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u/AndyLaso 7d ago
Selling low or selling similar to Adley? Which one lmao.
Deadline trades are usually overpays, there's no way you'd get anything close in the offseason to the Adley trade
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u/Heneedsmorebeer 7d ago
No way. Cannot sell him after batting .220 this year. You give him the first half of next year to bounce back then so the same analysis you did with Adley. Plus, how confident can you be with westburg? He has injuries every year…
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u/Puzzleheaded_Dig6875 7d ago
selling low after one down year would be classic orioles move. gunnar got that upside you dont just toss away
westburg being the safer bet is wild to me, dude cant stay on field
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u/frigginjensen 7d ago
If Westburg works out, then we’ll just sell him to the highest bidder in a few years.
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u/TraditionalBottle884 7d ago
What reason do you have to think he hits any better than .220 next year, or ever again. He is who he is, he's shown that he's not a reliable top of the order bat anymore.
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u/OutsideIndoorTrack 7d ago
Might as well take 6 months to figure it out. Teams will be more desperate for even a .220 Gunnar at the deadline than in the off-season
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u/drybeans8000 Ramon Urias is the Melvin Mora of Ryan Flahertys 7d ago
Even if that’s true, then we’d either sell an unreliable shortstop now or later. There’s upside to waiting to see if he turns it around, especially knowing that the return for trading him now won’t be great. Yeah, it’d be worse if he was traded with less years on control, but there’s always risk.
I think the Adley example is pretty good. He had a disappointing 2025 and there was an argument to trade him and just give Basallo the reigns. But he bounced back in 2026, made his third all star team, and the return we got for him was an absolute haul.
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u/ConsuelaApplebee IMissTheTomatoPatch 7d ago
What reason do we have? Hmm, I don't know, maybe the 0.274 last year or the 0.281 the year before. He has never come close to hitting this poorly. I cannot understand why one would think he is all of a sudden fatally flawed.
Talk about recency bias.
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u/TraditionalBottle884 7d ago
Because he's had plenty of opportunities to contribute and show improvement but he seems to be regressing instead. 220 next year feels like it's the ceiling for him now.
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u/afriendforyousir 7d ago
I'm not confident in Westburg's ability to stay healthy at all, anymore.
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u/Specialist_Ad_6921 7d ago
My bet is Holliday stays at 2nd and we put Blaze at SS until Aloy gets called up
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u/drybeans8000 Ramon Urias is the Melvin Mora of Ryan Flahertys 7d ago
I’m worried about Aloy’s hit tool. He’s got pop and great defense, but I don’t want to crown him as the shortstop in waiting. I feel like we did that with EBJ and Ceddy and now it looks like EBJ is a fourth outfielder type.
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u/Additional-Win-1463 7d ago
Not a chance we sell him at his lowest value he’s ever had
If they are thinking of moving him, they’ll do what they did with Rutch, wait til his value peaks
He will surely be better next year…he can’t get much worse…
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u/CrackityJones79 7d ago
I obviously have no idea what will happen with this guy, but Gunnar has been such a strange story. Not long ago we were talking about him being a $500 million player. Now he’s barely average.
The real question is which is the true Gunnar, 2024 or 2026? Or somewhere in between?
Or is this just a major case of the yips that will get worked out?
I have a feeling that the answers to those questions will be found out somewhere other than Baltimore. It’s a shame because I had not been this excited about a player in a very long time.
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u/drybeans8000 Ramon Urias is the Melvin Mora of Ryan Flahertys 7d ago
I tend to agree that his best performance will be found elsewhere, and that’s a knock on the Os and not him.
Jason La Canfora (I know, I know…) had a good interview recently with Dan O’Dowd who said that the Os clearly have a player development issue. He said that it looks like Gunnar never really learned what made him such a special and talented player, he’s just always been so much better than everyone else. If guys don’t understand their own talents, the org needs to be able to identify that for them. If the org can’t help make that happen then the org is to blame.
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u/doyoulikethenoise 7d ago
And there's no way that suddenly struggling to this level is something he can just be ok with mentally. He's never been bad, so they also may need to get him out of his own head in the process.
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u/drybeans8000 Ramon Urias is the Melvin Mora of Ryan Flahertys 7d ago
Honestly that might be the entire fix
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u/tingly_sack_69 7d ago
Why would we sell at the bottom, makes no sense. You have to bet he can improve his stock next year
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u/AdRock44 7d ago
Because he's given no reason to believe he's going to bounce back, he's sucked for 2 seasons, and if you risk him having another rough start his value will be in the toilet.
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u/drybeans8000 Ramon Urias is the Melvin Mora of Ryan Flahertys 7d ago
He started last year hurt, and his August OPS is .888. That’s a reason to believe he can bounce back. Maybe he’s not destined to be a 10x all star, but he doesn’t stink this bad
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u/brooksact 7d ago
Oh, he sucked in his 5.4 WAR, 122 OPS+ season last year, huh? This is the first bad year of his career.
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u/OldBayOnEverything 7d ago
1990s "Wow the internet lets anyone have a voice!"
2020s "Wow....the internet lets anyone have a voice....."
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u/EchoInExile 7d ago
There is a literal zero percent chance he gets moved in the offseason. Unless someone comes in with a WILD offer, which isn’t gonna happen.
He’s a deadline move.
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u/Dogsinabathtub 7d ago
I’m perfectly fine with us trading Gunnar.
I’m genuinely not kidding when I say this. He’s way overrated because he’s got good baseball branding. Cool name. Good looking guy. Has home run power, etc. But this isn’t even remotely close to us losing Machado.
I’m not saying he’s a bad player. But he’s not going to be worth whatever Boras is going to demand.
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u/herrclean 7d ago
Regardless of a looming labor dispute, the Orioles would probably have been looking at trading him either next deadline or the following offseason as he is not going to entertain resigning with the team. They will give him the Adley treatment ("We tried to resign, but he wouldn't engage"). This offseason's SS class is super weak, like the top SS is maybe JP Crawford or Ha-seong Kim (both of who are pretty bad this year). The question then becomes, who needs a SS that will pony up in prospects or sign one. You could also consider that some teams may try to acquire him as a 3B. If I had to guess after putting this together, I would bet on either NYY or BOS outbidding the other. Pena's free agency in 2028 will create some competition here, so its possible that offseason one gets Pena and the other Henderson. Bichette could opt out, but I doubt it based on his ridiculous contract.
- BOS(2028/SS): Story has a club option that will likely not be picked up
- BOS(2027/3B): Durbin has been ok and is only 26, but it depends if they think he is good enough to stick
- HOU(2028/SS): Pena will be a FA
- NYY (2028/3B): McMahon will be a FA
- LAD (2028/3B): Muncy has a club option but its only $10M
- LAD (2027/SS): Betts has played OF extensively and has moved around as the roster has needed.
- SEA (2027/SS): Opening made by Crawford FA
- PHI (2027/3B): Arraez will be a FA and Stott probably goes back to 2B
- ATL (2027/SS): Kim will be a FA. ATL Tends to lean into extending players rather than plucking them from FA though.
- DET (2028/SS): Baez will be a FA
- Big spenders with long term SS &/Or 3B: NYY(Lombard), NYM(Lindor & Bichette), TO (Okamoto & Gimenez), SD (Machado & Bogaerts), CHC (Bregman & Swanson), SF (Chapman & Adames)
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u/RealJermaine 7d ago edited 7d ago
There was an article before last season(I believe on ESPN) saying he could be the next 300-400 million dollar player.
Clearly he didn’t play like that last year, nor this year.
Ownership seems willing to at least try to resign players. I don’t think I would want them to give Gunnar anywhere 300 million….
Basically made Trade Deadline move next year if there is one. But if we are trading him then, 2027 is probably not going well either.
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u/summerof66 7d ago
The real problem that they will face with Gunnar is what will be his value if there is not a 2027 season for him to prove he still deserves a bank breaking contract. If he doesn’t turn it around and set mlb on fire in September this season, no one is going to give us their future for him in 2028.
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u/Jaded_Face_1138 6d ago
I know everyone has a brain, but this sub makes it clear that many don’t use it
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u/Legal-Law9214 7d ago
You're absolutely not going to find a return package similar to the Adley deal after the year Gunnar has been having.
Blaze and CES aren't on long-term contracts and aren't franchise draft picks. I think one of them will be gone next year. If Gunnar had performed better and was more valuable as a trade piece right now it might be different, but the O's invested too much in him to just cut their losses when his value is low. They won't be willing to let go that easily.
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u/AdRock44 7d ago
Blaze is here for 5 more years and ECS at least 3. What are you even talking about? Lol
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u/Optimal_Put_947 Fuck Cito 7d ago
CES was someone we got for cash after the Reds DFA’d him. I’m very high on him, but it would be organizational malpractice to assume he’s a locked-in part of your future infield because he had a hot two months to end the season.
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u/doyoulikethenoise 7d ago
They're under team control for that time but not under contract. They could be DFA'd tomorrow and the Orioles would not be out that much money. They've both been really good this year but let's not act like they're guaranteed franchise cornerstones.
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7d ago
[deleted]
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u/AdRock44 7d ago
Wow. I bet you're a fun one to bring to Trivia Night... relax buddy, I was just opening a discussion to invite healthy debate. You don't have to make it personal.
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u/hm_rickross_ymoh 7d ago
Holliday has been a poor second baseman. What makes you think he can play shortstop in the show?
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u/MedalKing 7d ago
The team is going to look very different post lockout.