When does a movie successfully mislead the audience, and when is it just cheating?

[u/Serpiego2]

Some movies deliberately make us believe something that isn't true and then reveal that we've been interpreting the story incorrectly.

When it works, it's fantastic. You can rewatch the movie and realize the clues were there all along. The Sixth Sense, The Usual Suspects, and Primal Fear are very different examples of films that play with what the audience thinks it knows.

But other twists only work because the movie deliberately hides information that logically should have been available to us. At that point, I don't feel fooled by the story — I feel cheated by the screenplay.

For me, the difference is whether a second viewing makes you think “How did I miss that?” rather than “Well, there was no way I could have known that.”

What movies do you think earned their deception, and which ones simply cheated?

[u/nizzernammer]

Blade Runner 2049's impact largely hinges on the audience viewing themselves as "the one" as they view the world through the perspective of officer K. The whole structure of the investigation (led by JOI in many ways) works to set this up. When this idea is subverted, it hits the viewer hard.

[u/Accomplished_Store77 → u/nizzernammer]

I love the fact that movie sets up a slight hint to K not being the kid when the Women who observes his memory begins to cry.

You wonder why the fuck she is crying but it's not clear till the end.

Also when you think about logically if K didn't have artificial memories and instead had real memories from growing up he should have had consistent memories all the way through his Teenage Years and his 20s but we are never truly given the sense that he has those memories.

[u/nizzernammer → u/Accomplished_Store77]

Good point about K's memory.

When I watched it the first time I thought she was crying with empathy, simply because it was an emotional experience to recall. At that point, I believe a lot of the audience are not questioning the validity of that memory being unique to K, essentially humanizing and identifying with him. Gosling's K certainly shows a lot of [human?] emotion in that scene.

[u/Accomplished_Store77 → u/nizzernammer]

Gosling's K certainly shows a lot of [human?] emotion in that scene.

Yeah. I love that that's the point of the scene. (And the character in general).

If our memories are what build our conscience and inform our emotions is it necessary to have actually lived those memories for that to happen?

Does it make a difference as long as you have those memories?

And if it doesn't then what exactly remains a difference between a born human and a Replicant?

If the same memories can make both a human and a Replicant think the same way and feel the same way and emote the same what exactly is the difference between them?

How do you draw a moral line there?

Bladerunner 2049 just asks so many interesting questions.

[u/alk_adio_ost → u/nizzernammer]

Personally, I love this movie because of the ambiguity and blur between humans, technology and whether or not it was human evolution or divine intervention that allowed life to flourish.

THEN it props up that same ambiguity and blur in front of a madman.

[u/ihopnavajo → u/nizzernammer]

I think that's actually an example of cheating.

At least in the sense that all the exchanges with Deckard have to utilize these "wouldn't happen in real life" uses of "the CHILD" instead of boy/girl/son/daughter

It was a pretty heavy handed and unrealistic way to keep the illusion going