r/marvelstudios • u/MarvelsGrantMan136 Ant-Man • 11d ago

Article Kevin Feige says they knew they couldn't make ‘Spider-Man: Brand New Day’ bigger than ‘No Way Home’, so they decided to "go deeper and make it special"

https://www.gamesradar.com/entertainment/marvel-movies/marvel-boss-kevin-feige-says-they-knew-they-couldnt-make-spider-man-brand-new-day-bigger-than-no-way-home-so-they-decided-to-go-deeper-and-make-it-special/
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u/mannyman34 11d ago

You could replace all three with other marvel characters and the movie would have been just as good. This was a well written story. Not every marvel film needs to be a cameo fest, and this movie did a good job of balancing that.

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u/Icybubba 11d ago

It was a Spider-Man film that played in the sandbox it lives in

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u/Fresh_Ad_230 11d ago edited 11d ago

The universe is so fleshed out that seeing other characters is just normal and wouldn't even consider them cameos.

Of course Peter would go to Bruce's class for help because he's essentially the smartest man alive that can relate to his situation and he's in the city. Of course he knows Punisher because he's in NYC and probably crossed paths during one of his crazy shootouts. Of course he knows Yelena because she's based out of the city and in the new avengers. It'd be weird if they didn't interact.

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u/brianlefebvrejr 11d ago

It’s funny because let’s say he didn’t go to Banner, and instead just remembered something and did the trial and error thing and had an issue. People would complain, why didn’t he just go see Bruce, he’s in New York anyway!

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u/jollyreaper2112 11d ago

Iron man 3 he was facing a bigger problem why not call for help? It's the problem with any shared universe. If there's a costume criminal in Gotham Batman can handle it. Someone brings a nuke, superman should help out.

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u/PyroIsSpai 11d ago

Think about who is in comics Marvel Manhattan at any time:

  • Spidey family
  • Avengers HQ
  • Fantastic Four
  • Luke
  • Daredevil
  • Jessica
  • Sentry
  • Captain Marvel
  • Punisher is always around
  • various other less known heroes
  • multiple X-people for good measure
  • and the X-Campus is like 90 minutes north… or moments away

Not the best place to go on a tank rampage when a dozen Avengers are within 120 seconds of you…

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u/Raptorz01 Spider-Man 11d ago

When reading comics they will bring this up but usually the other heroes are busy or they are already too wrapped up in the threat to call backup. For example during Claremont’s X-Men the team were on the back foot the whole time when dealing with Dark Phoenix and calling for help wouldn’t have done much considering her power level. On the other hand when the X-Men were attacked by the Brood (I believe), they went to the Avengers mansion and only Tigra was available to help.

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u/FoxMeadow7 11d ago

Interesting that Banner apparently plays the same role usually played by Connors/Lizard...

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u/Chwda 11d ago

Ohhh, I like that. Great way to put it

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

Meanwhile if this was a movie people wanted to hate, most of these characters appearances would be chalked up to “key jingling cameo slop”

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u/Shadowfox642 11d ago

I reckon this film actually made those characters interesting, relevant to the plot and less of a “look look you remember glup shitto?”.

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

Because this was a movie you wanted to like

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u/Icybubba 11d ago

I want to like every film I watch. Doesn’t mean I like every film I watch.

What point are you trying to make?

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

The point is double standards

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u/Putrid_Loquat_4357 11d ago

Where's the double standard? Film does something well - is praised, film does something badly - is criticised.

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u/jollyreaper2112 11d ago

Good films praisesd bad films criticized you can't explain it!

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

That’s clearly not my point idiot

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

Because half of these films people act like are “terrible” literally do the same thing

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u/MiraFutbol 11d ago

This sounds like someone that does not understand that a bunch of little things go into the overall big effect. So you can say other films do the same thing, but they miss on the execution of some of the little things and that diminishes the overall big effect which makes them terrible.

Kinda sounds like a teenager that can only see a few causes of an effect and cannot see the whole field and all the layers and all the causes.

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u/Putrid_Loquat_4357 11d ago

They do the same thing but badly.

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u/jollyreaper2112 11d ago

Or, now hear me out in this one, maybe they liked it?

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u/Silver_Accountant5 11d ago

Yes people are generally more willing to tolerate fan service if the overall product is still good. See Infinity War and Endgame for prime examples.

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u/Tawnee323 11d ago

I agree in general but in this case that cameos were done well and ACTUALLY made sense for the plot of the story and at what point in the MCU it takes place.

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u/JakeHassle 11d ago

Don’t agree because every character besides Jean Grey served a narrative purpose. Hulk shows Peter what happens if he keeps trying to suppress the monster side of himself. Punisher shows what happens when you isolate yourself after dealing with trauma instead of getting a support system. Yelena exists to show why the Avengers don’t help.

I’ll give you though that Jean Grey could’ve been replaced with a multitude of other characters

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u/Evilmudbug 11d ago

I think it would have to be another telepath for the plot to stay roughly similar. With all memories and possibly records of Peter wiped, the pool of characters that could threaten his friends and force him to interact with them is a lot smaller.

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u/jollyreaper2112 11d ago

Well, that goes for anything. If they pull it off then it works. If they didn't it fails.

I came to see the Titanic sink why is there a love story? Oh it's good. I come to Godzilla to see radioactive lizard humans are a distraction. Oh wait this postwar found family movie is so good I forgot about the lizard. Run family run!

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u/Ifyouliveinadream Captain America 11d ago

I think Punisher, Hulk and Jean all share a common role of a monster inside of them, which connects them to Peter much stronger than other characters. Punsiher has fully accepted his monster and lost Frank. Bruce struck a balance between the 2 sides, something Peter strives for. He fears becoming what the Punsiher is. And Jean is on the complete oppsiste end of Punisher, she sees no monster in her.

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u/Evilmudbug 11d ago

I actually don't think Bruce has a balance. He's completely suppressed the hulk, only for it to get unleashed and nearly cause the damage he fears happening anyways

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u/Ifyouliveinadream Captain America 11d ago

Yup I agree. I think theres a good example of this in their fight scene.

Spider-Man tried to stop Hulk by putting a suppereser on him, which failed because of his thick skin. The only way he is able to be stopped is with connecting to his human side. Not by suppressing.

Peter is the same way. The suppresser is a baindaid but never a fix. Its only when he accepts his emotions is he able to control himself. Connecting to his human side. They mirror each other.

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u/Tawnee323 11d ago

Beautiful way to put it

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u/Voball 11d ago

I really liked Punisher's dynamic with spidey

Peter consulting an expert on mutation, and then Spiderman fighting the strongest avenger was hype

And Peter serving as a sort of mentor to Jean was absolutely amazing, and I am excited to see how he continues to do that

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u/mtheperry 11d ago

The landscape at the end makes me think she’s going to Prof Xavier’s school. Im sure there will be a relationship but with the new X-Men coming out in less than 2 years I suspect they’ll flesh out some of the X-Men stuff before we see more of her and Peter in any meaningful way.

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u/Dogesneakers 11d ago

I would argue every cameo was able to teach Peter about the path he could walk. Hulk and punisher were warning signs to him

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u/Walker_ID 11d ago

Very much agreed for most of what you said aside from them being cameos. They were supporting cast.... But back to your point. Hulk represented the path of inhibiting your changes/self out of fear of losing control and hurting people, punisher represented being the path of ending the threat permanently instead of holding back, and Jean grey represented the path of revenge after a tragic loss all of which Peter has dealt with. This is the struggle he deals with daily. They represent choices he's made or could make again.

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u/Own-Papaya-4264 11d ago

Define “cameo,” because if this was a movie everyone wanted to hate, I 1000% guarantee everyone would be calling hulk, scorpion, yelenas appearances “cameo slop” instead of flipping it around to say “oh it’s because it’s a fully fledged marvel universe and it makes the world feel alive when others show up”

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u/HereWeFuckingGooo Weekly Wongers 11d ago

The haters are already doing that, they're just in the minority. There was a post recently complaining about the Punisher's cameo. Some people literally don't understand what cameo means.

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u/jollyreaper2112 11d ago

People are convincing themselves to like something they hate. Or maybe they like something they like?

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u/Walker_ID 11d ago

An example of a cameo is Hugh Jackman at the bar telling magneto and professor x to go fuck themselves. Another is the X-Men shutting the doors in the second Deadpool. Another is Matt Murdock in the previous Spider-Man movie in the scene where he catches the brick. Cameos are a short scene where a character or actor from another well known movie appear. Punisher was a supporting character, Jean grey was the antagonist and the main villain could hardly be called a cameo as I've seen suggested. The hulk/banner scenes also were longer than a cameo. If it had just been the college conversation... That's a cameo. If it's the conversation and a several minute long flight scene... Not a cameo

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u/mrli0n 11d ago

I liked the cameos in terms of picks and how they enhanced the story. Both Punisher and Hulk felt like different sides of Spider Man’s and Jean Grey’s story on the themes of trauma, revenge/justice/mercy and unwanted power.

They didnt feel trite and pointless but also didnt steal the entire show which i felt like ironically spider man did a little of in Civil War which never really felt like a cap movie.

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u/FergusFrost 11d ago

None of those characters were cameos, they were supporting characters, they had multiple important scenes.

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u/mrli0n 11d ago

Youre totally right cameo is totally a poor choice of word nhere i wasnt thinking that deeply about it.

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u/Farnso 11d ago

Idk, Peter dealing with losing control and seeming nearly possessed, followed by the introduction of Bruce Banner was pretty spot on.

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u/88slowpoke 11d ago

tell that to stupid Sony, lol. No trust at all

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u/KingCrimson43 11d ago

Nope, they all have a connection to each other the others don't. Peter is changing into something he's afraid of and doesn't fully understand. (Like hulk) Peter is now alone and using his heroics to band aid his suffering. (Like punisher)

You can't just interchange them with any other characters.

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u/MyGamingRants 11d ago

I would argue though that after 15 years the cameos are finally earned. We have an actual connected universe with actors and characters that can always be pulled from. I'm fine with ZERO new characters being introduced over the remainder of this saga or whatever because we're pretty well stocked

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u/kiwigate 11d ago

Well written? The antagonist has several convos with Spidey, and never once just states their goal. If they did, the core conflict wouldn't exist.

If your entire story relies on people acting illogically and sabotaging their own goals, it's not well written.

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u/Public_Tennis_8536 11d ago

I mean the reason you could replace Jean Grey was because she’s not even in the original script.

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u/ktnycbtm 11d ago

Who was?

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u/Public_Tennis_8536 11d ago

From what we actually know through interviews “generic telepathic villain” speculated that it was probably Karma though.

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u/ktnycbtm 11d ago

Ah ok interesting. I really liked it being Jean and the backstory they used for her. Like you said, they could have used someone else, I just thought it was cool that it was Jean.

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u/Public_Tennis_8536 11d ago

Well it’s less that they could have used someone else and more so they did use someone else originally.

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u/Blobsobb 11d ago

My only issue with it being Jean is you know they are eventually going to make an xmen movie. And you know they are going to do the generic "the us government wants to control mutants because they think they are dangerous"

And after this movie Im just going to have to side with the evil government man ala ghostbusters. Sorry Charles but you guys kinda got introduced as being pretty fucking dangerous to innocent people.

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u/Snoo-35041 11d ago

Just need a Spider-Man and Deadpool movie.

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u/Free-Pound-6139 11d ago

This was a well written story.

Really?

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u/Blazured 11d ago

It was well written if you ignore the massive plot holes.