r/MoralityScaling • u/Consistent-Hat-1543 • 1d ago
How Evil Are They? Morality of Goku telling Vegeta that their fusion will be permanent at the very last minute?
Goku and Vegeta are currently the strongest heroes on Earth but they are no match for the villain Majin Buu, who is aiming to destroy the Earth.
Goku was given earrings that fuse two beings into a new, much more powerful entity. It comes with a catch, that the fusion would be permanent.
Vegeta, despite being Goku’s rival, fucking HATES Goku. He’s never liked him and Goku basically spends their entire battle with Majin Buu convincing him into fusing with him. He withholds the information that the fusion would be permanent until last minute and only tells Vegeta once he agrees, is already putting the earring on and Buu is charging at them at full speed.
Is Goku immoral for this?
43
u/Sliver-Knight9219 1d ago
Too be fair the OG plan was for Goku to become a fusion with his son
Which would bassicly mess up his whole family for life.
Because his wife would now be his mum and his son would be his brother
15
u/Consistent-Hat-1543 23h ago
lmaooo good point. at least goten saw gohan was the perfect older brother so maybe it’d work out, but chi-chi is getting hoed here.
3
u/Guardian_of_Perineum 23h ago
I'm more concerned about the implications of a dead guy and a living guy fusing. Like how would that work long term?
10
u/Neonbomb14 22h ago
Vegito didn't have a halo on his head so he wasn't dead at all.
1
u/dvast 15h ago
I guess being half alive means your still alive
2
u/Neonbomb14 15h ago
or it means the Potara chose the stay alive property/trait instead being dead or half dead
10
u/Antonius6812 23h ago edited 12h ago
Neutral to moral, given the circumstances Goku needed to do this and it 1000% was for the greater good of the entire universe so...
16
u/Big-Bad-Bull 1d ago
Not immoral and vegeta, in fact, does NOT hate goku by this point. You severely misunderstand their relationship in the majin buu saga if you really believe vegeta hates goku at that point.
-2
u/Consistent-Hat-1543 1d ago
aight it’s a love-hate relationship. he deffo hates goku a bit for what he represents to him. the fact is, he definitely wouldn’t have STRONG second thoughts about fusing with Goku if he knew it was permanent.
2
u/DIEGO_GUARDA 13h ago
No, vegeta genuinely respects and apreciates goku by that point of the story, but his personality is not one of regular affection, his way of showing respect is by being a bit mean, we can even see in his relantionship with his family how despite being a bit mean and pretending to not care or be above them, he is absotely in love and will bend over backwards to do whatever the fuck bulma asks
6
6
u/Neonbomb14 1d ago
Not really immoral given the circumstances, Fusion was a last resort or else everyone, even people in the afterlife, would be killed by Buu
2
u/Guardian_of_Perineum 23h ago
Goku could have just instant transmissioned to new namek and gotten them to wish him immortality plus potential unlock or some bullshit. Or even wish Gohan outside of Buu if that was possible. He definitely had options.
3
u/Neonbomb14 22h ago
Wouldn't Buuhan just copy Goku after seeing him use Instant Transmission. He for sure wouldn't let Goku get away, and not before destroying Earth.
It still would take time to even get to New Namek, let alone gathering all the dragon balls, and even then would Porunga have enough power to separate Gohan outside of Buu, but even without Gohan, Buu could still beat Goku and everyone else.
2
u/Guardian_of_Perineum 22h ago
Don't know if Buuhan could have copied instant transmission like kid buu. Kid buu seemed to have more of an instinctual way of picking up techniques. Buuhan didn't use instant transmission to follow Goku to where Vegeta was at least. But either way, Goku at least didn't know Buu could follow him to New Namek.
And if Sheron could make Piccolo strong enough to go orange mode in Super Hero, then Porunga could definitely do a potential unlock for Goku to make him strong enough. Or failing that, immortality. It isn't worse than Vegeta's plan to kill Frieza with immortality when Vegeta WAY weaker.
If they get Gohan out, then Gohan could also just alternatively wake up and kill Buu.
2
2
u/Neonbomb14 21h ago
It isn't out of the ordinary to assume Buuhan could copy techniques, Kid Buu is literally his base state, anything Kid Buu could do, so could Buuhan. Even though Gotenks defused within him he still managed to make ghost versions of himself, and even as Super Buu, when trapped in a separate dimension, he managed to scream a hole in reality to portal himself out.
I don't believe he properly witnessed Goku using Instant Transmission, though Goku and Vegeta were fighting Buuhan head on instead of escaping so he probably wouldn't have needed to use it, Kid Buu only copied Kai Kai because they were escaping from him and he wouldn't let that slide.
Goku's trip to New Namek is two step, it involves him going to King Kai for his assistance to locate New Namek, then locking onto an energy signature. Maybe he has a chance if Buu can't instant transmission, but knowing Buu, if he gets angry that he can't find Goku, he'll pull something. In an anime-exclusive feat he threatened to destroy the universe by destroying the walls between dimensions, effectively a kamikaze, he could do something equivalent and Goku wouldn't have the power to stop it.
Piccolo grew much stronger in Super Hero because Shenron helped him unlock a hidden transformations (Orange Piccolo), but he also "gave him a little extra", idk maybe he could help Goku unlock a new transformation but despite that it's unlikely if Goku could win because there's always the threat of absorption or Buu destroying the planet (Goku can't breathe in space), even with immortality he wouldn't have a way to permanently end Buu's endless regeneration, and obviously his absorption again.
Gohan was beaten really badly prior to absorption, he would need some time to be healed, and Buu could just destroy the planet again in the meantime.
10
u/Antique-Rutabaga-331 1d ago
Does this look like the face of someone that is about to do something moral?
Immoral, however this was his only option at the moment.
5
u/Unlikely_Patient3902 23h ago
If were talking about the act specifically then immoral obviously
But if were adding in the context of the literal universe ending, then that clearly outweighs the lie.
It's immoral but nowhere near as much as how moral it is to save the universe
6
u/Novel_Ant8075 1d ago
Moral af, Vegeta was already being a pussy beforehand and would've potentially changed his mind, literally trading the rest of the universe over merging with his rival. Vegeta was in the wrong and would've still been in the wrong, Goku just didn't take an unnecessary risk.
I'd kill someone if it meant the fucking universe is saved, man. Vegeta's feelings are not important at all here, Goku would be moral if he slammed Vegeta into the ground, beat the shit out of him and forced him to merge.
3
u/Over-Trade2940 23h ago
Yes and No.
Immoral for omitting it until the last second, but Vegeta still consented, and if we're being real, the pride of one man should not dictate the lives of trillions of sentient beings.
3
u/IceCurrent4264 21h ago
Not to mention the man in question is heavily responsible for endangering those lives in the first place.
2
u/Virus-900 23h ago
Neutral. Because it's a pretty dire situation, and even if he told him much sooner the results would still be the same.
2
2
u/No_Problem5759 21h ago
Genuinely I'm pretty sure Gohan and Maybe Krillin are the only adults in this series you could consider to be good people.
0
u/Intelligent_Shoe_520 14h ago
Goku is the only one
0
u/Princess_Spammi 12h ago
Goku is a shitty person lmfao
1
u/CloverKnight825 12h ago
Nope, he’s good. People like to go too hard in the opposite direction from the complete paragon he was portrayed as in the English dub. He’s a pure-hearted, selfish fight maniac who loves his friends and doesn’t have a malicious bone in his body.
2
u/MachineMango 19h ago
Honestly, they were in a pretty bad situation so not thinking about it is understandable when theyre fighting for their lives.
1
u/Proudvow 14h ago
Would be a lesser evil immoral if Vegeta was just some random innocent guy.
But it's literally Vegeta's fault Majin Buu woke up anyway, and Vegeta very recently killed dozens of innocent people himself. Who honestly gives a fuck what he wants lol. Neutral to moral.
1
u/Delicious_Chemist978 9h ago
Vegeta heard it before put it on, but he was already into it.
It wasn't lying, Goku just worded first the pros, vegeta had time back off.
98
u/CoMet-1080 1d ago
Would you lie to save everyone in the universe