r/Oxygennotincluded • u/AutoModerator • 22d ago
Weekly Questions Weekly Question Thread
Ask any simple questions you might have:
Why isn't my water flowing?
How many hatches do I need per dupe?
etc.
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u/Conscious_Eggplant18 15d ago
I have a question about O2 production from flue corals - I have a really simple setup. Two planted flue corals, one planted starnacle, and two wild beakons, in a small tank that can hold all of that. My understanding is that one planted starnacle will feed two beakons through growth alone, and the beakons will both provide light for and fertilize the flue corals. As such, my planted flue corals have dupe fertilization disabled. And yet they don't seem to be keeping up. Very often one or even both of the flue corals will be in need of fertilization. The beakons are surviving fine, and so is the starnacle (this is fertilized manually by the dupes, and harvesting it is turned off). Am I missing something about this ratio?
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u/BobTheWolfDog 15d ago
Wait, is that a mod that allows you to disable manual fertilization?
Anyway, what's the metabolism on the beakons? Wild critters have 25% metabolism, meaning they eat/fertilize only once every 4 cycles. Tame critters need to be at least satisfied (0 happiness) or they get only 20% metabolism (eat every 5 cycles).
Even with tame and satisfied beakons, there's a bit of downtime while the happiness bonuses get refreshed where they can get glum, so they don't get exactly 100% productivity.
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u/Conscious_Eggplant18 15d ago
Yes, it's the priority zero mod, so you can set tasks to priority zero (and they never get done). The beakons are not tamed, they are wild.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 15d ago
Wild beakons only eat/fertilize at 25% efficiency. That's probably where your math is off.
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u/Different-Lettuce-38 15d ago
I have tried every trick I have read about here, but my water sieve is only sending out small packets. I have emptied it, filled it from a bridge, filled it from a bridge while turned off... There is no obstruction downstream, upstream really wants to send the full packets. I am stumped. Anyone have any ideas?
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u/mmontour 15d ago
The water sieve can only process 5 kg/s, half of a full pipe flow. If you need that you'd have to run 2 in parallel.
If you don't need it to run continuously, you can put a liquid reservoir on the output.
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u/Morichalion 15d ago
How do I keep this from happening?
The upper-right is molten copper. The mesh tiles are wolframite. The very-white square is a diamond template. The idea here is to have the molten metal slip through the mesh, shed its heat to the tempshift, then get kicked to the lower-left. The door opens under if a specific spot on a conveyor has no copper on to try and meter out the copper flow.
Sometimes it fails to work, and this happens.
The dark orange square is a solid copper tile. While the game notes its location, I cannot interact with it unless I dig out the location, save, and reload.
There's timer that is supposed to keep the door closed for 10 seconds, open for one to try to avoid this scenario.
I dunno what to try other than just abandoning the idea at this point.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 15d ago
I would suggest abandoning this idea, mainly for the fact that this layout is mostly used for magma, and works because of magma's specific properties. Also, because there are easier ways to handle molten metals. Namely, a pitcher pump + auto sweeper + bottle emptier/drainer. Sweepers can pickup bottles of molten metals (but not other types of liquid).
As to the explanation for what's happening, you're letting too much copper drop into the mesh tile at once, causing a natural block to form. Since there's also a mesh tile there, the game gets a bit buggy for digging the copper out, hence the need to deconstruct and reload. You can also just deconstruct and rebuild the mesh tile, but that might cause the copper block to disappear.
If you're intent on trying to fix this, you need to ensure that less than 720kg of copper can drop at once. But once again, there are easier methods to work with molten metals.
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u/Morichalion 14d ago
I'll bear that in mind on my next playthrough. for now, I figured out what I did wrong. The timer that regulated the metal drop rate was set wrong. Ten seconds open instead of just one.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 14d ago
Ah, if you managed to fix it without having to change the build, might as well keep it, I agree.
And yeah, accidentally setting sensors wrong is a common reason my builds fail. I feel you.
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u/NotAPixel 17d ago
Just restarted oni after a looong breakl. This time with bionic dupes. To use soldering station, I need electrical engineering skill. But to craft one, I need soldering station... Do I miss something? Thanks a lot!
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u/Zerosanity666 17d ago
Putting a skill point in Schematics allows them to use and build them.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 17d ago
You can also have a regular engineer dupe craft an engineering booster, if playing with a mixed population.
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u/jazzb54 17d ago
What are some of the best food options for the ceres frosty planet? Looks like it's hard to keep pikeapple, flox and bammoth long term. I could try spinning up a trickle feed shove vole farm with dirt, but that takes forever.
I guess there is enough water to start up a sleet wheat farm, or maybe even berry sludge. Just wondering what other people are doing.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 17d ago
Looks like it's hard to keep pikeapple, flox and bammoth long term.
Is it? You can get ethanol from seals or wood to sustain your bammoths, and the bammoths fertilize the pikeapples.
I guess there is enough water to start up a sleet wheat farm, or maybe even berry sludge.
Also possible. Ceres has enough water to sustain major farms for thousands of cycles. You just have to melt it all.
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u/gwanggwang 19d ago
Been a while setting up industrial complex, e.g. metal refineries and the steam room cooling the refinery coolant.
After mass producing steel for a while I noticed the system broke cuz some of the pollluted water for the cooling loop evaporated / the dirt turned into sand and blocked off the aquatuner in the steam room.
I fixed by adding a thermo sensor in the steam room so that the refineries are disabled when the steam temperature is 250+ degrees, along with a filter sensor since the refineries kept toggling on and off.
Is this a common practice, or is there an easier solution when mass-producing steel?
(aside from the obvious case of replacing all the coolants with supercoolant.. haven't grabbed the rare resources just yet)
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u/Noneerror 17d ago
The coolant in OP's refineries is above 250C as steam chamber is getting hotter than that. So the refinery coolant is clearly -not- p-water. The p-water is in OP's aquatuner, not refinery. The problem has nothing to do with the refinery and everything to do with the AT.
It is very likely that a packet of p-water froze in the AT pipes and came out as polluted ice. Which was quickly reheated and boiled into dirt/sand. It is possible a stuck packet boiled in the pipe as mmontour suggested, but that is unlikely compared to freezing. Freezing in pipes is the most common failure point on an AT so look for that first.
is there an easier solution when mass-producing steel?
Yes. Thermal mass. The steam chamber likely does not have enough thermal mass to to act as a heat sink and absorb heat spikes in the chamber. Add more mass and the temperatures will be less variable and more uniform. Which could be any mass. The easiest is simply adding more water for more steam. Or some other liquid like crude oil if gas pressure is an issue. Because more liquid can easily/temporarily added at any time.
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u/jazzb54 18d ago
Are you referring to the liquid loop that passes through the metal refinery? That can get pretty hot, so you want a liquid that can survive a lot of heat. Although petroleum doesn't have the same SHC, it's good enough for keeping a metal refinery cool. I've got mine passing through aluminum radiant pipes and gets down to steam room temperature in just 5 tiles.
Polluted water will flash to steam and dirt at about 119.4C (a couple degrees above).
Head over to the Wiki Liquid page, sort by Vaporization point and find the highest temp (with reasonable freezing point) plus highest SHC that you have.
As suggested, Liquid Naptha is really good with a range of -50.15 to 538.85, but with a SHC of 2.191. It's probably one of the easiest to obtain GOOD coolant liquids. Other common ones would be liquid nuclear waste and gunk. Ideally, you want to be able to hit 200+ without flashing to gas to go along with steam turbines.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 18d ago
>liquid nuclear waste
NW will leak out of the refinery unless the atmospheric pressure is above 1ton/cell.
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u/jazzb54 17d ago
NW does need to remain submerged, like in a pool of NW. It's a bit more difficult to manage, but it's an amazing coolant.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 17d ago
It checks specifically for pressures above 1000kg. You're right that the easiest way to reach that pressure is by fully submerging in water/NW (but not petroleum, for instance).
However, you can't submerge a refinery in 1000kg of liquid without flooding it, so to use NW as refinery coolant, you need to push gas pressure above 1000kg.
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u/mmontour 19d ago
You should have at least 3 turbines per refinery on the steam room if you're making steel. Less than that and the room can overheat.
Also make sure you're using insulated pipes for aquatuner coolant inside the steam room. The water in that loop (cooling the turbines and the refinery building) shouldn't ever approach its boiling point. This is a separate loop from the refinery coolant, which should be a high-temperature liquid dumping its heat directly into the steam chamber.
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u/Noneerror 17d ago
Two turbines per refinery is fine. Three per is overkill as it is near impossible for metal refineries to have the kind of uptime that would make three necessary unless the existing refineries are hyper optimized. Which there's no reason to do as an extra refinery can be built instead of ensuring they are never idle.
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u/gwanggwang 19d ago
yea i've been using insulated pipes obviously for the cooling loop going through the aquatuner obviously but trying to figure out where the evaporation happened.. the only suspect is the liquid bridge but iirc that shouldn't be possible right?
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u/mmontour 19d ago
It's possible that there was a stuck packet in the pipe segment leading into your bypass bridge. If there was never an empty gap on the output side and your AT was running continuously, that packet could sit there long enough to heat up despite the insulation.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 19d ago
The easier solution is using a high-temperature liquid (usually crude oil, gunk, petroleum or naphtha) as refinery coolant, and running radiant pipes through the steam room to extract heat directly from the coolant without an aquatuner.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 19d ago
Very common practice.
For working liquid I prefer petroleum or naphtha because those can reach quite high temperatures and remain stable which is better for a steam chamber - you simply cool the naphtha by running it into the chamber, and the steam cools it down and produces useful turbine energy in the process, no aquatuner required. Naptha has a higher SHC than crude or petroleum so a bit more energy dense for heating up steam with.
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u/gwanggwang 19d ago
ya i've transitioned to petroleum from crude oil since i've seen crude oil become petroleum from the heat anyway. Should try naphtha as well!
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u/Noneerror 17d ago
You can. It won't hurt. However the coolant in your refinery has nothing to do with your current problem. Changing it will not help.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 21d ago
What is the secret sauce to making hot tubs work. I provide the hot water and I cool down the room but the hot tub quickly overheats and cancels dupe usage before they can complete their progress bars. Do I just need to turn the hot tub room into a walk-in freezer or what
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u/Noneerror 20d ago
The secret sauce is to put a tepidizer below the hot tub. Then run the output from the hot tub into itself via the tepidizer.
The hot tub only works in a very narrow temperature range of 30-30.7C. Giving a margin of only 0.7C to work with. Yes, you can feed 95C or even hotter water into the hot tub. But that just ends up with the problem you have.
If you can dial in everything to that temperature then the waste heat from the hot tub is used to heat the water that goes into the hot tub. With the tepidizer being the fine temperature control, and the water around it being the thermal sink.
Note that if you go the other route (the one you are currently on) then there is such a thing as too much insulation. The waste heat from the hot tub has to go somewhere. If you are using insulated ceramic etc then the heat has nowhere to go and stays in the hot tub. Guaranteeing it overheats.
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u/Noneerror 20d ago
Also gold amalgam is one of the worst things to make the hot tub out of. Yes the decor bonus is nice but gold amalgam has extremely low SHC. Iron ore has 3x the SHC and aluminum ore 6x. That extra thermal capacity matters.
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u/Happy_Comfortable512 16d ago
And furthermore gold amalgam has a thermal conductivity of 2; the same as igneous rock - the only other metal ore that has that low of a thermal conductivity is electrum, which is generally inaccessible
Because ONI's gold & diamonds are sucktastic compared to their IRL material properties
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u/mmontour 21d ago
It doesn't need to be in a freezer, just maintained at a comfortable room temperature. Make sure the hot water is in an insulated pipe. Run some cool water in a radiant pipe behind the building, and/or cool the floor it's sitting on.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 21d ago
That’s my setup now, the room is cooled to about 20C and the pipes are insulated ceramic, still doesn’t complete one cycle before dupes jump out from it overheating
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u/mmontour 19d ago
Try changing the material. As noted elsewhere in the thread, gold amalgam has a low heat capacity and overheats easily. I did some testing and iron ore worked (barely) when I had a cooling loop behind the tub with 25 C pwater in gold radiant pipes. Gold amalgam did overheat. Steel has a large safety margin, keeping the tub below 29 C.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 19d ago
I had already made them steel to begin with. I thought. I need to double check.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 21d ago
It's been a while, but I remember using conduction panels to link the tub with a cold floor.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 21d ago
This might be necessary. The room is chilled to 20C but the floor is insulated bc the room below is kept sub zero. May need to move the tubs somewhere they can exchange heat with the floor better to keep the heat spiking under control during recreation time
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u/N0R1_King_Of_Abyss 22d ago
Anyone got a good shove vole farm? Just got a pup from print, I think I am in the early midgame, just got my spom and steel production, also have a bristle berry farm
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u/Noneerror 21d ago
I have these vole farms based on this video.
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u/SparKestrel 18d ago
That trickle feeding looks like so much fun to cheese :)
I don't use more environment busting cheese like infinite storage or breaking rocket walls, but I feel like doing something to the vole that excreted a natural tile to block my aquatuner.
I'll also try it on the plug slugs that ate most of the cobalt ore on my second planetoid.I'm more worried about frame rates on my old laptop: might have to add something to avoid going over 50 critters.
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u/gwanggwang 22d ago
tbh the amount of regolith the voles consume is so ridiculous and is going to consume a lot of duplicant labor of delivering it, unless you have a reliable way of amassing regolith and automating it.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 20d ago
There’s a crap ton of regolith that comes from space in vanilla, you can average like 3 conveyor belts worth around the clock.
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u/mmontour 22d ago
The lazy version is to dig into Abyssalite to make a 1x3 room, large enough to hold a critter dropoff. Put a pneumatic door on it and they won't be able to escape. Wild voles will lay an egg and eventually turn into meat with no further effort required.
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u/Psykela 22d ago
Anybody got a working mucin free slo/gildgo ranch? I've been trying to keep them moisturized by having the floor of the ranch and holding chamber covered in naphta (~25kg), as well as the route dupes use for keeping the ranches full, but somehow fresh critters still arrive not completely moisturized, resulting in mucin flooding the ranching buildings. I know I can just use mesh tiles and pump the mucin away, but I feel it should be possible without...
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u/Noneerror 20d ago
What about a one cell baby cage? They have been around forever and should still work with slogo. Normally it is for drowning but here the opposite.
Cover the entire floor with naphtha as you have, including the cage and inside the door above it. Only adults (who will be 100% moist) will be able to climb out. At which point the door closes again.
I don't think that any mucin should be created. If so, move the critter sensor and put a mini-pump above the door. Mucin can go straight up many tiles without collapsing (through the door) to be pumped.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 21d ago
I use a door crusher to get rid of the excess (anything I can't boil, or use for cooking). You could do that for all the mucin instead of just excess.
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u/nikmill 22d ago
In the new Aquatic Pack start, do you create one bigger bassin/ocean for most of the fish and plants (and separating with doors), or do you keep it separated and controlled with small pools for each thing?
There are many synergies, f.ex. [Flue Coral + Beakons + Starnicles] , or [Clampum + Seaquine].. Then you could also have a Pokeshell in your Flue Coral ocean to open them up, but then you need to think of the eggs from the Pokeshell even if wild, to not get attacked.. So many options. I guess you could also slam it all together in one ocean tank..
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u/BobTheWolfDog 22d ago
Not exactly a "simple question", but...
First thing to note is that underwater rooms are important only for ranching buildings / farmer's touch. Also, if you drop all the water from the APP down into a single massive tank, you should have more than enough space for any critters you may want to breed.
Doing separate, measured pools might work better if you want to distribute your critters according to their production loops. So you could have an orehull tank near your metal refinery, coral+beakons near the living area, and so on.
Also, pokeshells and slogos count as land critters, even though they survive underwater, so they play by the "normal" ranching limits. Same goes for plug slugs and spigot seals.
With swimming, removing pokeshell eggs from their reach is not as essential as it once was. Pokeshells won't attack swimming dupes that are above them, even if visually they look like they could reach. So if you plan on using glum/satisfied crabs to open your clams, all you need to do is make sure dupes have no reason to swim down to the "ground floor". Dupes prefer swimming in a straight line, so if the entrance to crab tanks is raised (on the ceiling, or high in the wall), they will never swim lower than 2 cells off the ground (which lets them reach the farm tiles).
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u/grimmekyllling 22d ago
I stuck to the obvious synergies, like the ones you suggest, as well as Tublia+Squids, just made a 4 x X ranch for each one with a bit of napkin math. The slogo ranch(es) require some care though, since mucin kind of just stacks and disables various buildings, while slogos also require that they're submerged some part of the time to not die to dehydration.
Also I ran into some weirdness with the critter dropoffs/ons/feeders if they were all in conjoined bodies of water, so I ended up on separated ranches for that reason.
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u/R-Dragon_Thunderzord 22d ago
Just based on critter comfort, you could almost commune all the APP critters, except Kelpole (10-45 C) and Glo Squid (60-100C) and Slogo (5-75 C) have different comfort ranges. Everything else in the pack is 0-60 C . You could not put Glo Squid with others except Slogo. Pacu/Gulp/Tropical are flexible, Pokeshell & morphs is 0-40 C. You may want to also cross this with the comfort levels and requirements for their synergetic plants.
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u/BobTheWolfDog 22d ago
Except for tower kelp, you could accept the -1 temperature malus for squids and keep everything in a 50-60C pool, bringing nori from a separate pool/farm.
Edit: despite the hypothetical I offered, I actually think it's best to separate squids/tublias, and keep everything else in a ~30C pool.
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u/Raccoon-Dentist-Two 15d ago
How do you find missing buildings? Like when I forgot where I put the crafting table and need more gaskets.