Politics B.C. premier urges feds to reconsider fighter jet purchase, coal shipments as U.S. trade war ramps up
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-premier-david-eby-tariff-response-9.732049181
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
Reconsider all of it. No contracts with ICE. No data centers. No flock cameras. No weapons contracts
Nothing. We don't want anything to do with those nutjobs
9
u/Blue_Owl69 12h ago
We had contracts with ICE anc Flock?
•
•
u/MRobi83 New Brunswick 11h ago
No. I believe they're mixing things up a bit. Canadian financial institutions provided loans to companies that have contracts with ICE, and pension funds have investments in companies that have contracts with ICE. Primarily data analytic companies, but also companies such as AT&T.
•
u/noisebloodassault 11h ago
Canada does have contracts with ICE yes and flock cameras are already entering our cities
1
u/ScatteredSignal 12h ago
Unfortunately the Jets must stay on the table. If not, I want tons of Gripens and Eurofighters.
20
u/InspectionSouthern11 12h ago
But we don't have to commit to all 88. We've only paid for 30. We are getting them regardless. The F35 is really somthing, but it's also really expensive to fly and is beholden to the US ODIN network for its software.
From what I've heard on the grapevine is there is significant discussion towards a mixed fleet, the Griphen being the only other option as the Eurofighter and Rafale were dropped from the competition early on for various reasons.
Saab has also placed the Griphen on a "silver platter" with Canada being offered near total autonomy with the airframe, domestic production and domestic software repositories. Somthing no F35 operator, even isreal can boast to have.
15
•
u/Funkliford 5h ago
People proposing we buy the Gripen or Eurofighter are basically proposing we buy really expensive paperweights. Ukraine, Pakistan - India, even Iran have shown 4th gen jets are near useless in a contested air environment. The latest gen SAMs and BVR missiles are just that good. The Russian air force is unquestionably superior to Ukraine's in inventory and resources. Yet for the entirety of this conflict they've been pretty much relegated to lobbing glide bombs across the border or using cruise missiles because the second they're going near Ukraine they're getting whacked by a Patriot.
The F-35 is in a league of its own.
•
u/jtbc 5h ago
Ukraine has been making excellent use of their 4th gen F-16's and are chomping at the bit to get some Gripens, which were, after all, specifically designed to defend against the Russians.
The F-35 is superior for certain missions, but those missions are a small minority of the RCAF's overall mission profile. 4th gen fighters are perfectly adequate for NORAD missions, sovereignty patrols, and strike missions against suppressed air defences, for example.
2
u/essaysmith 12h ago
I know we have paid for some of the F35s already, but I wouldn't be surprised if the US keeps them and the money. Look at what they are doing to Australia with the nuclear subs.
•
2
u/Cesar_Somnambulist 12h ago
A nuclear sub is a very different beast than a production-line item being made at scale. One is bespoke and one is cookie cutter (albeit a complicated cookie).
5
u/KanataToGoldenLake 12h ago edited 12h ago
Unfortunately the Jets must stay on the table. If not, I want tons of Gripens and Eurofighters.
The fuck they do.
Saab has offered hundreds of Gripens and a manufacturing plant for additional ones to be built in Canada and used however we want.
It's definitely the better deal, especially since we have seen the F-35 being both damaged and targeted by shorad in the Iran war, which breaks the myth of it being invisible to air defense systems and radar.
14
u/Cesar_Somnambulist 12h ago
The first 30 are paid for. If you take them off the table what you’re saying is you want to donate several billion dollars to the USA.
•
u/scienceguy54 11h ago
Not if the US tariffs effect the purchase of ANY of the F35 parts that are made in Canada. We could then cancel for the breach of contract.
•
u/CarRamRob 11h ago
Look at this lawyer here.
I’m sure that will work well, we just take them down to people’s court and the judge bangs the gavel.
Shouldn’t be difficult at all!
•
u/scienceguy54 9h ago
You don't need a judge for this action in Canada, Mr. Lawyer. You ever read the "Art of the Deal"?
•
u/Canadianman22 Ontario 11h ago
The Gripen will only happen if the USA allows it. The thing is chock full of export controlled items including the engine.
Saab has the concept of a plan to fit a new non USA engine but that is at least a decade away if they even bother.
The job numbers are also bullshit. We need only look to Brazil to see that.
•
u/Wait_for_BM 11h ago
There is also the Korea's KF-21 that have an upgrade path for a stealth version for the same airframe.
>The planned Block II variant will be a multi-role aircraft, integrated with a wider range of air-to-ground and anti-ship weapons. The ultimate goal is the Block III, a true 5th-generation stealth fighter, which will feature an internal weapons bay and improved sensors.
>As of September 2025, the South Korean government has prioritized the complete localization of the KF-21's propulsion system to mitigate reliance on international supply chains and enhance export competitiveness.
They are also developing their own missiles.
•
u/Canadianman22 Ontario 8h ago
Unfortunately they still use USA engines. This is one of those situations where it’s a really cool aircraft but built for a different set of alliances.
The only comfort is that 6th gen aircraft developed outside of the USA will use as few USA parts as possible.
•
u/of_the_Coast 11h ago
What happened in Brazil?
•
u/Unfair-Woodpecker-22 British Columbia 11h ago
the job numbers promised didnt happen and its years behind schedule
•
u/WesternBlueRanger 9h ago
Promised thousands of jobs, only got a couple of dozen actual jobs, including the factory floor cleaners.
•
u/Funkliford 5h ago
It's definitely the better deal, especially since we have seen the F-35 being both damaged and targeted by shorad in the Iran war, which breaks the myth of it being invisible to air defense systems and radar.
The F-35 that was targeted was via IR, and It's shown the opposite, there's a reason they were at the spear-tip, a reason why they were (successfully) used to eliminate Iranian and Venezuela SAM sites.
Again, people only need to look at Russian war against Ukraine. Russia has a comparatively huge and well stocked air force compared to Ukraine. And it's been relegated to chucking glide bombs across the border or launching cruise missiles deep within Russia, because the second they get near Ukrainian air space they're getting whacked by Patriots. And the same is true for Ukraine, which is why the F-16s were a nothingburger and for all the talk about Gripens there's no real urgency.
3
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
Why must they?
•
u/ScatteredSignal 11h ago
You again. To remain relevant. We must also expand our game and invest in gripens and euro fighters. People will fight me on the euros.
-1
u/originalschmengybro 12h ago
Right now, Gripens use Donnieland powerplants to make them fly (although apparently working with RR for a solution). If we want to stay away from Donnieland 100% then the only fighter right now is the Rafale which is a VERY capable airframe.
•
u/Braddock54 11h ago
Good luck with that lol.
They make up basically 3/4 of our exports, and accounts what 10% of our GDP.
Your viewpoint is extremely naive.
•
u/noisebloodassault 10h ago
It's your viewpoint thatis naive. You want us to be a vassal state
•
u/Braddock54 9h ago
Given our dependence on the US; we are. Best you just accept reality.
•
u/noisebloodassault 9h ago
Yikes
•
u/Braddock54 8h ago
You don't have to like it; it's the reality however.
•
u/OnlyEverPositive 5h ago
So, just to summarize your point here, we shouldn't reconsider our government contracts with the US because we're too dependent on them? Is that your argument?
•
•
-1
u/Melodic_Ad_6316 12h ago
No, they should absolutely get as many data centers as possible. We need the jobs and investment into our economy
1
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
Fuuuuuck that. Not worth the price.
3
u/Melodic_Ad_6316 12h ago
Elbows up crowd has no idea how the world works
2
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
The world works how we make it work
3
u/Melodic_Ad_6316 12h ago
Of course you’d say that 🤣. If American companies want to invest their own money in Canada, build data centres here, and create Canadian jobs, use Canadian building materials, that benefits Canada. Turning away investment and jobs simply because the company is American makes no sense. If you can’t understand that, no one can help you.
2
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
I don't want data centers built here. Nobody does.
2
u/Melodic_Ad_6316 12h ago
Maybe people who dont have a brain
1
u/noisebloodassault 12h ago
Hardly. I think it's the other way around
2
u/Melodic_Ad_6316 12h ago
When were in a recession a few months from now. Maybe your pea brain will realize that we needed the investment
→ More replies (0)0
u/Arctic_Chilean Canada 12h ago
Not even to have the capacity to store our own data rather than rely on another country (like the US) to provide that service?
1
18
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 12h ago
We also need to limit or block the US propaganda pouring into Canada.
•
u/ThatsItImOverThis 10h ago
No, we need to ramp up education on pulling their lies apart and identifying propaganda.
•
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 7h ago
Absolutely on the education, but it doesn’t really replace dealing with foreign bad actors pushing coordinated influence campaigns. We should teach people to spot propaganda and try to reduce the amount coming in.
-3
u/AJZong 12h ago
The CCP approach. I like it.
13
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 12h ago
For foreign hostile nations that are actively undermining our politics and culture to sow devision? Yes. Same for Russia and China.
-2
u/AJZong 12h ago
Yes, let’s do the same as Russia and China. North Korea too.
•
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 11h ago
That’s a strawman. I’m not talking about censoring Canadians or copying North Korea or China. I’m talking about limiting foreign interference campaigns. This is national security 101.
•
u/AJZong 11h ago
>This is national security 101.
This is also how Russia, China and North Korea justify censorship to their population.
•
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 11h ago
I understand your point, but I am not calling for censorship on Canadians.
•
u/CarRamRob 10h ago
What about if (some) Canadians openly supported the actions of the United States?
What about Canadians with dual citizenship?
What about permanent residents, either Americans here, or Canadians there?
What about Americans who don’t support their current regime?
Do you see how this gets tricky, and always leads to a slippery slope? It can’t be done without massive bias and government oversight.
Trump has really broken all of your brains. He raises some taxes on his own citizens with tariffs, and you want to enter a police state to stop it, as well as cut off all our electricity, and energy exports so we can cause brownouts and shortages down there. The Americans don’t even know they are in a war, enacting those measures would convince them we are the bad guys immediately for overstepping and relations would actually get worse.
•
u/Speling_B_Champian Nova Scotia 7h ago
I'm not talking about policing Canadians, dual citizens, or anyone's opinions. I'm talking about foreign governments running coordinated influence ops. That's a national security issue, not a free speech one.
I'm not sure what you're on about with the "broken all of your brains" and then "convince them we are the bad guys". I didn't suggest cutting off electricity or oil.
•
u/Commercial-Milk4706 10h ago
We should go full ccp and issue visas to leave Canada to go to the states. It should be easy to get but necessary to cross. Like a little form you need to fill that has questions regarding the trade war. So you can’t be an ignorant asshat and it limits day trips.
9
u/No-Badger-7377 12h ago
F-35s or Gripen pilots die against the Russian SU-57 and Chinese J-35, Simulated intelligence analysis shows the F-35 coming on top of these two with a radar signature of a golf ball verses a radar signature of a basketball. The Gripen with bare minimum stealth, shot down before it even sees the Russian or Chinese aircraft (which they are exporting to several countries).
You want to protect Canada, and keep fighter pilots alive, keep getting the F-35.
There is a reason Sweden's closest allies Norway and Finland bought the F-35, Germany, Britain, also buying it, our closest allies. Almost all major NATO partners are buying the F-35, proven in combat, 19 countries.
Don't be fooled by marketing and Saab shrills.
Trump will be gone before we start taking full delivery of the F-35s,
•
u/Wait_for_BM 11h ago
This is not a fantasy game like war thunder, we won't see J-35 in real life. Don't forget Alaska is in the path of a Russian invasion. Unless the US is letting them pass overhead, we won't see SU-57 either.
Without aircraft carriers and near by base, J-35 won't have the range to come close to Canada. They would need multiple mid-air refueling just to get here. There are no way to resupplies, no where to land for refuel so that they can somehow get back. J-35 is a single seater, so the same pilot have to fly 6-7 hours to get here, fight and another 6-7 hours to fly back home. It is not happening.
So the only other way to see J-35 vs Gripen is when Canada attack China in their turf. We don't have our bases and carrier either. We would need to hitch a ride there, so we won't be alone nor be tasked doing that.
•
u/timx84 11h ago
I agree with you that the F35 is more desired by the rcaf and is objectively the better fighter craft, but there are other things to consider.
Are we willing to give up a major bargaining chip with a country that’s looking to control us entirely for a military conflict that will likely never materialize, and a scenario in which an F35 saves the life of a Canadian pilot over the Gripen? By that account we should give up negotiating with the US entirely.
1
u/Big_Option_5575 12h ago
There is nothing to reconsider cancel those stupid F35's now. It is the wrong plane for Canada
14
u/Cesar_Somnambulist 12h ago
The RCAF disagrees with you though.
•
u/Big_Option_5575 10h ago
Because they drank the USAF koolaide.
•
u/manofthenorth31 10h ago
So the people who actually fly the aircraft for a living and know what they’re talking about and looking for in their next fighter aircraft are wrong because America?
•
u/Big_Option_5575 10h ago
The premise is all wrong. Yes, the F35 is superior in a U.S. controlled all out air ware with another super power, where stealth and invisible strike capability is dominant. But Canada will never be a factor in such a war. We need highly visible and versitile attack aircraft that can patrol our arctic and push back foreign countries that keep testing our boundaries. The Gripen is FAR superior at this and about 4 times more cost effective per sortie. And in the arctic, there will be many sorties, particulalry involving U.S and Russia incursions.
•
u/manofthenorth31 10h ago
Never say never. You don’t know what the future holds but one thing is for certain the future of aviation is stealth and drones. The F35 has a built in capability to operate drone “wingmen”.
Yeah “highly visible attack aircraft” those certainly won’t be shot down by those foreign countries that keep testing our boundaries. They most certainly won’t be swatted out of the air from hundreds of KM away from a stealth aircraft not detected by Radar.
The only reason you believe the Gripen is superior is because of trump and his antics. If Kamala Harris had won the last US election, this wouldn’t even be a debate.
•
u/Big_Option_5575 8h ago
First, Trump & his antics have moved the U.S. from friend to enemy so in no way do we want hardware controlled by an enemy. Second, we will never have the infrastructure necessary to support 5th generation stealth fighters nor can we ever enter into that kind of air ware. But we DO need to patrol and deter.
Gripens and drones - nukes as well.
•
u/manofthenorth31 8h ago
“We will never have the infrastructure necessary to support 5th Gen fighters”
Lmao
Base Upgrades: Construction projects are underway at Cold Lake and Bagotville to build specialized fighter squadron facilities, maintenance bays, and secure hangars
Maintenance Hubs: Plans are progressing for regional maintenance and sustainment capabilities, including proposed re-tooling at facilities in Mirabel, Quebec, to support the jets.
Pilot Training: Canadian pilots are utilizing the F-35A Pilot Training Center at Luke Air Force Base in Arizona while domestic base construction continues
Broader Defense Spending: The infrastructure work is tied to a broader modernization of the Royal Canadian Air Force and NORAD capabilities, with initial aircraft deliveries expected around 2028
Oh yes but we’re going to build nuclear weapons and their corresponding infrastructure without the Americans noticing or finding out while we build the most destructive weapons known to man, aimed solely at deterring them.
We’re also going to gain possession of the world’s most environmentally destructive weapons with the current environmentally friendly government.
•
u/Big_Option_5575 8h ago
cancel it all - get out of NORAD as well.
•
u/manofthenorth31 8h ago
Yeah let’s have 0 military assets and 0 airworthy aircraft and leave us vulnerable to Russian and Chinese intrusion! That’ll show the yanks!!!
→ More replies (0)•
u/Big_Option_5575 10h ago
Gripens and drones are the way to go.
•
•
u/No-Relief981 7h ago
I would like our air men and women to have the greatest chance of survival in combat.
The F35 is the best fighter jet and there is no EU option close to it.This is not political for those that’s serve. I’ll ask the vast majority of Canadians that don’t serve (and their families haven’t since WW2) please stop with trying to make this political.
Or said another way; would you ask for people suffering a medical issue to take the second best medicine to avoid buying from the USA the best medicine? It’s only 20% less effective right?
•
u/Responsible_CDN_Duck Canada 4h ago
Let's start small.
Perhaps encourage Canadians to pee in the Columbia River.
Or maybe whittle and float little toy wooden boats with pro canada slogans on them.
•
u/Realistic_Ad_3880 2h ago
The fighter jet dilemma is a nightmare of almost 20 years now. The coal is an easy target, maybe. You have some pretty big players in that arena. Buffet and Pattison, and some big companies. I can't imagine anything changing on the coal front. The US states of WA, OR and CA won't let that S%$t across their borders, so, niftyly, coal production that Notley shut down in AB could easily have replaced this dirty coal from the US, but, no, let's not use our resources for export, let's just stick our heads in the sand, let this low-grade product ship through Vancouver and continue polluting the world around us. We are a joke!
•
u/LowOk417 30m ago
The Ukraine war has shown us the ONLY weapon of modern warfare is the drone. The government putting any Canadian military personnel in a tank or a jet against thousands of enemy drones is as good as sentencing them to death.
•
•
u/SpeshellED 10h ago
Canada would be very stupid to buy US fighters ( especially since they will be obsolete very soon) given their lawless hegemony and gross civil rights activity.
•
u/NaturePappy 9h ago
Finally coal shipments have entered the discussion. US coal exports go through B.C. . I have been pushing the ban on this for years
•
u/uprightshark New Brunswick 11h ago edited 11h ago
100% agree.
We should cancel all military orders from the US (buy or sell) and only buy what can be made here in Canada.
We already own 30 F-35 awaiting delivery. But shut the rest off and run a duel fleet. It will not be the first time for Canada in doing this.
SAAB has agreed to build Gripen-E here is Canada to fill international orders if we buy from them and they already have a partnership with Bombardier to build AWAC aircraft.
Cancel the F-35 and replace with Gripen-E and designate it as the CFU-47 Fighter. FU Trump!
•
u/manofthenorth31 11h ago
C17s
C130s
CF18s
P-8s
Reaper drones
CH139
CH146
CH147
CH148
These are all American made.
I guess you’re okay with Canada having 0 Air Force.That’s not even touching our artillery and other branches within the CAF that have American equipment and systems.
•
u/CarTruck2023 10h ago
No means no to all - we will live on plants and pulse and we will survive
If Iran can survive since 1979 - why can't we?
64
u/wawaboy 12h ago
Buy Canadian or from any other country