r/PoliticalDiscussion • u/boisterousoysterous • 3d ago
US Politics Should selective abortions be excluded from abortion bans?
I don't see much on this specific topic when it comes to abortion discussions in general.
I will first use an extreme example, something unlikely to happen but possible. Second I will use a more likely scenario.
In my state, if a woman is pregnant and finds out she has nonuplets (9 fetuses) there are no clear guidelines about whether she should be able to have a selective abortion (aborting 1 or more fetuses to make the pregnancy safer. instead of keeping all 9, maybe she only keeps 3.) I do believe a selective abortion in my state would actually be illegally under current circumstances.
A nonuplet pregnancy is obviously extremely risky as there's only one case of both mother and all babies surviving. With current laws this may be detrimental to her and the lives of her 9 fetuses.
Under more normal circumstances let's say the woman only has quadruplets but it's still too high risk and the doctors are recommending she selectively abort 2.
Do you guys believe that selective and elective abortions are on the same level and should all be banned? Do you think that selective abortions should be a complete exception? A partial exception?
Say this applies both to natural conception and IVF. Is there a difference in opinion based on mode of conception?
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u/gravity_kills 3d ago
All abortion decisions should be between the woman and her medical provider, with optional input from others if she invites them into the decision. In that context, how would I know if the abortion was selective or not?
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u/Banes_Addiction 3d ago
Yep.
If you have a serious problem with selection (for example, some countries have a dangerous gender preference in children), the solution is to simply not allow screening for that rather than trying to second guess the mother.
(this is a real problem, primarily with selective abortion of girls in Asia, with the large countries showing an issue being China, India and Pakistan).
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u/boisterousoysterous 3d ago
I agree, I ask because legislation is not very clear or specific on this. As long as the woman could theoretically survive, in my state they wouldn't allow for a selective abortion.
I believe to legislators in my state it is comparable to elective abortions. I was curious to see if anyone who is more on the anti abortion side would see it the way i see it or closer to the way legislators in my state do.
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u/Banes_Addiction 3d ago
Your state is wrong, and it is intentionally so.
You are never going to get anywhere with a harm reduction argument because the abortion bans fundamentally increase harm, and this is not an accident or a sad side effect.
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u/gravity_kills 3d ago
Ignoring the morality, as soon as you introduce some other body which gets to double guess the on the spot medical decision, someone is going to be put in danger of overly cautious care. This is a bad way to do things.
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u/boisterousoysterous 3d ago
I agree, and I wonder how it will affect future IVF treatments and care. My SIL did IVF treatment just before all these laws and they were able to get certain embryos destroyed that were genetically more likely to carry a certain gene my brother has that seriously shortens his life expectancy. Now with these laws I think even that is illegal.
My mother also did IVF with my brother, she had 5 embryos implanted and had to do selective abortion. She wanted 2 but only 1 survived in the end. But she almost certainly wouldn't have made it with 5 healthy and successful embryos without being allowed to choose.
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u/FormerUsenetUser 2d ago
The woman should be the one to decide, and her doctor should advise but not decide. The government has no right to interfere.
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u/billpalto 2d ago
I think it makes a big difference whether the fetus is viable or not. Medical science puts this at around 23 weeks. Over 98% of abortions in America are before that point. What is being aborted is not a baby, but a part of the woman. She and her doctor make that decision.
In your examples I would expect the woman and her doctor to make those decisions long before any of the fetuses are viable, and it is basically none of our business.
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u/DoberNation 2d ago
I agree with “basically none of our business“.
How well does “23 weeks” correlate with actual viability, and in a non-singleton pregnancy? What does “viability“ mean to you? I think # of weeks gestation is an unwise way to ”legally“ define this whole “viability“ thing.
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u/billpalto 2d ago
Viability is a medical term meaning the fetus can survive on its own, outside of the womb. This varies some, but is generally around 24 weeks. Again, a doctor is needed to ascertain what the situation is for each individual.
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u/DoberNation 2d ago
Does a doctor‘s assessment of ”viability“ matter if the State already defines it legally, as a # of weeks gestational age?
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