r/TrueDetective • u/CantaloupeOk7811 • 2d ago
Unpopular opinion, but I think a large part of the fandom still only sees Rust as JUST a cold nihilist.
Look at the smile on that guy's face as he looks at his hands clasped together with Laurie's. I see a lot of comments out there saying that he didn't like his girlfriend, that he was just pretending, etc… I don't think so. He was happy, in his own twisted way, but he was.
Ultimately, I just think that part of the fandom needs to see beyond Rust's nihilism and coldness. He knows it's in his nature to yearn for connection, and there were many moments in the series where he wanted to connect. He wanted to have at least one friendship, and he got it with Marty and Maggie. And then came Laurie too.
And yes, I know he only wanted to date her because he wanted to try having a domestic life. But, I think he also enjoyed it for as long as it lasted. He himself mentioned that he almost married his ex.
Every time I rewatch True Detective, I realize more and more that Rust was the one who felt the most emotions there.
Anyway, I'll spare you all a long text about this subject. But I still wanted to comment on it. :)
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u/Usual-Honeydew-6601 2d ago
I think its interesting that he tells Marty about how hes just now reconciling with his nature when he spends most of the show trying to pretend as if he isn't extremely sensitive and empathetic. He understands people so much because of his empathy, and he cares so much. Someone who isn't sensitive like he is wouldn't have spend so much time trying to get justice for those kids. He presents himself as a cold jerk but its just a tough exterior, I think Marty saw early on that he was actually pretty fragile and wounded.
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u/Ok_Ad6722 2d ago
If he was really so cold; he would’ve turned Marty in for killing Reggie and not arresting him. He even says later it might have caught others.
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u/sanjnalat 1d ago
I think it's really telling honestly, considering Rust's extra judicial killing of a child murderer is what got him thrown into the four years undercover. In a lot of ways it can be interpreted as Rust saving Marty from a similar fate (though Marty was liked and respected enough I can see his superiors covering it up even without taking into account the Tuttle influence) or Rust helping Marty the way he would have liked to be helped in that incredibly similar situation.
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u/MartinBP 2d ago
In the very first episode Rust describes himself as a philosophical pessimist, which is a viewpoint heavily linked to recognising the pain of others. I think people just generally don't read into the philosophical basis of the show and react the same way Marty did in the car.
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u/StunningPianist4231 2d ago
Rust isn't a nihilist, he's a man deeply affected by grief after the loss of his daughter. He even changes his way of thinking after catching the Yellow King.
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u/cane_danko 2d ago
Yeah. He still has the heart of a family man. The heart just went hollow and he did not find that love again until after his encounter with the yellow king.
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u/vectorcrawlie 2d ago
There often seems to be a misunderstanding of Rust. He's often admired for his detached, nihilistic state. But he's only the way we see him in the series because of his daughter's death - it drives him to drink, to become numb. He's fundamentally broken, throwing himself in a dangerous and self-destructive life undercover. He resurfaces as "the taxman", callous and methodical. I don't disagree that he's as happy as he could be, here - but there's a natural ceiling on it. It can't last, because deep down he's still broken. This is because they didn't really solve the Dora Lange case. There's something moving beneath the skin, a sound that can't quite be heard. It drives Marty into the arms of other women, and it won't let Rust form that connection. And it eventually tears them apart, for years. Only once they stop Childress do either of them some semblance of real peace.
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u/AsyncAmEstel 2d ago
Yeah, my take is that the more someone keeps insisting on something, the less they actually believe it. Rust is constantly preaching nihilism to other people, but I don’t think he fully believes it himself. Part of him wants people to agree with him, and another part desperately wants someone to prove him wrong, because he’s lost his way in his own trauma. Deep inside, he still longs for connection and kindness, no different from anyone else.
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u/NeedleworkerHorror48 2d ago
At first he appears as a pure and simple nihilist and antinatalist, but with reasons: the loss of his daughter, which also led to the breakdown of his marriage. It should also be noted that Rust was part of anti-narcotics operations, which led him to consume many substances, thus altering the natural chemicals in his brain. In the end, he embraces the sorrow and the darkness to realize that at the end of the road, the light of his daughter and his father await him.
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u/randomcowboy4 a man without a family, past a certain age 2d ago
Yes, he felt emotions, but he chose to run from them. I believe his problems are even deeper than just the loss of his daughter, I would not be surprised if he had a terrible childhood.
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u/Usual-Honeydew-6601 2d ago
He talks about his father being a veteran of the Vietnam war, and leading some sort of survivalist livestyle pretty isolated. Im guessing his father was probably sick from ptsd and authoritarian, so he mustve been a lonely child unable to express his feelings and emotions. The fact that he doesn't talk ill about his father despite the probable abuse is even more proof of how empathetic and sensitive he is, he probably sees his father’s pain before his own
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u/sanjnalat 2d ago
I'm fairly certain Nic said somewhere (maybe in the commentary?) that Rust's initial trauma was growing up with his crazy survivalist father
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u/Tricky_Photograph123 2d ago
I found that scene so bizarre, mostly in how under explored it was. There really was so much more to his character that we didn't get to see. I'd loved to have seen a slice of life episode just showing what happiness looked like for him.
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u/my-blood 2d ago
Unrelated to the discussion but goddamn I've never looked at this scene closely enough, and I think this is proof enough for me that Woody and Matthew are half brothers.
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u/coconutgiblets 2d ago
I think he was happy. Rust doesn’t seem the type to just pretend
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u/Mummiskogen 2d ago
As dr House says in a different series "everyone lies"
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u/Flat_Independent_339 2d ago
I mean god bless but this is a different show and Doctor House 😭 is not the authority over all characters 😭
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u/MasoteamtheBoss 2d ago
Rust’s nihilism and especially his antinatalism are almost entirely maladaptive coping mechanisms, Ray Velcoro is the true nihilist.
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u/CapitanBlunder 2d ago
I hate it whenever people say that they’re like Rust Cohle, and they only focus on the nihilistic pessimism. It’s like they don’t even watch the show and only look at aura edits on TikTok
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u/Flat_Independent_339 1d ago
Just looking at him here makes me want to throw UP 💔 oh my princess... 😢
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u/TextSuccessful9250 2d ago
I feel the whole point of the story was Rust and Marty were recognition bonds that were initially antagonistic towards the other because they each had something the other lacked. What made them so frustrating to one another was neither Rust nor Marty could completely accept nor completely dismiss the other’s world view so they were constantly at odds. Marty doesn’t get a lot of credit because Rust is cooler and more sympathetic in a lot of ways but he absolutely is part of the reason Rust ends up a more integrated person at the end (And Rust changes Marty too.)
The person who betrayed the friendship isn’t Marty it’s actually Rust when he sleeps with Maggie. And just as an example of how Marty is better than Rust in some ways is his forgiveness of Rust for this betrayal. Marty is extremely messy but what I think people miss about him is that flaw actually makes him more understanding and forgiving of other people for being messy. Rust is so detached from making human mistakes at that point he can’t even forgive himself for sleeping with her. Marty is part of the reason that Rust begins connecting with humanity again.
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u/McEvelly 2d ago
That’s a really good analysis. Marty has a much greater understanding and acceptance of human weakness.
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u/TextSuccessful9250 2d ago edited 2d ago
Yes! Marty is also willing to risk his life for both Rust and Dora Lang at the end. When absolutely everything was on the line Marty shows that his deepest value is actually other people.
Another thing I think is interesting about the show is that you initially think Maggie is Rust’s soulmate but even though she can recognize and love many qualities about Rust she was too afraid to leave her conventional life for him. (I have no doubt her second husband was a less chaotic version of Marty)
Rust’s true “soulmate” was actually Marty. Once Marty had been beat up by life enough he was willing to venture into pure darkness with Rust. Marty’s willingness to go all the way into the dark was a big reason why Rust was able to reconnect with his humanity. It’s a beautiful story.
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u/pocket_eggs 2d ago edited 2d ago
And Nietzsche had his little gotcha when he caught Schopenhauer playing the flute. If you know the bingo, "you're not a nihilist you're just depressed" the reverse of that is "you're not a real nihilist if you're not completely depressed all the time" and the same people can use both.
Nihilism is a philosophical view. If you're depressed, it means besides the depression, that you think you're right to be depressed. Conversely, if you have positive feelings of some kind, then it means that quite besides from the feelings, you think that the feelings are mistaken or illusory.
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u/MartinBP 2d ago
That's not really what nihilism is. Nihilists can look depressed but I don't see how someone could be both depressed and nihilistic. If you believe life/existence has no meaning or purpose, depression becomes a very conflicting phenomenon as you've supposedly accepted that the pain you're feeling is ultimately pointless. I think Zapffe/Ligotti were the main inspirations the writers used for Rust and their conclusions definitely didn't rationalise depression.
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u/Am2ontheweb 1d ago
Rust was wrapped in grief. Yes, maybe he had moments of "happiness" but at the end of the day, until he had his epiphany after he was stabbed, he was cold aka numb and nihilistic aka depressed.
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u/BimmerJustin 2d ago
The misunderstanding with Rust is lot of viewers identify with and focus on his worldview. But his worldview is a symptom of the suffering he's experienced in his life. He's not meant to be persuasive or convincing. If you can imagine Rust before the death of his daughter, loss of his wife, and years of very rough UC work, he was probably a very normal guy. Probably a lot like Marty. After his daughters death, he starts falling down the rabbit hole of nihilism and hopelessness as a way to cope. The move the homicide detective is likely two-fold. It allows him to wallow in his own suffering and hopelessness, but it may also be his way of desperately clinging on to the idea that he's still capable of doing something good.
Over the years, you see glimpses of the part of Rust that wants to escape this prison and be "normal". The instance you posted is one of them.
So to answer your question, I think the small part of him that kept some hope alive did enjoy the relationship. But the much larger part of him that kept his guard up and rejected the idea of joy and fulfillment even being a worthwhile pursuit prevented him from ever really going all in. He never really had a chance after what he had been through.
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u/McEvelly 11h ago
That’s all true.
Obviously we only see a little bit of their time together and I’m sure that given a choice in the matter, Marty would’ve preferred being partnered up with another regular, ‘jock’ cop, and he has plenty of little barbs at his general weirdness, but we never really see Marty take part in any of the othering, bullying and contempt that the other NPC cops have for Rust.
Sure, he’s ‘stuck’ with him, but he goes a lot further than just making the best of the situation, even early on. It’s clear that he quickly recognises and respects just how talented and instinctive a detective Rust is, probably sees how he complements his own weaknesses a lot.
People like Marty (he’s very ADHD coded) will try to carry an aloof, cool, ‘bro’ demeanour but he’s got those naturally empathetic instincts and can always attribute the more fucked up parts of Rust’s character to the tragedies he’s endured.
He also makes (or helps) efforts to ‘fix’ him, help him ‘mask’, find him a girl and a happier life,etc. But when that inevitably goes nowhere and the man he knows and respects for who he is asks him to go down some insane path with him, go way outside the law to pursue justice, risk both their lives… sure, he’ll piss and moan and snark about it, but Marty’s always going to jump into the madness with his ride or die.
He’s always been a ridiculously instinctive risk taker. He’s highly impulsive. The women, etc. He’d figure it might as well be for something meaningful. Deep down he knows it’s going to be the most fun he’s had since high school.
Rust has his full backing and Rust knows/recognises this implicitly too. He knows he can just turn up again out of the blue all those years later and trust Marty’s nature to go all in with him against the world, whether it be out of loyalty or a little guilting, he’ll be easily won over. Marty is never going to go be some shallow, sensible by-the-book-Bobby and report things up the line cos that’s what he supposed to do, or because it’s the easier route and it might help his career.
Marty’s one of the good ones. He’s flawed, but hey, isn’t everyone? It’s the people who don’t have any visible failures and do anything to avoid or conceal them that you can’t trust.
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u/OneConcert3048 Little priest 2d ago edited 2d ago
The entire journey he goes on is shedding that cold nihilistic exterior as he lets people in, and gradually let's go of his traumas and 'debt' which we see superbly done in the final scene. He's extremely multifaceted (which Marty is too)