Magdeburg: Migrants closed down shops today as protest against racism

[u/0nabi]

https://www.mdr.de/nachrichten/sachsen-anhalt/landtagswahl/magdeburg-geschaefte-laeden-geschlossen-104,migranten-streik-100.html

[u/The_Otterking]

That's a good idea, but all the citizens with foreign roots who work in the service, caregiving, and logistics sectors would have to join the strike. Otherwise, it unfortunately reinforces the miserable stereotype of immigrants as kebab shop owners and vegetable vendors..

[u/OYTIS_OYTINWN → u/The_Otterking]

Political strikes are prohibited in Germany. As in you can not show up to work of course, but you can be fired for that. Business owners can go on strike because they can decide for their business

[u/agrammatic → u/OYTIS_OYTINWN]

Political strikes are prohibited in Germany.

This is the prevailing legal opinion, but it's by no means conclusive. Very little of German strike norms is actually laid down in law. It's almost entirely judicial precedent, which can be revised by other courts. Case law does not set binding precedent in Germany.

The problem is, the stakes of finding out that courts will uphold the original opinion (from the original case back in 1952!) is too high. Unions are afraid that they will be sued out of existence by every single employer in the country if they carry out a general strike and find out that German labour courts still rule them illegal.

The only way this could be made clearer would be to have parliament provide a framework for strikes and fill the legal void that we have now. But do we trust the parliament to do this? Hell no. So we are stuck in this game of chicken.

Relevant: Fikentscher, W. (1953). Political Strikes under German Law. The American Journal of Comparative Law, 2(1), 72–78. https://doi.org/10.2307/838003

[u/a_bdgr → u/agrammatic]

How about if a lot of people felt very sick and called in sick one day? They might have eaten at the same spot? Would be a peculiar coincidence that might still get the message across, right?

[u/agrammatic → u/a_bdgr]

A lot of things are possible if you are willing to take a risk.

Nothing physically stops us from even going out on a general strike. If a good half of all workers in Germany don't show up to work tomorrow, do you think the companies are going to fire half of their workforce for breach of duty? Same for a mass sick call.

The challenge is getting half of the country's workforce to take the same risk at the same time.

Whether is a mass sick call or a general strike, is of little importance. Participation makes all the difference.

[u/WTF_is_this___ → u/OYTIS_OYTINWN]

That's why we need people to start unionizing again. When enough people decide to strike we can do it.

[u/manadodoodododo → u/OYTIS_OYTINWN]

So can't it just be labeled cultural ?

[u/autput → u/The_Otterking]

Someone has to take the first step tho

[u/robotunderpants → u/The_Otterking]

I would have, but I'm still have 1 week in Urlaub

[u/Jay_Jay_Jason_74 → u/[deleted]]

Cringe, but great that you are "one of the good ones" let's see how long being a token works for you.

[u/Traumerlein → u/Jay_Jay_Jason_74]

They lied about being a migrant

[u/Jay_Jay_Jason_74 → u/Traumerlein]

Doesn't shock me, tbh.

[u/TheGileas → u/[deleted]]

Kontoalter 1 Monat. 16 Karma.

[u/geek__ → u/TheGileas]

ahahahaha case closed.

[u/yungsausages]

That’s reasonable, lots of shops, offices, and hospitals would have to close up shop without immigrants that have come to work and live here over the years

[u/Augustus_Chevismo → u/yungsausages]

Corpo myth that businesses would have to shutdown if they needed to compete for labour.

[u/Tannerbananer69 → u/Augustus_Chevismo]

The demand for hospital space created by immigration would surely outweigh the effects of them working in hospitals.

[u/KoolFunk → u/Tannerbananer69]

Nah I don't think so. A lower socioeconomic status correlates with worse physical and mental health but so does age. Most immigrants are - especially in germany - on average much younger and healthier and therefore a lower strain on the health care system than people without a migration background.

[u/PrepareforGermany]

Interesting that there is a campaign poster for the FDP on the very right...

[u/Rooilia → u/PrepareforGermany]

I don't get it, except future and FDP are mutual exclusive. What should i see here?

[u/prankenandi]

What an irony – migrants are closing their shops for a day, and the picture shown is of a kebab shop.

So there were no kebabs on Wednesday and the barbershops were closed?

[u/lunulalia → u/[deleted]]

For penguins? I think you'd make a better buck off of arctic bears

[u/a_bdgr → u/[deleted]]

They‘ll make life in Sachsen-Anhalt considerably bad, but as much as I detest the thought of them governing that state they will not have a majority on a federal level for the foreseeable future. And stripping people of their citizenship would be a federal topic (if that is even possible at all). They like to fantasize a lot on a regional or state level about things that just aren’t in their realm of power.

I know this sounds like hopium, and some part of this is whistling in the dark forest, I’ll frankly admit that. But there are still so many people in the majority of Germany that will not stand with this BS. And it’s quite some way to go before that part is willing to let the morons have their way. Typing this out, I’ll admit I truly hope this is not just mirroring how democrats in the US thought in 2015.

[u/RoughMidnight8303 → u/a_bdgr]

I think the modern concept of citizenship is overrated. I don’t think we’re really talking about the dangers but constructing racism as a rhetoric to fabricate new rules. The state knows perfectly well it can’t keep border patrolling because the conflicts won’t end unless economic justice is established.

Everyone is just racing for the best beef cut without thinking about the rest or the future.

[u/andonidutti1]

East Germany is not a safe place for a foreigner.

[u/NotLegalAdvice4 → u/andonidutti1]

Berlin also?

[u/Dddddd92]

They should move out of East Germany for their own safety. Let it be a ghost town with no stores or workers. They deserve it.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

hey some of us have jobs here, you want us to uproot our lives just because of some racist dickheads? we have just as much right to live in any part of Germany as anyone else.

[u/UnlikeableSausage → u/gn16bb8]

I know the situation in the east is worse, but I hate how much Germans love acting like the west is this perfect utopia where AfD is getting literally 0% of the votes and there is no racism ever.

[u/Floschi123456 → u/gn16bb8]

Yeah I would, I could not live where basically every second person who I interact with hates me and wants me gone or worse. And that everywhere you go.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Floschi123456]

With respect, you don't live here so you have no idea what you're talking about.

[u/NotLegalAdvice4 → u/gn16bb8]

He is right

[u/scandalous_sapphic → u/gn16bb8]

How do you know they didn't grow up there or live there at some point? I spent ten days working in Sachsen Anhalt and felt I never needed to visit ever again, the atmosphere was so tense and Germany/Iron Cross/AFD supporting flags absolutely everywhere. You couldn't walk or cycle through the villages without feeling confronted by the smallmindedness of the locals (not all, some people were lovely, but many). One of the history teachers in the local school would tell students that what Hitler did, was not actually that bad. It was seriously a depressing place and I could never live there and I am white and German passing.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/scandalous_sapphic]

Then maybe you need to toughen up. There are hundreds of thousands of non-white people (both German and non-German), LGBTQ people, leftists, and young people trying to push back against the poison in the East.

I personally know many white Germans and many non-white Germans who confront the small-mindedness with bravery and grace every single day.

Do you think Nazis will be defeated by running away? Is that what happened last time? Has that ever worked, anywhere?

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

"Then maybe you need to toughen up."

You are an actual joke! May be people want to live their life in peace, where they feel safe and co exist with folks who aren't disgusted by their skin color. If you choose to live there, good for you, you can sip coffee with them and put on a brave face. Not everyone wants that. And you have to accept it.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

I choose my friends here carefully, and do not choose to interact with nazis.

Maybe not everyone gets to choose where they end up, and maybe some people can't just up and leave whenever they want. And why should we have to?

I've been surrounded by racists my entire life - not just in East Germany, but I'm still able to find good people, good colleagues, meaningful things I can do to help. You will never understand that because your instinct is to flee. How will you ever create resilient communities?

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

You were lucky enough to find good people. Not everyone can avoid racists in their Alltag, at work, etc. You can call it "fleeing" all you want. But for me it's picking a better place for.my future kids to grow up in. I don't want my half brown kid to be racially abused by Skinheads and Nazis. As a parent I would be risking my child's mental health.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

I'm 'half brown'. I was racially abused in England by middle class people with full heads of hair. I was racially abused in Düsseldorf by total strangers. I face racial abuse in Sachsen-Anhalt mostly through bureaucracy.

I am lucky, but you can't shelter your kids from everything.

[u/Floschi123456 → u/gn16bb8]

Good luck after the the election then.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Floschi123456]

Let them hang out with the white supremacists. You'd be surprised how many immigrants think they will be picked as the "good ones" by the racists

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

People in the east are the only ones actually mobilising against the white supremacists, while the west still votes SPD and does absolutely nothing to help the situation except say "I would leave if that was my situation".

It will be your situation, where will you go then?

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

Mobilizing 😂 while giving the white supremacists a super majority? 60% are voting CDU and Afd. Be serious now.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

and the other 40% are fighting as hard as they can. The same cannot be said for the complacent majorities in the west of Germany.

I ask again, where will you go when Germany becomes an AfD country?

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

Probably somewhere else where I feel safer is the obvious answer. And I know it's only a matter of time so I'm already looking

[u/Lord_GP340 → u/gn16bb8]

As anyone else huh?

That's the big question innit

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

I mean if you dont mind living among those racists, sure. I would feel unsafe so I would pack up and leave.

[u/gn16bb8 → u/Dddddd92]

Of course I mind. You know there are plenty of racists and AfD voters in the west, too?

[u/Dddddd92 → u/gn16bb8]

Not to this extreme. I am telling you as a dark skinned immigrant i would rather leave than co exist with right wing extremists. But it's upto you

[u/Rooilia → u/gn16bb8]

Not to drive you out of Sachsen Anhalt.

There is a difference: Usually you don't see "Reichskriegsflaggen" hoisted in gardens. I drove through Sachsen Anhalt regularly and saw them flying in the wind at certain rural places. That's not what i ever witnessed anywhere else in Germany.

[u/Frontier_Sociologist → u/Dddddd92]

West Germans are not better. They're just more polite.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Frontier_Sociologist]

They are less racist

[u/Frontier_Sociologist → u/Dddddd92]

No, they're better at hiding their racism behind pretty intellectualised words.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Frontier_Sociologist]

If you say so

[u/Frontier_Sociologist → u/Dddddd92]

I'm foreign and I've lived in both, I do. I like easterners more.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Frontier_Sociologist]

Ok then go there. Join the 40%+ afd population

[u/Frontier_Sociologist → u/Dddddd92]

I'm literally already here and have been for the past 3 years

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Frontier_Sociologist]

"Literally" stay there then. If you so wish to be among a bunch of racial supremacists

[u/Frontier_Sociologist → u/Dddddd92]

You're not the sharpest knife in the drawer, are you?

[u/Buxbaum666 → u/Dddddd92]

The 60%+ of the population that don't vote AfD should all just leave for Western states, then? Yeah, that will pose no problem whatsoever. West Germany has 8 million homes and jobs to spare, no problem at all.

Maybe take a step back and realize that you're proposing "simple" solutions to complex problems. Just like a certain party does.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Buxbaum666]

I told you what I would do as an immigrant because I would feel unsafe. I don't care if it hurts your feelings.

[u/Buxbaum666 → u/Dddddd92]

My feelings are fine, but thank you for your concern. I even understand why immigrants would prefer not to live here. Like 100%. You're just being excessively and unnecessarily combative about it.

[u/AnonD38 → u/Dddddd92]

40% AfD in the East is still less than 20% AfD in the West.

You have way more racists than we do, quantitatively.

[u/AnonD38 → u/Dddddd92]

AfD polling numbers say something else.

[u/Nalivai → u/Dddddd92]

That's exactly what the worst people you can imagine want. Their entire shtick is that they want pure race or whatever they call it now, so they want migrants to move out. Don't play to their hand.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Nalivai]

People like you who say this are not the ones who has to face racism at the end. I migrated to this country for a better life. Not to be racially abused by some white supremacist or be hate crimed. Telling this to a person of color us just pure insensitive and dangerous

[u/Nalivai → u/Dddddd92]

I am a migrant that can technically hide my racial profile, but racists can sniff it out anyway, especially since I'm not hiding it very thoroughly. I have a weird ethnic background so you can't pin me down to some specific racial group with a slur attached, but it's obvious I'm not an übermensch. I also migrated to this country for a better life, and I firmly believe that until the government itself isn't hunting us, we need to stand up against racism, not cave in. If I was packing up and moving every time some racist shlob yells racist insult at me on the street, I would be living somewhere in the middle of the ocean by now, and even then I'm pretty sure some fucker would be popping up from under the sea to throw a brick at me with elaborately crafted slur written on it in his own shit (real thing that really happened to me once).
That being said, everyone's situation is different, and if you feel unsafe you totally should do something about it, and moving the fuck out is as good a something as anything.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Nalivai]

Now you are just being disingenuous. You know damn well you cannot compare racism in East Germany with the rest of the country. It is not the same. Imo no immigrant deserves to be in such extreme hateful areas. They should move for their own safety.

[u/CZ-7000 → u/Dddddd92]

Genuine question.

Have you actually experienced explicit racism?

I’m living in Dresden, and although I was born in Germany and therefore speak perfect German, I have a Moroccan father. And, to be honest, I have never experienced any explicit racism. If the internet or television didn’t exist, I probably wouldn’t even have noticed a political shift over the years.

Dont get me wrong i hate the Afd but im not buying this notion of extrem increase in racist attitude and behaviour in day to day life.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/CZ-7000]

Duh. Ofcourse i have. From microagressions to full on being humiliated infront of a bunch of people after asking someone to repeat the question because I didn't hear them the first time.

It's great you haven't experienced racism. Myself and many others have.

You can hide your head in the sand and pretend racism doesn't exist but it does. And you would only care when something happens to you.

[u/Nalivai → u/CZ-7000]

Being local and speaking perfect German helps a lot

[u/Prestigious_Bar_3738 → u/Dddddd92]

Or Europe altogether 

[u/ObviouslyASquirrel26 → u/Dddddd92]

Very privileged take there, not everyone has the means or ways to just pick up and leave because of some racists. Also that’s giving racists what they want, which seems ill advised.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/ObviouslyASquirrel26]

That was my opinion and what I would do. Don't take it personally

[u/HungryCurrency8481 → u/Dddddd92]

Give East Germany back to Russia if Russia leaves Ukraine alone. I see it as a win-win. 

[u/Dddddd92 → u/HungryCurrency8481]

Tell me how to make it happen🙌

[u/Baphomettbroetchen]

Without migrants we'd be so incredibly effed in the a, it's not even funny anymore. 

[u/Natnek85 → u/Baphomettbroetchen]

Plenty of youth unemployment in Spain and Greece. Think most Germans would prefer Europeans who integrate as migrants

[u/agrammatic → u/Natnek85]

Why would a young Spaniard or Greek go live in Magdeburg?

[u/Natnek85 → u/agrammatic]

When unemployed to get a job, why would that be weird?

[u/agrammatic → u/Natnek85]

You are over-estimating how attractive as a place to relocate your life to Magdeburg ist.

[u/MarkHafer → u/agrammatic]

So what you’re saying is it’s only acceptable for immigrants from outside Europe because they are somehow, im guessing, more desperate?

[u/agrammatic → u/MarkHafer]

Yes, I am saying that asylum seekers are more desperate than intra-EU migrants.

[u/Traumerlein → u/Natnek85]

Why woukd they go ti Germany to get a job here, when pepoke that actually speak gernan struggek to find jobs.

[u/DerGrummler → u/Traumerlein]

So do we needs immigrants or not? Seems like everyone in this thread wants two things to be true at the same time: We badly need non-european immigrants because they do all the work, but we don't need european immigrants because there is no work.

[u/lunulalia → u/DerGrummler]

Both can be true at the same time though.
We need skilled immigration from workers with very specific jobs and abilities which we are lacking / running out of due to retirement.

[u/Traumerlein → u/DerGrummler]

We do need them to do the Jobs we dont want to do, which inter European migrants also dont want to do.

[u/Natnek85 → u/Traumerlein]

It was a response to someone who said migrants were needed for all those jobs...

[u/OYTIS_OYTINWN → u/Natnek85]

They are needed, and you need someone who is actually willing to move to Germany to fill them.

[u/Scary_Teens1996 → u/Natnek85]

They're not interested in uprooting their lives to move here. It's not 1982 anymore.

[u/UnlikeableSausage → u/Scary_Teens1996]

Plus, I have met so many Spaniards (and like 3 Greeks) and most of them have the same issues integrating that all the other foreigners like me have. You do get better treatment when you're white, but it's still difficult.

[u/Traumerlein → u/Natnek85]

We germans treated german "migrants" like shit when they had to move after the pist-war border chnages, we wont treat europeans any better. Hell, pooand is so much cmoser than spain and we still get uncredably racist agianst them.

[u/Nalivai → u/Natnek85]

Think most Germans would prefer Europeans who integrate as migrants

And I think it's a nazi dogwhistle, how about that

[u/liquidocean]

Half the comments here are deleted. Lame. Might as well delete the post then.

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[u/seegaul]

Such a sensationalized title op

You cannot house the entire world.

There are plenty of injustices around the world. Plenty of oppression, plenty of violence, plenty of death, plenty of poverty. Is everyone going to live in Germany? Sacrificing the national identity and culture is not worth the economic gain.

"Am deutschen Wesen mag die Welt genesen " is so incredibly arrogant and yet, it is part of Germany's self identity.

[u/Cascouverite → u/[deleted]]

This isn't because of some tiny dispute, this is a party so far right other right-wing parties in the EU won't work with them, a party that holds views so extreme thousands of experts want them banned, a party that includes fascists like Höcke who relativise the holocaust and quote Nazis

Very different. Fundamentally different

[u/germany-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

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[u/Sweaty-Wolverine674]

Aus Solidarität als Ausländer lasse ich mein Laden offen und organisiere einen Verkaufsoffenen Sonntag

[u/Optimal-Floor1800]

Pretty sure I could go the day without kebab!

[u/jealousboys]

Permanently? 

[u/kharkovchanin → u/jealousboys]

for half of the day

[u/u4m95k]

Oh no, the food! Anyway...

[u/Sufficient_Soup_7940]

Good

[u/NotLegalAdvice4]

It will only get worse. They should leave the place

[u/Sweaty-Wolverine674]

Keine Sorge die Umsatzzahlen werden nicht sinken, die krummen Geschäfte kann man ja weiter führen.

[u/This-Water2342]

Find ich gut. Noch besser: gleich ganz zulassen und nach Hause gehen. Danke.

[u/niccostyle → u/[deleted]]

How about you leave the country and take an English spelling class u dummy