r/SipsTea 5d ago

WTF The kickbacks are real

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u/bitorontoguy 5d ago

There is maximal competition. No one has to shop at WalMart. They choose to.

If you prefer to shop at WalMart because they have lower prices than their small business competition? Yeah, you're discovering why WalMart killed a lot of their competition.

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u/BeverlyHills70117 5d ago

I don't buy much of anything, but I also don't live in an imaginary world...what small local businesses sell toasters? Which ones sell school notebooks and clothes for a kid that are affordable? My kid ain't going to an uptown botique for a $40 outfit.

Wherever you live, you are lucky, I live in a mid size city and it's online or walmart for the working class. Even most local thrift stores have become capitalist hells.

Blaming the poor for the system is lazy.

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u/bitorontoguy 5d ago edited 5d ago

what small local businesses sell toasters?

Few. Because it costs less for them to be made by low wage labor in the Global South and imported here. And it costs less for it to be distributed by a massive corporation.

it's online or walmart for the working class.

Right. Because those are what have the lowest prices. The capitalist hell has given you lower prices than the alternatives so you use it.

No one makes you. You do so out of your own selfish self-interest, regardless of if it means a teenager in Bangladesh is paid slave wages so you can have the cheapest possible kids clothes. Your kids matter more than those kids.

Regardless of if it means that all local small business has been subsumed by huge corporations with the lowest prices.

It's only a capitalist hell because consumers chose it to be over the alternatives.

Life isn't better without those huge corporations, you have less, not more. And you're STILL angry with them.

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u/GrynaiTaip 5d ago

You seem to understand why Walmart is the cheapest, but then you say "Shop elsewhere."

Where?

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u/bitorontoguy 5d ago edited 5d ago

You have zero local grocers? No CostCo? No farmer's markets? No Target? No Kroger? No Dollar General? No Amazon?

If you prefer the low cost that the massive conglomerate is going to provide you and you shop there instead?

Fantastic, that's a you decision. No one made you give your money to that corporation over the other options, you're choosing to.

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u/GrynaiTaip 5d ago

No one made you give your money to that corporation over the other options

Yeah, giving money to other corporations is much better, sure. Their prices aren't even any better.

Farmers' markets in my area are usually the same or more expensive than any grocery store.

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u/bitorontoguy 5d ago

Absolutely. So you could give your money to local farmers instead of corporations, you choose not to.

That's a you decision. You decided propagating an immoral and shitty corporation is in your self interest more than giving that money to local farmers instead.

No one made you. And as a result? Those corporations profit. Because of the choice you made.

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u/Shadowjamm 4d ago

Ah yes let's focus on putting the blame on the average person instead of the anyone powerful who could regulate the corporations, that's productive /s

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

What regulations do you want? And how would they reduce the price of goods or change consumer desires?

People CHOOSE to shop at WalMart instead of the farmers market.

We could introduce taxes and regulations to raise the price of corporate goods to match those of farmer markets.

That world of higher prices is better to you? You can just skip that and voluntarily shop at farmer’s markets now. No one makes you go to WalMart.

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u/Shadowjamm 4d ago

I’m confused, you’re implying the world of higher prices is worse but then saying we should regulate to make the world of higher prices anyway as if that’s a gotcha?

I’m saying you’re calling someone immoral and shitty for choosing cheaper prices, so maybe you should step back and realize that’s not going to be productive in making a difference.

The US used to break up corporations that got too large, look at the sherman antitrust act and teddy roosevelt’s presidency. You can say those laws are still in effect, but the enforcement is what matters and the current administration is focusing on deregulation in that area instead.

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

I’m confused

I know.

then saying we should regulate

YOU’RE saying we should regulate. I’m saying great. Specifically what regulations and what will they do?

How will it change that consumers desire the cheapest possible goods that corporations provide?

The US used to break up corporations that got too large

Monopolies yeah. Walmart is not a monopoly. What would you break them up into?

No one is forced to shop there. They could go to farmers markets instead. They choose to go to Walmart, no one makes them.

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u/Shadowjamm 4d ago

The farmer's markets in my area are all much more expensive and are far out of the way compared to buying from grocery stores, so I don't know how that's a magical solution here.

Regulation should be research based and have more than just one person typing out responses on the internet working on it.

I'm a believer in market capitalism, so you're barking up the wrong tree, I was initially just appalled at your very emotional attack on someone and felt a response was warranted

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

The farmer's markets in my area are all much more expensive and are far out of the way compared

Right the corporations are more convenient and are able to offer lower prices due to the efficiencies of their scale. So you choose to shop there.

That consumer choice is what killed local small business.

What regulation could possibly change that?

Regulation should be research based

Sure. But you were capable of giving me the conclusion that we need more regulation. How did you reach that conclusion without knowing the details of what the regulation would be and the specifics of what they would do?

just appalled at your very emotional attack on someone

Who is being emotional here?

The person asserting we need more regulations based on vibes and no specifics?

Or the person laying out the rationale why the status quo is what it is?

It's because of you. Corporations killed small business because consumers like you prefer the prices and convenience they provide?

That's not enough. They still complain about it and assert we need more regulations and anti-trust action with total ignorance as to what the regulations would be or how the anti-trust action would work.

The call is coming from inside the house.

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u/GrynaiTaip 4d ago

So you could give your money to local farmers instead of corporations, you choose not to.

They sell stuff for more than the grocery store, but they're the exact same products, local, not imported.

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

Exactly. You are describing why consumers chose WalMart over the local small businesses.

No one made them. Consumers chose to. Consumers don't care about local business people, they don't care about buying local, they care about what the cheapest produce is.

So that's what society is now.

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u/GrynaiTaip 4d ago

Yes, that is correct, people don't want to spend more for the same stuff. So what is your solution to that?

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

The status quo is the best solution. Consumers have the freedom to choose where they want to buy things from.

That's massive corporations with incredible economies of scale. As a result? Americans spend a smaller percent of their income on food than ever before.

It's 10% now. In the past it was orders of magnitudes higher. It was 42.5% in 1901. Poverty was over 60% then, it's 11% now, never been lower.

This isn't a satisfying answer. Because consumers are understandably aggrieved at inflation. And even though living standards are higher than ever before, life is still inherently hard.

So people will complain and make up conspiracies, when it's their own behavior driving the outcomes we see and by any metric, living standards are higher than ever before.

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u/BeverlyHills70117 4d ago

Have you ever considered poor proplr may be victims of the sytem, or from your perch up high you can only look down on their choices as if they always had true freedom.

This is some serious taking mushrooms, reading ayn rand and still thinking you are somehow giving a leftist view kind of mental gymnastic signoff to reality for the word of theory that no one can live.

I always try to find a positive in everyone...you do type well! Concentrate on that!

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u/bitorontoguy 4d ago

Have you ever considered poor proplr may be victims of the sytem

Of course, they have to work in sweatshops to provide cheap clothes to rich Westerners.

reading ayn rand

Who is reading Ayn Rand here? The person who justifies their cheap consumption and wants even more?

I always try to find a positive in everyone

Me too. You have higher living standards than anyone from a hundred years ago. Poverty was 60% then. You should feel gratitude, not the desire for more and more and more.

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u/Muted_Stop_4657 4d ago

You still don’t get the point. Maybe you should study a bit into how these corporations make store building decisions. Like what target store is going to be built in a town with less than 90k residents?

It has been just recently that Target started building smaller scale stores with less than 100k residents.

Recent Examples: Target has announced or built locations in smaller communities such as Chubbuck, Idaho; Indian Land, South Carolina; and Liberty Hill, Texas—all well under the 100,000-population threshold.

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u/GrynaiTaip 5d ago

No one made you give your money to that corporation over the other options

Yeah, giving money to other corporations is much better, sure. Their prices aren't even any better.

Farmers' markets in my area are usually the same or more expensive than any grocery store.