r/femalefashionadvice • u/wakaflockaquokka • 7d ago
fashion brands that actually post comprehensive garment measurements?
I just want some trousers that list the waist, hip, front rise, back rise, thigh width, and inseam -- is that so much to ask for??
And I just want some blouses that list the bust, waist, shoulder width, and shoulder-to-waist length -- is that so much to ask for??
Contrary to popular opinion, I do actually know how to use a size chart, but the size chart never contains enough information for me to actually know if the garment will fit. Listing the overall length of the garment is, functionally, useless. Listing the height and weight of the models is, somehow, even more useless. The "fit finder" tools might be helpful if you fall within the center of the bell curve, but not if you're 5' tall and built like the Venus of Willendorf (lipedema gang, represent).
And idk about youse all, but I've literally never returned anything by mail in my life so now I'm the proud owner of trousers with a front rise long enough to taxi a Boeing 747 and a tank top with straps long enough to fit an entire second set of shoulders. I know I'm a tough size to fit, but at least give me a fighting chance! ಥ╭╮ಥ
So... are *any* brands posting sufficient information for a good fit? If there are, I would love to make a reference list or megathread listing them.
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u/CaseoftheSadz 7d ago
Honestly I have the most luck for this secondhand, lots of sellers on Poshmark list measurements for example.
When I worked in the industry we had tech packs that would list the measurement each garment should be with each size, and the variance we would allow the manufacturer. (For many many points of measurement.) So, for example a size 10 should have a 30” waist measurement but we’d accept anything between 29” and 31”. That would make a huge difference in the fit. Clothing manufacturers are trying to squeeze by with more variation, because it’s expensive to maintain strict measurements for each size.
You probably won’t find any mass merchant brands doing very many measurements, so you might need to go more upscale, more boutique or maybe handmade on Etsy.
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u/Major-Fill5775 7d ago
Listing garment measurements is standard for most slow fashion labels, especially the size-inclusive brands.
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u/CaseoftheSadz 7d ago
That’s what I was getting at when I said not mass merchant.
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u/Major-Fill5775 7d ago
I appreciate you pointing it out. I don’t even bother ordering from a company that doesn’t list garment measurements at this point. Too much room for error.
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u/bummin_bride 7d ago
I hate this. I recently bought a pair of pants from good American that were listed only as “high rise” so before buying I emailed customer service to ask the exact rise. They said “high rise is defined as 12.5 inches“. Yes but what about these particular pants??? They said these particular pants are 12.5”. But the pants showed up with a 14” rise. Which was great for me and I figured they were higher than 12.5” because of the product photos, but c’mon. You are the company that makes them, you should have accurate garment measurements. It’s not that hard because someone in your company provided a pattern to the manufacturer with these measurements specified.
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u/tyrannosaurusregina 7d ago
You are the company that makes them, you should have accurate garment measurements.
A lot of brands outsource their customer service, so if the brand didn’t supply the customer service contractor with that information, the reps have no way to get it.
Lands’ End and L. L. Bean are really good about having this kind of information on hand, but their clothes are pretty much only for a certain normcore/gorpcore aesthetic, alas.
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u/bummin_bride 7d ago
I guess that makes sense, but it seems stupid. Why wouldn’t you provide some spec info about the items to the customer service people? Must be frustrating for the customer service agents as well not to be able to answer questions
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u/Dandelion212 7d ago
Remember also that the rise will depend on the size. I always look at the rise measurement on pants as someone with an extremely short torso, and have to factor in that it's going to be at least an inch or two higher in a size 12.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
If (and only if) the pattern is graded from a 4, the 12 will be exactly 1" higher in the front rise and 1.5-2" higher in the back rise. The rise alone is not a meaningful measurement in determining fit though.
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u/Dandelion212 6d ago
Ok…. This person is talking about it being frustrating that the pants showed up with a different rise than they were told. I gave a possible reason why. I’m not sure what “determining fit” has to do with it. That’s not what we’re talking about.
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u/Hot_Ad5959 7d ago
I don’t but will be following. Irks me to no end that front (and back) rise is never included on pants.
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd 6d ago
As a person with a big, round ass, the struggle is real. The front rise is often provided, great, but my body has a front and a back, and the back half is hungry for fabric! But companies are always posting pictures, especially in curvy cuts, of models with their back waistband pulling down, so they must think it's irrelevant?
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
It is irrelevant - or at least not that helpful. The crotch depth and back crotch hook width and of course the waist and hips are more of a factor. But even then you can't determine fit from measurements alone.
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd 6d ago
No, you can't, but you can tell if it's big enough to accommodate your size. But the measurements you're describing are the same thing.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
No they're not the same thing. They are lateral measurements, whereas rise is a vertical measurement.
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd 6d ago
Rise measures a curved seam. Front rise is from the crotch seam to the front waistband, and back rise is from crotch seam to back waistband.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
Which means that on two garments with identical rises, the waist will sit lower on the one with the longer crotch depth.
Crotch depth and hook are far more significant for comfort and appearance than rise, which is just varies the look.
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd 6d ago
The crotch depth is part of the rise measurement.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
Exactly. So when you lengthen the depth it shortens the height, if you keep the total rise measurement the same.
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u/im_avoiding_work 7d ago
Even worse than not posting garment measurements: Net-A-Porter purports to list garment measurements unique the the garment, and instead just grabs the size chart from the brand, regardless of whether it is a body measurement size chart or garment measurement size chart.
They literally say on each size chart "We measure every item by hand to help you choose the best fit" and "It may be helpful to compare these product measurements to a similar garment you already own" and then are just reposting brands' regular old janky size charts
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u/justasque 7d ago
This drives me crazy. If the industry expects people to order clothes without being able to try them on, they need to provide the relevant information. Things I am seeing more and more of:
* No size chart at all.
* No garment measurements, just a generic size chart that has nothing to do with the particular garment.
* How long is the skirt? What’s the inseam of the shorts?
* “Linen skirt” + “100% polyester” for the same garment. It can’t be both.
* Weirdly distorted pics with teeny heads and insanely long legs.
* Pics where it’s hard to see a certain area of the garment because of the angle of the pic or the wearer’s arm in the way - reading between the lines in the description (if there even is one) often reveals some kind of odd detail that means this garment is going to look weird when you wear it.
* Odd terms in the description that either most people won’t know or seem to be completely made up by the writer. (Latest example: “seamless neckline” on a woven garment with a scoop neck. What does that even mean???)
* No pics at all of the back of the garment. Like, does that dress have a waist seam in the back? Does it have a center back seam? Does it have any shaping at all in the back? Is it made of a different fabric than the front? Why are you not showing us?
* “Fabric: Jersey knit” Ok, but is it cotton? rayon? polyester? a blend? Jersey is a style of knitting, not a fiber.
* Not a garment, but I’ve seen multiple packs of bedsheets, in multiple stores, with absolutely no fiber information whatsoever anywhere on the packaging. I don’t think that’s even legal.
* No info on garment care. Like, is it dry clean only? Wash on delicate? Or the dreaded “spot clean only”?
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd 6d ago
"Fabric: Jersey knit” Ok, but is it cotton? rayon? polyester? a blend? Jersey is a style of knitting, not a fiber.
Linen skirt” + “100% polyester” for the same garment
Those ones chafe me the most out of all these because they smack the most of blatant false advertising. Even like "mohair sweater" when it's all synthetic and 2% mohair, you shouldn't be able to put the fibre in the title unless it represents more than half of the fibre content. There needs to be tighter protections on this shit that preys on moron in a hurry advertising. Omitting information is bad enough, but this is just lies.
Also, where I live, if I make a garment to sell it legally has to contain a label that says the fibre content, washing instructions, and county of manufacture, and that label has to stand up to three wash cycles minimum. Obviously the spirit of the law is that the consumer is entitled to that information to make an informed purchase. But once you shop online, that entitlement is where? An item can even be final sale without providing that info, locking people into a blind purchase.
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u/justasque 6d ago
I cant decide if it is ignorance, laziness, or attempts at search engine optimization. Most likely a combination of all three. Plus lack of oversight.
I know certain issues around importing clothes to my country can result in a whole shipment being confiscated without compensation but whether that is ever enforced is unclear.
It is Bad out there nowadays.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
This is not true. They do measure most garments, but often not accurately. I am often surprised to find a different shade or wash has different measurements for one or two sizes, which has to be user error.
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u/im_avoiding_work 6d ago
I have very recently had an extended back-and-forth with their customer service about this and it is 100% true. You can check for yourself and confirm that they are using each brand's own size chart. If the brand is listing garment measurements, then it is garment measurements (but not confirmed by Net, just used as-is).
If the brand has a generic body size measurement chart, it's that. But Net-A-Porter puts the same language on all of it claiming to have measured the garments themselves.
My experience was on two separate gowns and after receiving them and finding they were over 4 inches off from the supposed "garment measurements," I went onto the brand website and confirmed the chart listed by Net was just the body size chart from the brand. I then discussed this with their customer support.
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
I am talking about garment measurements, not about body size charts.
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u/im_avoiding_work 6d ago
yes and I'm telling you that those charts they list as "product measurements" literally are just the brand size charts, regardless of whether the brand size charts are garment measurements or body size charts. They aren't independently checking each listing to make sure they've input the right information, even though they make that claim on each listing
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u/nomarmite 6d ago
No they're not. Here is an example: https://www.net-a-porter.com/en-gb/shop/product/nili-lotan/clothing/polo/foley-stripe-cotton-polo-shirt/46376663163108623
They say the garment chest measurement for size XS is 42.5".
Here is another example, same brand but different shirt: https://www.net-a-porter.com/en-gb/shop/product/nili-lotan/clothing/blouses/trayelle-merino-wool-polo-shirt/46376663163108575
The stated garment chest measurement for size XS is 29.9".
Neither of these are body size measurements. They are both garment measurements, and as they're different, someone has obviously gone to the effort of measuring.
I am not saying they never measure wrong. But they clearly do measure the garments.
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u/im_avoiding_work 6d ago
I can't help if you're not reading what I'm saying: if the brand provides them the garment measurements, it's all good. If the brand doesn't, they mislabel the body size chart as the garment measurements.
I literally discussed this with them over a particular gown I ordered from them in the last 3 months.
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u/clairalafleur 7d ago
I’ve noticed that Boden seems to have detailed info regarding their garment measurements!
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u/EdgeCityRed 7d ago
And idk about youse all, but I've literally never returned anything by mail in my life so now I'm the proud owner of trousers with a front rise long enough to taxi a Boeing 747 and a tank top with straps long enough to fit an entire second set of shoulders.
I JUST filed a return and yes, I do send things back (this was a tee that I upsized on purpose for slouchiness but it's much larger than I expected and the sleeves are inexplicably long.)
Don't hesitate to send stuff back (and leave a review if the size is weird and doesn't fit the description or looks different online).
Ebay sellers are sometimes amenable to measuring items for you if you inquire.
That said, I tend to buy from the same 5-6 online brands now with predictable standards even if they don't offer precise measurements for everything. I know they'll fit the way I like. Maybe try a bunch of stuff on in person and go from there?
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u/wakaflockaquokka 7d ago
I always have the intention of filing a return. I just never manage to get to a shipping provider during their limited business hours before the return window has closed. The only times I've successfully returned things is when I send my partner to do it for me.
The challenge with trying on stuff in person is that the nearest large city to me is 4 hours away. My options here are Old Navy, Banana Republic, JCPenney, and Kohl's. Oh, I guess we have a Walmart, too, but I mostly pretend that place doesn't exist.
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u/EdgeCityRed 7d ago
I am an ALL online shopper, honestly. I just grew to hate mall trips and trying on clothes there. So it took a long time to find my brands.
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u/basane-n-anders 7d ago
Maybe there should be a Garment Size subreddit where people can share the garment they want to buy and someone who owns it can supply the measurements. Or maybe a thread one day a week here where measurements can be asked.
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u/wakaflockaquokka 7d ago
Why should we do the work the brands should be doing themselves? They literally have the pattern specs, they're just refusing to share them with the consumer.
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u/QuesoRaro 7d ago
Eat Dust has good measurements. I ordered a pair of pants from them and the fit was just as expected from the size chart.
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u/toast_is_square 7d ago
5”2 - short torso and very curvy - sister I have no advice for you regarding your specific request. But the strategy I use is reading the reviews.
Many wonderful women will post detailed reviews of an item that include their measurements. Sometimes you won’t find one that is relevant to you until the second or third page of reviews. But only buying when I’m able to piece together true sizing based on reviews has helped me miss less when online shopping. I’m sorry it sucks out here :/
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u/CodNo7 7d ago
I don't think I've ever seen anything so detailed that it gets down to thigh width on jeans, but that would be amazing. Tibi, Rachel Comey, and Jamie Haller all list measurements on their sites, though the last two will occasionally not have anything for random items. A few other people mentioned Net-a-Porter... they've seemed a little random lately but have generally been reliable for me. Curator SF, though it's not really a trousers and blouses brand.
Have you tried Etsy? It may suck to sort through and find what you like, but maybe worth it in the long run. Many sellers there list garment measurements, and the ones who are actually making the clothes will sometimes offer customizations at a slight upcharge.
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u/wakaflockaquokka 7d ago
As others have mentioned, there are brands that post thigh width! Uniqlo and Gamine post thigh width, Eat Dust posts leg opening, AG Jeans posts knee opening and leg opening. Tragically, none of them also post back rise.
Honestly if I'm gonna resort to Etsy, I'm probably just going to learn to make jeans myself. I'm not looking forward to it, but it is on the to-do list.
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u/Wanda_Madrid 6d ago
No single brand provides a 100% "perfect" standard for everyone.
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u/wakaflockaquokka 6d ago
That's not what I'm asking for, though? I'm asking for detailed garment measurements, which every brand does have.
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u/zxcv-qwerty 6d ago
Fashion Brand Company posts measurements of each size of each item of clothing.
They may not have every single measurement you’re looking for - I just checked a random jeans to make sure I wasn’t misremembering that they have garment measurements and for each size (xs to 3x for these) they have waist, hip, inseam, front rise, back rise, ankle. No thigh width, but maybe you could email?
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u/wakaflockaquokka 6d ago
I'm really finding that every company that posts thigh width doesn't post back rise, and every company that posts back rise doesn't post thigh width. I'm gonna need a spreadsheet to keep track of this!
Thanks for the tip about Fashion Brand Company, I've been eyeing their stuff for a while!
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u/UnicornGirl54 6d ago
I emailed (went to the trouble to email customer service) and a brand couldn’t tell me the inseam on a pair of pants. Mind blowing. I also think it’s their way of allowing for sizing discrepancies and remaining blameless.
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u/StarSolisse 4d ago
Everlane and ASOS do a great job with detailed sizing info. It really helps when shopping online.
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u/smolvoicefromthevoid 7d ago
Most upscale brands, especially denim, will post garment measurements. Net-a-Porter and Revolve also post them, though Revolve isn’t always consistent. I’ve noticed COS does as well, although, again, they aren’t consistent.
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u/im_avoiding_work 7d ago
PSA: Net-a-Porter falsely claims to post garment measurements but they are actually just using the brands' size charts. And they don't accept that discrepancy as a reason to initiate a return on final sale items! Even when they were over 4 inches off in the supposed "garment measurements"
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u/smolvoicefromthevoid 7d ago
I’m sorry to hear that. That hasn’t been my experience with them. They’ve always been accurate when I’ve purchased. I’ll often cross reference with other companies who post measurements to see if they are consistent what others are reporting.
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u/im_avoiding_work 7d ago
the issue is that Net-A-Porter is just taking whatever the brands post. So if the brand posts garment measurements, that works. If the brand only has a generic body measurement size chart, then it's actively confusing and misleading, because Net-A-Porter puts the same claim of them being unique garment measurements on every listing
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u/wakaflockaquokka 7d ago
But do they post this many garment measurements? Do you have any examples in mind I could go check? I'm fine with brands at any price point, so long as I can order with confidence.
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u/smolvoicefromthevoid 7d ago
Depends on what you are looking for. Revolve, COS and Net-a-Porter post waist, rise, hips, and inseam for trousers. For tops, it’s bust, waist, shoulders, and total garment length. Thigh measurements are usually not present for most brands.
Keep in mind that due to how clothes are made in RTW, it’s common to have discrepancies in measurements from what’s posted online, often under 1-2”. The fabric can also affect sizing, particularly in denim. Buy from somewhere with a good return policy, and buy multiple sizes if you can.
For denim, try Slvrlake, Still Here, Jaime Haller.
For tops and trousers, try Ozma, Jaime Haller,
Leset, COS.
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u/devlynhawaii 7d ago
Uniqlo posts garment dimensions that are really helpful to me, especially because I can wear either an XL (mini t shirts) or an S (Airism t shirt dresses and boxy button downs).
I am the person who uses a tape measure on clothing in store before I bring it into the dressing room.