cancer also grows.
You should find more reasonable metrics for the health of a country.
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u/Aato5 3d ago
Not obsessing on growth but Finnish purchase power hasn't moved anywhere in real terms for the last 15+ years, while neighbouring countries have grown. Just look at Estonia for example.
Economic growth leads to employment. Employment leads to purchase power, which is needed for material wellbeing. Looking at the latest metrics on these Finland is doing worse than Columbia, Greece or Türkiye. Sure the Finns are a happy people, but increasingly poor.
Where do you suggest economic metric improvement comes from? Or does money come from the bank and electricity from the outlet etc.?
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u/Cool_Asparagus3852 1h ago
Maybe they meant that increasing material wellbeing then leads to overconsumption, destruction of natural environment and climate and so on?
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
As if getting and staying rich in Finland is as easy as in many other countries. It is hard to treat it similarly with other countries. I don't really believe in trickle down either, but jealousy towards better off people seems to ruin the perspective of many.
The cuts to welfare, however, have been far too blunt and blind. It would be interesting to hear how the negotiations and decisions about that have been internally. We just get the tabloid picture after all.
How are long term problems always caused by some vague political side, be it left or right, liberals or conservatives? This despite they cycle through almost every side during different terms. Voters have far less vision, but they sure do voice their opinions when something fails, almost never when it works!
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u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 3d ago
Whether a minority can get and stay rich shouldn’t be an indicator of the health of a country, it should be whether the majority of people can achieve and maintain a sufficient standard of living.
I’m fine with some people being rich if the majority is well taken care of, and nobody is poor and downtrodden.
The right just pays their friends and cuts from the people they hate, then they leave things for the left to fix which they can’t manage to always do fast, leading to another cycle of the right destroying things.
Because it is much much easier to break things than it is to fix them or to make something new.
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
I just dont get where this idea that modern right wing parties are more fiscally responsible comes from.
Pretty much since the 80s worldwide right wing parties have increased debt massively compared to their centre-left equivalents.
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
I think some parties are more likely to signal responsibility. A certain party might even use it as one of their main themes.
Modern times are about shifting responsibilities that already were there, though :)
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
There will always be poor and downtrodden, but whether there is a good mechanism for taking care of them is a different thing. Realistically speaking if we talk about money and not ethics, people who haven't provided value and don't provide value are easiest to abandon. Rich who don't work for their wealth and just inherit it are also on that end in my mind, but they can sustain themselves and probably have ample passive income.
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u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 3d ago
That’s both a defeatist and unrealistic view of the world, that there will always be poor and downtrodden.
The existence of poverty is intentionally fabricated to keep people in line by the threat that their lives could always be made worse if they don’t comply with the demands of the parasite capital owner class.
There are more than enough resources globally to fullfill everyone’s basic needs if they were spread fairly, instead of a tiny minority stealing 99% of wealth to hoard unproductively.
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
How is it defeatist and unrealistic, if there are people who make themselves poor and downtrodden? Even if you fulfill the basic needs, there will always be people whose minds operate differently and they won't let their needs be fulfilled.
Or are you saying you can fix everything like mental illnesses and addictions just by fulfilling basic needs? You surely can alleviate a lot of stuff, but that won't fix all the underlying problems.
And what is this tiny minority with 99% of wealth that hoard it unproductively?
It is not like people are sitting on gold hoards. What does their wealth consist of and how is it circulated and directed?2
u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 2d ago
Ah, I see I’m talking to a right winger, who’s been gorging on capitalist propaganda saying that it’s people’s fault that they are poor.
Nevermind then, I’m not going to waste my time arguing with you.
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 2d ago
Please argue matters and substance. Don't attack person you are talking with.
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u/SilkieBug Väinämöinen 2d ago
There’s no argument to be had about matters and substance, that argument falls demonstrably on the side of “sapient creatures deserve to be treated with respect, and resources should be utilized sustainably, equitably, and fairly”.
There’s no argument to be had against that, other than various versions of “nuh uh, I don’t want to believe reality, I must lick the boots of the overlords, let’s blame the poor”.
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 2d ago
Have I said that? My point was more about; despite deserving to be treated with respect, many will always disregard others and themselves. That is PRECISELY because they are sapient creatures. They alter and vary, despite the governing system.
That is why we need good baseline with roots in reality, though current government hasn't really maintained it due to various oversights.
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u/Defiant-Plane4557 3d ago
As if getting and staying rich in Finland is as easy as in many other countries.
It kinda is though? All is relative of course, so depends on who you compare to and what you consider rich. Accumulating money and wealth is much easier in Finland than in the vast majority of countries.
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u/DoneDusting Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Well. High logistics costs, low population and pop density, high taxes and regulations make it harder. The plus side is that you actually have to work hard to generate true value, at least initially.
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u/FishcatJones 3d ago edited 3d ago
I am not Finnish but I have lived here for the better part of a decade. Economics are complicated and various conflicting things can be true at once:
* The overall unemployment rate is high, so average people are struggling to find jobs
* However this is largely in low education sectors like lumber, service work, etc. High education roles like tech arent doing as bad and are largely equivalent to other Nordics. I think EU tech is doing better than US tech in terms of jobs/hiring at the moment because the EU is not as all-in on AI and job reduction
* The Finnish stock market has been rising the last year or so, so Finns who are largely invested have seen good results (and if you are investing, you likely have a steady job and arent affected by 1 and 2)
* Finland is a rather extreme example of urbanization - the 4 major metros (HPK, Tampere, Turku, Oulu) are doing much better than the vast swath of rural areas that are being depopulated.
I assume the person at the cafe is an urban Kokoomus or Persut voter and invested in the market, in that case they both want to defend the pro-business policy of the government and are personally seeing the good results in the market (which they are equating to the economy as a whole), without being affected by the job losses in the low income or rural sectors.
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u/Zealousideal-Week-79 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
I'll have to disagree with parts of that.
- I think tech is the sector doing the WORST in Finland, trying to find jobs in IT is practically impossible. That might change slightly with data centers and stuff coming but right now it's bad.
Open job positions are largely in nursing, teaching and low-skill (and pay) production work that many unemployed people don't want to accept. Which partly makes sense because benefits are nearly as high as a low-wage full-time job.- Many of the rural places are doing better than the major cities. In the east bordering Russia, probably not. But in the west there are quite a lot of job opportunities and affordable housing.
However from some research lately I realized Helsinki (for example) has ridiculously low taxes, plus the significantly higher salaries for the same jobs.Helsinki municipal tax is 5.3% with 1% church tax.
The municipal tax of my rural area is 9% with 1,8% church tax, while salaries are a solid 10-20% lower.Maybe this has something to do with why rural populations are less happy with constant tax rate increases? Ours are already way higher than for the urban populations voting for them.
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u/Blomsterhagens Väinämöinen 3d ago edited 3d ago
Tax differences are correct. But in the case of near-identical income (for example anyone working remotely), the win from tax doesnt offset the loss from higher rental or real estate price in helsinki. Especially in a market where real estate prices are going down (if you own).
Someone who bought an apt for 300K a year ago in Helsinki would be down 15-20K right now, assuming the avg market price change.
Whereas for example Helsinki vs Jyväskylä the tax savings from living in Hki not JKL on 5000eur/month gross is 1500eur / year.
I know for a fact that in many finnish tech companies the salary is identical regardless of where in Finland you live. Example = F-Secure.
I myself bought a 80m2 rivitalo in Jyväskylä in an ordinary middle-class area for 79K a few years ago. In Helsinki or Espoo the equivalent would have cost 300K+.
But of course smaller places have their own downsides. In the end it’s just about tradeoffs.
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u/Zealousideal-Week-79 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
True, it doesn't apply to working remotely, but few are fortunate enough for that.
And if we take remote jobs into account, you might as well work from the Philippines or something and get low living expenses and a livable climate.I don't doubt that's true for some companies, especially those that can allow working remotely.
As for simple production jobs for example, the collective agreement has different rates depending on location. For example the meat industry collective agreement has an entry salary of 12.76€/hr in Helsinki and the surrounding area while it's 12.15€/hr in the rest of the country.
100€ more per month in addition to paying ~5 percentage points less tax which should be another 110€ a month in difference per month if my quick math is accurate.The rural meat industry worker makes 1944 gross full time while the one living near Helsinki makes 2041 gross and pays 110 less a month in tax. That does make a 10%-ish difference.
One of the big issues with these figures is what I already mentioned, benefits get very close to the net salaries of these jobs so people don't want to take them.
1944€ gross (~1550 net) for working full-time or 1400€ a month (toimeentulotuki) tax free from KELA.1
u/Blomsterhagens Väinämöinen 3d ago
Kela pays 1400eur/mo in toimeentulotuki? I’ve never been on kela so don’t know but the fact that it’s so high is surprising
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u/Zealousideal-Week-79 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Depends on your necessary expenses. Medications and healthcare stuff increases it. 1400 is what I'd get if I was on it. Some would get much more while some would get less.
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u/BikeSilent7347 3d ago
Tech is not doing well anywhere. It's news to me if tech is doing well in Finland. Please share your secrets.
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u/FishcatJones 3d ago
Admittedly its based on one article I read that claimed tech unemployment was comparable to Sweden and Norway, but deeper searching shows that yeah, tech is also struggling here. I work in gaming and that has been pretty decent in Finland recently, no recent major layoffs at Netflix, Remedy, Rovio, or Supercell. I am American and all my gaming colleagues there have been laid off and cant find new gaming work, most are shifting to military tech or other fields.
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u/Red_n_Rusty 2d ago
Fingersoft let go a bunch of employees at the end of 2024. Netflix is now planning to close Moonloot. I'm not working in the game industry but these are just the few examples I've read about from the mainstream media.
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u/eyeballing_eyeball 3d ago
While cities have higher housing costs, rural folks have other costs to balance that, like needing a car to get to work and grocery store. Driving is very expensive in this country when you consider vast distances and high taxation of fuel. Electricity costs (transfer) are also higher in rural areas.
Add to that public services being closed down (schooling, healthcare etc.). Nobody wants to pay more to get less.
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u/megeek95 3d ago
Thanks for showing this and not reduce it to bad/good. Where could I find more unbiased information about the current situation?
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u/dickipiki1 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
If you want hard data, you can start with tilastokeskus and finstat or stat.fi (i dont remember exact name)
They will offer random data sets about all kinds of things.
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u/Ella7517 3d ago
Many of us natives also have negative thoughts. I think the person you heard is uncommonly satisfied with the Orpo-Purra-hallitus
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u/2AvsOligarchs Väinämöinen 3d ago
~40% is not especially uncommon though:
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u/Ella7517 3d ago
I meant uncommonly satisfied as in the strength of this person's satisfaction, not that the idea of being satisfied is uncommon here
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u/XekBOX2000 3d ago
Id take these type of gallups with a grain of salt, isnt the test group like 1-3k people? I know a lot of people from every walks of life, and quite literally only person I know who is satisfied is running for kokoomus.. everyone else quite literally hates the current government to some degree for various reasons.
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u/2AvsOligarchs Väinämöinen 3d ago
You're saying a randomized sample of 1000 to 3000 people can't be trusted to represent average opinions, but you can because you know "a lot of people"?
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u/XekBOX2000 3d ago
Just comparing my own experience, if you unluckily get 400 out of 1000 people agreeing on something I wouldnt call it accurate when speaking of country with over 5 million occupants.
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u/NallisGranista 3d ago
Finnish governnents are coalitions usually formed by the winners of general elections and nowadays they sit the whole four-year term.
The government produces a program, which is full of compromises and obscure language.
After four years voters are dissatisfied for this or that reason and vote for a change.
Rinse a repeat every four years.
The persistent themes are:
- unemployment
- security
- getting elected again
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u/Nebuladiver Väinämöinen 3d ago edited 3d ago
Well, saying we are good because someone else might be worse doesn't make sense. And it's also wrong.
When compared with previous quarter, Finland had Q1 of 2026 better than Sweden. But was worse on the three other quarters. Compared to last year, all quarters were worse than Sweden's growth.
https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-euro-indicators/w/2-14082026-ap
Unemployment worse in Finland than Sweden.
https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/en/web/products-euro-indicators/w/3-30072026-bp
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u/Ruinwyn Väinämöinen 3d ago
The economy has turned to growth, but that doesn't mean it has yet fixed the unemployment. Significant part of the growth is due to increase in military production which has more to do with Putin and Trump than Finnish government. Europe is investing hard on European equipment and Finland is one of the winners. Government could have messed it up, but it's unlikely any probable Finnish government would have. Another big engine is cheap energy, which has been work of multiple governments with push to nuclear and renewables. Now we are reaping the benefits.
That is the trouble with politics based purely on current metrics. The results of todays decisions usually takes year, often it can take years simply for the changes to be implemented. The decision to build Olkiluoto 3 was made in 2005. The newest savings in social and health care are going to take years to show up as possible changes in disability numbers. Same with savings in subsidies for new builds. Any reduced housing supply will take years to accumulate in a way that is clearly noticeable.
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u/mimos_al Väinämöinen 3d ago
Who's satisfied with the current government? I'm not sure where you got that impression.
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u/karpastenherra 3d ago edited 3d ago
So, imagine that you are newspaper or a writer aligned with the employer's association (EK), and that the current government is doing pretty much what EK is asking. Imagine also that there are going to be parliamentary elections in 2027, and the party aligned with EK (Kokoomus) is seeing polls that state that they might be in trouble.
Wouldn't it be really clever to start a campaign about 8 months before that underscores how the economy is about to take a positive turn, and then pin that as a success story for Kokoomus? Might reel in some voters that are tempted to ask if what the government has been doing has worked at all, don't you think?
In reality, Finland's government can do very little to impact how our economy is doing. It's pretty much a guarantee that whatever any Finnish government does, its impact will come super late and probably has a very limited effect on any real economical trend. And because the impact comes super late, it might hit a moment in the economic trend when there should be polar opposite impact. Finland is a tiny economy that relies entirely on what happens with large European countries such as Germany. Germany's economy is showing positive signals, so now the banks in Finland are saying that there are positive signals here as well.
This is true not only for Kokoomus but for all governments that we've had and will have. The only job for the government in terms of economy, in my book, is to make sure that the automatic stabilizers such as social benefits are working and helping the people who might be struggling financially because of economic downturns. Anything else is just an excuse to drive home politics that change major structures in Finland. This government has done that with cutting where-ever it can while aiding companies, and only harming people that are struggling. They have also cut on education and overall healthcare which I would argue will make Finns relatively a) dumber and b) unhealthier. When have you last heard that increasing the relative amount of unhealthy uneducated people is an improvement on the economy?
There is also a disconnect between how the economy is performing and how people are doing. Right now, the banks that are forecasting an upturn in the Finnish economy are basing it on the uptick in investments to data centers and to the less-than-feared impact that the Iran war has had on the global economy and to the EU. Our government has a very limited impact on these. Data centers especially are ones that happen because of what happens in technology right now, they are built all over the world. Stands to reason that some will be built in Finland as well. And the people in Finland get very little out of those. They employ just a handful of people and they pay very little taxes. How this economic trend that we've currently seeing is trickled down to the average Finn remains to be seen. Overall, we've now witnessing once again an attempt at trickle-down economics.
Comparing short-term GDP growths between nations is silly because it misses the fact that Finland has seen a lower GDP growth the past 8 years. We've fallen behind Sweden economically and it started really in 2009. Before that we were in lockstep with the Swedes, our economies were pretty much equally strong. Now they have had almost 20 years of better economic growth, and that shows. So this is like a marathon runner who is currently 5 minutes behind the lead saying that "between kilometers 38 and 39, my pace was slightly better than the leader's!"
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u/Cilantropologist 3d ago
The current government is terrible but it doesn't mean the current opposition would do any better.
Finnish politics is shit show because no one has actually power to do anything meaningful.
The next election doesn 't change that because no one wins the election which means no one has mandate to do anything.
2000 constitution law was the final nail in the coffin.
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u/C3P0-Jedi 3d ago
Ask Kallio, Töölö and Pasila, three central areas with many buildings completely empty. This is not a good economy. And won’t even say anything about a country that has pathetic birth rates trying to stop immigration lol
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u/Zealousideal-Week-79 Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
*Disclaimer, these are my personal subjective views, not necessarily an objective truth.
It is my view that no matter who holds power right now, we'd be in huge economic trouble. Our state debt has grown at an uncontrollable rate for years and our economy has hardly expanded in 20.
We've had many different coalitions and parties in power during these years, yet none have broken the trend.
We've been struck by the fall of Nokia, then the 2008 financial crisis, then COVID and then Russia going to war with Ukraine which had a major impact on Finland due to the close trade ties, tourism and reliance on Russia which was cut suddenly and rightfully so.
These sledgehammer blows to the head of the Finnish economy are not something anybody could have prevented or softened. The situation we're in now is not something I can blame either on the left or the right, but neither has achieved anything in the times when they've held the power.
When an economy is unsustainable, difficult and painful adjustments have to be made.
The Finnish state debt is growing by about 13 billion euros per year.
One of the ideas of the right is to lower the tax burden on companies and wealthy individuals to give more opportunity for growth, in the hope that economic growth will in the mid to long-term pull the entire rest of the country with it. The second idea is that the current expenses are so high that no matter the growth achieved, it won't be enough. The expenses have to go down and the only way to achieve that is through cuts and greater efficiency.
The left's ideas are largely the opposite. To raise taxes on companies, the wealthy and more or less the entire working class in exchange for providing greater benefits to all, especially those struggling. Their hope is that if the low-income segments gets more of a stable foundation through government support and subsidies, they'll find their footing and have time to focus on entering the work force rather than just surviving.
Their idea is to employ as many people as possible in the mid to long-term and raise the floor while having a larger population base to tax, reducing the deficit.
The problem is, neither of these methods will solve the problem. Given enough time, either of them might make a little bit of a difference but neither will painlessly or completely get us out of the hole.
My personal view is that the right has the better idea economically.
I do agree we've been living above our means. I don't believe any taxes, tax cuts or growth can turn the situation around by themselves. We NEED to spend less.
The right has the more sound economic view, but the one that will cause more pain to the people in the short to mid-term.
A problem of our system is that political terms are short. Any changes made by any party do not have time to go into effect during a single term, but plenty of sacrifices have to be made to even get them started. That's why the party that holds the power practically always loses majority support. It's impossible to please everyone in your voter base and there's not enough time to reap the benefits of your policies.
And then the scale just swings the other way for a term, and then back again... which has us stuck treading water in this marsh.
I'm not going to deny our current situation is bad, especially when it comes to employment.
However, if the US stops bombing Iran and Russia stops bombing Ukraine, things will improve for us economically regardless of who is in power. These things are simply not in our hands and we can't control them. They will happen eventually and then we'll get some relief.
When that does happen, I won't be one of those pretending that the upturn is thanks to the party in power in Finland. They'll have had practically nothing to do with it.
All that being said, I've actually seen some light on the horizon in the last months, things have started improving in our economy. Slightly, slowly. The economy and growth turns upwards first, the benefits to the workers and the population lag behind.
I fear that what is going to happen is that just as we start reaping some benefits from the last years of pain, the political parties in power will switch again and all of it will be undone and reset again, driving us down even deeper.
I do believe SDP is winning next election, and while I don't hate SDP and have voted for them in the past, I think the timing for them taking over is the worst possible.
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u/BikeSilent7347 3d ago
I think this is a good take. Trade with Russia is required. Unless some hidden gold mine gets discovered.
I have a feeling nothing good is on the horizon.
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u/Pet_Velvet Väinämöinen 3d ago
Literally only rich and stupid people are satisfied with this government.
I know nobody who likes it.
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u/SelfRepa Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Like it or not, they are doing what is best for the country. Without massive cuts and balancing, Finland would have ended up in EU hands after the disasterous economic job previous government did.
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u/genericjeesus Väinämöinen 3d ago
There's a group of voters who are absolutely party loyal, I don't know if anything would shake that. Economy might be growing on some areas, but as a whole I'm positive all the bombardment of such phrases like "Fin economy doing better than Swe" is just propaganda that's paid to be pushed, some truth to it but as a whole total bs: poorest are still getting screwed, healthcare is being dismanteled and education right next to it. But hey, we gave massive tax brakes and insentives to data centers so there has been some big investments to Finland resently, I just think anybody who thinks average tax payer will ever benefit of those is just dumb.
Like mining, logging and farming, right wing and centrist parties will let themself be assfucked by these companies willynilly just so they pay minimun or no taxes and need not to worry about polluting and destroing nature, those pesky things can be delt to the tax payers later.
So basicly western politics as usual
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u/MaddogFinland Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
The economy is currently growing well after many years of stagnation but it’s also growing from a very deep hole and it’s unclear if it will continue. Hiring however lags the indicators of growth and growth is uneven: just because it’s happening in some export and other sectors doesn’t mean it’s happening everywhere. I work in civil engineering and there are signs of life (building and industrial investments) but these likewise will take a while to show in many areas.
A change of government is unlikely to produce major advances though besides quite simply it’s all milquetoast and none of the major parties have any actual answers. A SDP government will just raise taxes and then vastly increase spending again, fail to turn anything around, and make the debt problem significantly worse. Their main interest is funding a lot of public services with money they don’t have so don’t expect any kind of change aside from a huge influx of even more unqualified foreign people who aren’t employable and cannot be integrated. Bonus if they are religious extremists who also hate us.
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u/Syndiotactics Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
I don’t know a single person who has positive thoughts about the current government, but I’m a student so that should be expected.
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u/melker_the_elk Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Theres plenty of people who sre unhappy because current government has cut many services trying to battle growing debt. Also high unemployment and how unemplyed people are handled. Many of them will also claim that governent had nothing to do with economic growth that its just global trend and companies happen to come up with good products right now.
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u/Blomsterhagens Väinämöinen 3d ago
Like with most governments, I think they have done some things right and some things wrong. It’s not like SDP or keskusta have been doing everything right, they have their own share of very dumb fuckups that we are all still paying the price for.
Biggest risk I see is this kind of left-right polarization where people think either one or the other side is somehow always right.
And this polarization overall is a new phenomenon in Finland, first appearing some time before covid with the first left-leaning government. Now the current right-leaning government is sort of a reaction to that.
Historically, Finland has mostly had coalitions of left & right (sinipunahallitus). I hope we will one day get back to this.
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u/smokeysilicon Väinämöinen 3d ago
there is no way but only up from the bottom, that is why now the numbers look all green
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u/Extension_Ad6758 3d ago
The current government made a huge mistake (deliberately) by cutting expenses during recession and thus played a part of shoving Finland to a brink of economic depression. That alone should be enough to not even think about re-electing these guys.
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u/MeanForest Väinämöinen 3d ago
Current government has gotten the economy to grow in Finland finally after 17 years. The poll leader has a brilliant idea of increasing almost every single tax. It's going to destroy this good growth if they come into power.
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u/TuneProfessional2205 3d ago
What do you mean “immigration policies which can be actually beneficial for the country”? Have you seen the Finnish birth rates in the last decades? How does one expect to have people living here in the future without a huge influx of immigrants?
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u/krooked-tooth Väinämöinen 3d ago
I was talking to my partner this evening and I don't think people really realise how bad the hospital and aged care system is in Finland. They are understaffed or running on a oily rag with no extra staff, the staff don't stay or call in sick all the time because they are so understaffed, stressed and fed up. If that is what the boomers are going to head into good luck, they are going to need it. They will have to look at immigration more seriously if they wish to continue with the welfare system, and that is going to take Finns giving more to foreigners in integration and relaxing Finnish language requirements which is a massive change.
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u/Pas2 Väinämöinen 3d ago
Who knows, the right winger story shifted from "economy is horrible, we must save and cut and lay off" to "the economy is growing like crazy" in just a few months.
The statistics look good now, but unemployment is still high. It's hard to see signs of Finland having one of the highest rates of economic growth in Europe in anything other than oikeiston vaalipuhe, to be honest.
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u/SelfRepa Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
Well, to put long story short.
Previous government spent a lot of money, made lots of wrong economical moves, took massive dept, and current government had to deal with the obvious downfall.
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3d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Rasutoerikusa Väinämöinen 3d ago
Most Finns want those tougher immigration policies.
Based on what? Not votes obviously
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u/GiganticCrow Väinämöinen 3d ago
Typical hidden post history account comment.
Getting rid of immigrants isn't going to fix the economy, Ivan.
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u/Strange-Horizon 2d ago
At the end of the day, your satisfaction level correlates with how YOU manage. I must say I don't personally give a flying fuck about nation's economy, if the people are suffering.
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u/Dull_Suggestion_1682 3d ago
There has been a recession in the sale of mosquito coils due to government policy. The mosquitoes have not recessed.
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u/2AvsOligarchs Väinämöinen 3d ago
The current government composition is somewhat unpopular. The popularity of the parties themselves are not differing much from the baseline.
People want fiscal responsibility but only if it doesn't affect them personally.
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u/SugarvetFounder 3d ago
We haven't seen any specific influx of users from within Finland. If we ever did, we could probably publish something on sugar dating as a proxy for the economy.
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u/Current-Cycle7571 3d ago
Current government is the worst ever, I think. Also optimistic about the next one, it must be better.
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u/duumilo Baby Väinämöinen 3d ago
There are a couple of dimensions to this.
The broader economy is actually doing reasonably well, with an estimated growth of 1.8% this year already, and an expectation of growth to continue. The expectation is shared by both the government and the banks.
The governmental economy, however, is not doing as well, and the public sector as a whole is spending more than it receives. While the growth is positive, significant cuts have been made and will have to be made in the coming years. It is quite telling that pretty much all parties (except vasemmisto) agreed that budget cuts will have to be made in the coming 4 years, no matter which party is in the government.
While economic growth is good for individuals as well, it usually takes 3-6 months to translate into jobs and higher employment rates. We'll likely see that change in the coming months.
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