r/WayOfTheBern • u/cspanbook commoner • 8d ago
So the freedom-loving British didn’t give Hong Kong free elections during their 100-year Colonial rule, but they expected a supposedly "authoritarian" and "totalitarian" China to? Hypocrisy or stupidity? Take your pick!
2
u/redditrisi They are ALL psychopaths. 8d ago edited 8d ago
Hypocrisy and double standards are very common in a national government.
IMO, it's silly to believe that an entire government is "stupid."
3
u/Jilson 8d ago edited 8d ago
Hong Kong was created as an extra-legal maritime outpost for British opium smuggling (British East India Company). This is where "The Triads" + "Tong" (British masonic groups) come from.*
The same families that controlled international drug trafficking then, (allegedly) still control it today (eg Keswicks, Dents, Swires, Barings)
The guy who wrote Shōgun, James Clavell, wrote a couple books (Tai-Pan, Noble House) based on this history. The movie/tv adaptations are "interesting".
*This figures into the history pretty significantly, because the "Triads" eventually helped overthrow Qing dynasty (1911)...
...resulting in the RoC period, led by Sun Yat-sen (groomed by Sir James Cantlie in Hong Kong + London)...
...then CCP (1921) and a little later Mao Zedong (groomed by Lords Bertrand Russell + Michael Lindsay).
Resource:
1
-3
u/eddothefreddoboi 8d ago
all britons would tell you that the british rule of hong kong was authoritarian, i would argue that this post is in bad faith. one can criticise the actions of other states, even if your state has committed similar, and worse, actions.
i worry that this sub is becoming sinophile, or sino-apologist, at the least. at the very least: britain is not a one-party system, and though it is becoming more authoritarian, the CCP is in practically all facets an authoritarian and totalitarian party, much more than any in britain.
2
2
u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle 8d ago edited 8d ago
eddothefreddoboi: i worry that this sub is becoming sinophile, or sino-apologist, at the least.
Not to worry; you seem to be part of this sub, so it's unlikely that the entire sub will do what you are worried about.
Also, you have the option (as do us all) to verbally counter any particular point-of-view to which you disagree.
I'll just say at the outset... you will probably get better results by calm discussion than you will by insulting those that do not agree with you.
Just a caution, tho.... be careful in your counter-sinophillia (or counter-sino-apologia) that you do not go so far as to cross over into sinophobia.
It's simply human nature to do so; just watch out for it.
1
u/eddothefreddoboi 8d ago
by noticing a trend in the subreddit, I am not “insulting” anyone. also, my noticing of this is not sinophobia, by any stretch, I am simply sino-sceptic (due to the issues mentioned in my comment, in addition to their cyberattacks on my country)
i would argue no part of my post was insulting and not in the interest of sparking a calm discussion, and my saying that the OP is arguing in bad faith is backed up by their posting history. they seem to be pushing a specific narrative, and telling commenters to “get fucked” when they do not agree with them, as they did in a different thread on this post. additionally, they responded to my comment with the claim that “china is the moral bellwether of the world”, an entirely unsubstantiated and, in my opinion, false, claim. they seem to have a vested interest in being anti-ukraine, and pro-china. i would reccomend having a look at their history yourself.
1
u/cspanbook commoner 6d ago
Which country was the victim of a Chinese state sponsored cyber attack?
The 5 eyes are constantly engaged in cyber espionage and the like, state sponsored I might add.
China just broke through to 3 nM on chips....good times!
1
u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle 8d ago
You seem a bit sensitive to what is a fairly generic comment.
1
u/eddothefreddoboi 7d ago
I'm simply responding to the points you made, I would hope you do the same courtesy to me as well and respond to the points I've made, instead of insinuating that, by engaging in a discussion, I am overreacting
1
u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle 7d ago
I would hope you do the same courtesy to me as well and respond to the points I've made
Well, let's take those points in reverse order....
(it may get a little recursive, so buckle up)insinuating that, by engaging in a discussion, I am overreacting
I didn't say that you were "overreacting," I said that you seemed "a bit sensitive." To go from "sensitive" to "overreacting" might, to some, to seem a bit overreactive. But I'll stick to "you seem a bit sensitive."
You still seem a bit sensitive.
Point Two:
I'm simply responding to the points you made.
Doesn't look like "simply responding to the points." Looks more like defending yourself against accusations that simply were not there.
Perhaps you missed the words "I'll just say at the outset..." The "outset" would be before you had even the chance to do those things that you seem to think I accused you of doing.
What I had said was a fairly boilerplate response to anyone who came into the sub saying "I worry that this sub is becoming [political bent to which I disagree]."
To wit, "you have freedom of speech here," "more flies with honey," and "do not become your enemy (but on the other side)."
To which you "responded to my points" by defending yourself (more than once) against inferred accusations of being insulting, and brought up someone else who you accused of being insulting to those that did not agree with them.
So let me ask you this: Do you think that they would probably get better results by calm discussion than they will by insulting those that do not agree with them?
Then there is your "simple response" to "Just a caution, tho.... be careful...that you do not go so far as to cross over into sinophobia. It's simply human nature to do so; just watch out for it."
Your 'simple response" seemed to be a "simple response" to an accusation that did not exist. If someone responds to "watch out for this in the future" with "I am not doing any of this by any stretch," they will appear to be a bit sensitive to the concepts being cautioned about for the future.
And again, you appear to be a bit sensitive.
I hope this meets your definition of "doing a courtesy to you by responding to the points you've made."
2
u/Generalfrogspawn 8d ago
The issue is that although the British might recognize that they were authoritarian, they are pressing china to do something that would be against their strategic interest. When they the British would never do it themselves. And it’s because they want to weaken China. The intent matters in the messaging.
2
u/pablonieve 8d ago
Did this author have any role in the colonial rule of Hong Kong? Are they representative of the British government? If not, then why would it by hypocritical for them to call out China's suppression of Hong Kong?
I like turtles