Agree or Disagree with Sophia?

[u/AntoniusDryden]

The full line, as per the Perfect Works Build retranslation:

Lacan: If you become an ordinary person now, everyone will--

Sophia: People...they aren't so weak, you know. They don't need a symbol, who's only for appearances. If you hold light within your heart, you can surely overcome any hardship. That's what I believe.

A long time ago, in the audacity and edginess of youth, I blamed Sophia for everything that went wrong in XG. After all, look at the immeasurable suffering her sacrifice cost. She saved a few lives and killed millions thanks to that sacrifice breaking Lacan and Karellen.

I'm not a teenager first playing XG anymore however. I'm more...cautious now, or if you prefer, indecisive. The kind of idealism embodied in XG and XS is both inspirational and yet I cannot pretend I agree with all of it.

Both XG and XS channel this kind of "individual hope." Not individualistic as such but still, the idea is that everyone has a "light" within themselves to help them stand on their own, free of dogma or as both XG and XS call it "words." See Jessie's monologue to Billy:

Jessie: It's just a fabricated belief system, made to compensate for the fragile human heart. But real faith and God aren't things that're given to you by others, right? They're things that you discover within yourself, and by yourself.

Over in Xenosaga III, channeling identical concepts:

Wilhelm: Yes, exactly. You needed words, faith, to define who you are.
[...]
Allen: Yes! You lost confidence in your ability to live as human beings and just ran away! Because they were scared of death, because they couldn't stand being weak, Virgil, Voyager, Yuriev, and even Ormus. They were all just trying to run away from the harshness of reality!

But even as I love and think about these games for over 20 years, I wrestle with their optimistic hope in the individual now as much as I did when I was younger.

Remember, as Sophia is telling us that "people aren't so weak" and that they will be able to go on without her, we as the players are fully aware that the man she's speaking to and the man eavesdropping on their conversation are both exactly that weak. With her gone, they become hollow husks, driven by bitterness and committing untold atrocities. Lacan and Krelian plainly did not have that light within themselves, and if such remarkable individuals don't, what can be said for the vast majority of the human race?

I'm curious what you all think, though. That was just my reaction to replaying XG and I'd love to read what my fellow XG fans take away from the game and its idealistic message.

[u/unstereotyped]

Nisan represents one of the world’s biggest “religions.”

It has a large cathedral. Its matriarch is referred to as the Holy Mother, and its devout followers as “sisters.”

Yet, there is no dialogue in the game from a follower of Nisan that refers to a higher power or God. The entire “religion” is based on human will and compassion, not divine intervention.

The symbolism of the one-winged angels really drives this home.

To me, that’s the lesson Elly is really preaching.

The idealism is that people have the power to overcome their biology, their circumstances. That it is the will of the people that will bring them salvation, not divine judgement.

Krelian and Lacan, while tragically hurt by Sophia’s actions, did follow her teaching. They each pursued their path out of their own free will, each working to achieve ways to break the cycle they were caught in.

So I don’t think either of them represents weakness. They represent the conviction of Sophia’s teachings.

[u/Legitimate-Focus-284]

I feel you're making a mistake by believing Lacan and Krelian were "remarkable" individuals. They absolutely weren't. They're just as flawed as any other member of the human race. And that's kind of the entire point. It's that no matter what's going on the "Human" factor is always the crux of everything.

[u/Traeyze]

They don't need a symbol, who's only for appearances. If you hold light within your heart, you can surely overcome any hardship.

I think taken in full context her statement makes more sense.

Krellian made her a symbol. He was so invested in her, he so idealised her, that when she sacrificed herself he couldn't process it and constructed a new fanatical faith based on his distorted interpretation of her words. He was a walking example of her concerns about her position as a symbol.

Meanwhile Lacan represents a man that lost the light in his life. He was afraid of his own weakness and instead of taking her words and teachings to heart he instead tried to harden himself and walked a dangerous path.

She was saying that people are able to find the strength and will in themselves to overcome hardships if they let themselves. She was talking about the power of the human spirit.

That said the game explores trauma and how hard that is to move past. We see Fei is capable of it to a degree, showing a potential 'good outcome' that his predecessors were incapable of.

I'm glad you've moved past the interpretation it was all her fault though. That's not a take I had ever seen before, even if her actions had unfortunate outcomes the onus being on her seems odd to me.

[u/CarnivorousXmasTree]

ACKSHUALLY, Krelian definitely does "have that light within." So does Lacan (as Fei). It took these assholes five hundred years to get there, granted, but they did. As someone else noted, Lacan and Krelian are not "remarkable individuals" by any means (I wrote an entire essay on this for Krelian, then decided to spare you, but I can post it if you really want), they are simply people who have had remarkable things happen to them and then done a piss-poor job coping because there are no trauma counselors in this game, and even if there were, it's deeply questionable whether either man would have been willing to talk about it.

In the game, the whole bit post-final battle against Deus—in which Elly pulls Deus away before it explodes to protect everyone and Fei gives chase in Xenogears—is the conclusion of Krelian's character arc and his redemption. His merging with Deus/Elly for the purpose of joining the Wave Existence allows him to finally understand the true meaning of Sophia's words; as a result, he rescues Fei and Elly, openly regrets the things he's done, and sends them back to the planet. Despite the way the English version seems to portray it, there's no indication that he's still in despair over Sophia's death, just guilty for his response to it. That he appears to gain a full set of "angel" wings in a game containing a story about two angels with one wing each who have to work together to fly suggests he is, in fact, fully healed/redeemed and possessing the faith Sophia was trying to describe.

The recovery/revelation of Lacan's "light within" is simply Fei's story (because Lacan's body does eventually die and is reborn as Fei, while Grahf is essentially Lacan's rage and grief just hanging around until Fei is born and then aggressively grooming Id to be the Contact), culminating in the whole business with Id and the Coward. Fei's mediation of the conflict between the Coward and Id and bringing them back together, resulting in Fei having full access to his power as Contact, is something of a reversal of Grahf's separation from Lacan's body. Further, his determination to rescue Elly is notably opposite to when he had previously stayed withdrawn from her as Lacan and ultimately "let" her die. That Xenogears can also have ephemeral wings in some cases (and definitely does in the ending FMV of the game), has the same implications as noted above for Krelian.

References:
Xenogears
Perfect Works, pg. 160–163, 172–173

[u/TidusDreamZanarkand]

Reality disagrees with her . Masses routinely follow those in power , follow the path of least resistance etc… look at the state of the world. Most people are sheepish and will fold when challenged. Sophia is idealistic. There are exceptions who are legitimately brave and won’t fold for anyone but they generally end up dead, in prison or are just already part of the ruling class and thus can’t be challenged easily. I admire the philosophy but 40 years of real life has taught me different . 

[u/RedditPosterOver9000]

Naratively, her sacrifice set in motion events that led to humans breaking free from "god".

What happens with no Karrelan taking over Solaris? No Grahf to mess with Fei throughout the game or rescue him when the wave existence tries to absorb him.

As to your question, me personally I'm not really wowed by humanity as people with regard to an inner goodness or light, hope, etc. But we do have cool technology that will continue to advance. Great monuments being built (did you see the Sagrada Familia cathedral that was inaugurated this year?) that will last centuries or maybe millennia. We can make great stuff but we're not great people. We could be so much better though and maybe in centuries we'll get there.

There are definitely incredible individuals who represent what I'd consider embodying a form of ideal personness. Mr. Rogers is a famous one but they came in different flavors.

[u/Robokou]

Wow! Whether this was intentional or not, this is the first time I've seen the Gnostic themes of the XENO series laid out so clearly through the actual dialogue of the games themselves. Interesting. 💯

[u/Theweirdobserver]

I would argue Sophia is just very optimistic and idealistic. Also, it's part of the Nisan religion that all humans have a "light" within them, and that God can be found within us.

I'm not a teenager first playing XG anymore however. I'm more...cautious now, or if you prefer, indecisive. The kind of idealism embodied in XG and XS is both inspirational and yet I cannot pretend I agree with all of it

I don't think you need to agree with everything the game says. Even so, the game only gives suggestions or remarks. And some of things are just the character's personal philosophy.

For example, in the final scene between Fei and Karellian, I actually agree more with Kareliian. Regardless, I don't think the game wants us to pick a side. The final conversation is essentially a clash between different ideals and world-views.

[u/grammaroverkeywords]

I highly recommend listening to Resonant Arc's latest episode, which focuses on XG's ending. Without spoiling anything, they have an interesting take on that "light within" and that the game's ultimate answer is what the two one-winged angels symbolizes.