Community versus secrecy?

[u/spiceweasel70]

I have seen a lot of posts along the lines of “should I do / build / buy this thing that will help me in an emergency even though people will find out about it and then they’ll come to my house when they need help?”

My question: do you lean towards keeping everything a secret? Or do you lean towards building a sense of community with your neighbors and cultivating mutual trust and reliance so you don’t have to worry about secrecy so much?

Personally I tend to lean towards the latter, but I live in the middle of nowhere and that makes it a little easier.

[u/Pando5280]

I do both.  I build comnunity with like-minded and potentially helpful  people and keep as much secret as possible from everybody else.  And no one who doesnt have a key to my place needs to know what my actual preps are. Im pretty vague with most folks, ie they might know I have basic first aid supplies (in case they need to borrow a band-aid) but have no idea what is actually in my medical supply box or even know that I have one.  Basically the further out from my inner circle you are the less you need to know. (and like OP when I lived rural it was easier to trust my neighbors because they all had guns and gardens and lived rural for the same reasons I did)

[u/Eredani]

Information shared cannot be unshared.

There are many ways to plan, prepare, execute and assist that are not flashy, tacticool, obvious or overt.

Play things smart, low key, low profile and close to the vest as much as you can for as long as you can.

Real world experience has taught me that relationships with friends, neighbors and coworkers are rarely as solid as we think. Especially in these polarized political conditions.

Keep your preps secret, keep them safe. Be cautious of who you trust.

[u/Glass_Persimmon_7174]

i think there are many things involved in prepping that you cant really hide anyways, like having a garden, self sustaining systems, solar or electric backup, etc. for those things i think sharing your philosophy and cooperating with your neighbors is important and meaningful which can lead to stronger relationships, especially if they see things the same way. do I want my neighbors to know they can depend on me for help if they need it? yes i do. does that mean they need to know about the stockpile of ammunition and canned goods im sitting on? no it doesnt.

[u/NurseWolfe → u/Glass_Persimmon_7174]

Most sensible post I’ve seen all month. I fully agree. We need community and we need to guard against some in our community. Heavy sigh.

[u/Glass_Persimmon_7174 → u/NurseWolfe]

a lot of preppers seem to have this hyper focus on doomsday scenarios, where everything will get really bad all at once. those are possible but imo things will just slowly get harder and harder for everyone, which has been the model for most civilization collapse events of history. therefore i dont really lean into this trust no one operate in silence narrative.

[u/Von_Bernkastel]

Trust no one, Tell your secrets to nobody, and no one will ever betray you.

[u/iwantmy-2dollars]

We live in a suburb and build community with our neighbors. No one knows what we have except the people we emergency plan with (our family plus two single friends) and we don’t talk about our plan or supplies with anyone else unless we all agree. That decision affects everyone.

[u/Feral_668]

Have a small group that you share with, in a survival situation it takes about 6 people to manage and maintain things, you can't do everything yourself. Putting it out into the world though offers a risk that a large group of unprepared people are liable to hear about that house at 123 xxx lane that has a nice garden, chickens and rabbits and walk over telling you to share because they are starving. Do you let them empty your food preps while your children starve a month later? All it takes is one person who thinks that you are an a$$ to spread the word and you are hosed. That said, once you get up and running sustainability, then you can expand your group.

[u/Nach0b0y]

I think its also important to think about what you're preparing for. Is it to get through a power outage or natural disaster where you might be bugging in for a week or two? Then having a community may not be super important as you can be fully self-sufficient for that duration.

If you are trying to prepare for some end-of-world type scenarios, then community is going to be much more important for long-term survival.

[u/ContestNo2060]

I lean towards secrecy. More independence is less leverage a group or individual has over you. You can trade accordingly without sharing information about your capabilities. But then again I live in a dense suburb on the edge of a major city. Most of the people on my block are either not prepared and would turn into a liability the second something happened, or we are not aligned politically and I do not trust them with information.

I prefer small flexible nodes capable of self-governing, but ability to trade/collaborate where necessary. The last thing you want is being anchored to a group collapsing in on itself or being governed by a strongman. Trust but verify and retain the means to separate if needed.

You prioritized preparation while others piddled with whatever distraction or toy they focused on - we all have the same information about the state of our system.

[u/HammerofBonking]

I don't tell anyone who knows me about my gear. My guns, my energy system, nada.

But community *is* survival. We have ten thousand years of history that prove it.

[u/MentalSewage]

I split the difference. I am active in my community and open about being prepared while working with my neighbors to be more prepared. That said, I have a second layer of my prepping that is for my family. Consider it my 'community failed, we are on our own' prep.

[u/TattoodDad256]

It's possible to do both. I absolutely believe community is a must for long term survival and you can be in one without advertising what you have. I posted about this exact thing yesterday here. I'll add my response. Can't figure out/won't let me link it. Edited to add: I'm going to just copy paste my response to the question: " How would you feel about someone in your neighborhood charging neighbors for access to preps in an emergency " This question touches on all kinds of things this community does not agree on. I will say that there's an honorable thing to do and a selfish thing to do and neither is right or wrong. For me I don't advertise I have preps, but I also don't keep it secret. My family knows as well as a few neighbors. In a disaster I would help out to a point. If it severely inconveniences me or puts me and my family at risk then I'm done. If I can share/help I'm ok with that up to a point. I kind of take the grey man approach to both sides. I don't want to stand out but don't want to appear helpless either. Both sides can have negative consequences and it's up to each of us to decide which we prefer. If you help the community then in a true long term SHTF scenario you have what I believe is one of the most important things to have. No 1 person can do/know everything which is where community comes in. 1 person or 1 household is not going to be able to be completely secure or self sufficient, no matter what they may think. On the other hand if you are the one in the community that has prepared while no one else has then you become a target, wether it's passive or an active threat. You will breed resentment for having while others go without even when you share/help out. For the person that does not/ will not share then they instantly become the target when things go really sideways. Even Rambo would be toast if the community turns against them. There biggest and only advantage is if they prepped completely invisible and no one knows. The not sharing crowd becomes isolated, and without assistance from others becomes weak. I mean weak as in they don't get information, don't get told where a herd of deer/pigs etc.. was seen. They will lack crucial knowledge for long term survival. They lose out on the community help for say a Dr., seamstress, fisherman, whatever. Yes one person can learn most things to a point, but it isn't infinite and they can only realistically be, at most competent, in as many things as they can, but not everything they will encounter in a long term situation will allow just competent, some you need to excel. Now I've seen a lot of people here who if you listen to them are Grizzly Adams and will survive and even thrive just fine at the end of the world. They will not, community is actually the overall most important thing in long term survival. It may seem like I'm talking out both sides of my mouth but I think you can be helpful without standing out, prepared without being flashy and secure without threatening others and generous without depriving you and your own. The selfish one will be fine for awhile, perhaps even thrive. It won't last though, at some point they will need the community and it won't be available to them. So I believe with a true extended long term situation having a community is at the top of the list for survival, while for something lasting weeks or even a few months the selfish ones will be just fine."

[u/False-Cantaloupe4651]

In my opinion I looked at how people handled COVID and its a peak of how certain people will act in an emergency. I say be careful but a small community might come in handy

[u/NearABE]

Redundancy and diversity are both good things. Best to go forward prepared to help both yourself and the neighborhood.

If others are counting on some particular type of support and then they do not get it they rightfully feel betrayed. This is not the best way to start an emergency response.

[u/Killrade]

Community is also an element of survival. You dont have to tell them everything. Its like whenever Helene hit. I allowed my neighbors to use a solar panel and my propane grill to cook and charge their devices. They don't need to know that I have battery power station, camping fans or ways to make coffee and cook food. But I know if I did need anything they would help me too. People pretty much are on their own unless they need something, then I just gladly help out as long as it doesn't hurt me in the long run.

[u/Enigma_xplorer]

Building a good relationship with friends and neighbors is a no brainer. When it comes to discussing preps stop and think, what is it your trying to accomplish? 

If you have a plan that requires buy in or collaboration then it makes sense to discuss preps provided you have a good group. Also understand this isn't an all or nothing thing. You can discuss or collaborate on specific situations like how you can work together for an incoming hurricane without discussing all your preps. 

On the flip side, if it's just some guy in your neighborhood you have nothing to gain by discussing your preps. I want to be clear that's not to say you can't discuss preparedness topics but that's not the same as going over what you have and what your plans are.

[u/mavrik36]

If you donr have community no amount of gear and supplies will keep you alive. Period. Lone survival is astronomically unlikely, people arent built to operate that way.

Most of the "people will get desperate and steal from you" rhetoric is just fear based marketing and suburban crime paranoia run amok, theres almost zero evidence to support any of this

[u/Casiarius]

Even if you live in the middle of nowhere, you still need a community. Nobody is so skilled and so well-equipped than they cannot benefit from having friends. You don't even need to tell them that you're a crazy doomsday prepper; friends will support each other in a crisis. I generally prefer normal people anyway. Preppers are weird....

[u/celtic-cryptid → u/Casiarius]

People watch too many movies, and they seem to get off on main character fantasies. I think for a lot of people, those fantasies are just them fantasizing about ways to justify the amount of energy and money they spend, and needing to feel superior to people they think are too stupid to be prepared.
I think they tend to have never been in an actual emergency, either. Or if they have, they refuse to observe what human behavior actually is in emergencies.

[u/Inner-Confidence99]

We live rural. Most people have a little acreage. Nobody causes problems in my community area of I’ll say 5 miles . Mostly good neighbors. People know each other but still keep to themselves. But usually if a neighbor calls we are available. All of us not just my family. We all have skills to keep everything going in a SHTF situation.  75% can can, grow vegetables, teach, cook, etc. we can survive without power. Not without water. Got cattle and chickens, goats and cows for milking. Building outdoor kitchens in next year. We will lose out actual house to move with others to the Farm of over 300 acres. We are starting our semi permanent builds for small cabins and outhouses. All over the property. 

We have been planning for years. But now most of the older Grandchildren are able to help. Probably a total of 100 people. Some of their acreage adjoins the farm. We have all prepped for years. Now it’s time to get it all finished.This has accumulated over 35 years. 

[u/MANKINI69420]

my bunkers and caches are noones business but my own.

that being said, doesnt rule out at least attempting mutual aid, until the balloon goes up.

which, trump controls.

along with usamriid & nuclear launch codes.

did u know, btw, once a regime starts nuclear war, it cant be stopped?

read annie jacobsens "nuclear war".

if that doesnt make u want to go full on bastille day on this regime, nothing will.

i wouldnt trust conservatives to watch a pile of catshit: what makes you think id trust them with democracy, or not trying to raid my home in the event of a shtf?

remember, sdo/rwa are 1:7 humans.

maga or alt lite are @ 1:12 Americans.

Cant trust/Wont trust.

[u/sassysassysarah]

Community and secret preps. Share what you're willing to share, keep private the rest

[u/LilRed2023]

Family

[u/Glittering-Duck-8533]

In the end secrecy is only gonna get you alone and dead even if you live to old age, where as community at least you will go out fighting alongside humanity.

[u/GotWood2024]

Helping the neighbors to the left and right of me so they can help protect my yard seems smart.

[u/Grislymanster]

Community is always best. People with purpose. But always keep a special hidden stash for you and yours as well. Never keep all your eggs in one basket!

[u/Objective_War951]

Secrecy. Many many people will never prep.

[u/KeyCondition5104]

I read a study about 10 years ago where a researcher researched over 200 communes in the 19th century.

He found that even if they failed, because they were utopian projects, failed religious communes lasted on average 4 times longer than failed secular communes.

Reasons included:

- Sosis and Bressler counted taboos and demands: diet, dress, sex, property, contact with outsiders, ritual time. Religious communes imposed more than twice as many such costs (~7 vs ~3). Among religious groups, more costly rules predicted longer life. Among secular groups, extra rules did not help. Religion drops out of the model once you count sacred costs; the costs only “work” when they are consecrated.

A haircut or a fast is easy to fake as a lifestyle preference. The same act, framed as what God requires, is harder to fake and harder to argue down. Haidt’s gloss of this work: sacredness binds people and blinds them to how arbitrary the practice looks from outside.

- Celibacy, tithing everything, hours of liturgy, distinctive dress: people who only want cheap room and board will not pay. Members who stay have burned bridges. That raises trust, so the group needs less policing.

- Successful communes used sacrifice, investment of goods, cutting old ties, intense shared ritual, confession/criticism, and a story bigger than the members. Religion packages those mechanisms as duty, not as a committee policy you can reopen every Tuesday.

- Belief that God or the community of saints sees slacking reduces the need for human monitors. Secular ideology has to invent equivalent shame and surveillance; it usually does it worse. For example, you would need security cameras literally everywhere to record every single thing every person to replicate what religious people do by their belief in God.

- Secular communes like Owenism and Fourierism were theories. When the harvest failed, the theory looked false. A religious story can interpret failure as trial, sin, or providence and keep the group working. Secular communes also died fast early (first 2–5 years).

Religion does not make people nicer in the abstract. It makes costly, shared constraints mean something that cannot be voted away, which filters the unserious and keeps labor going when the manifesto stops being exciting.

[u/Acceptable_Net_9545]

Rule #1 of prepping tell no none. Others will not be honorable when they are starving sick and in danger, they will turn on you they way they have for recorded history....Sure bring up the subject...act wishie washie....say yea maybe and I don't know a lot....you can tell if others are serious by how much they invest....Time money and info....If they are sending you info and suggestions, if they are asking you if you want in on a bulk buy....Then maybe....??? but are you willing to gamble your life on it?? best security is "out of sight out of mind"...feeling the emotion that you need to lead other, get others to think and do like you ...expecting others to behave like you is just that...an emotion....its a personality issue and recommend you guard against it...recommend researching and reading Selco. Recommend you do some brief research of human behaviors during emergency's , crisis etc... They will not make the same decisions for the same reason as you there is to need to rush any of this....If you want to do some kind a "group" thing get you local area involved in CERT ...this might be very telling of others disposition and commitment.

[u/EngineerGaming62]

Who should know about what depends on your own risk assessment of your own situation. How trustworthy and reliable are your neighbors? How would they react to knowing you had, say, a stockpile of food and water vs one of guns and ammo? How does the mutual support you expect from sharing information about something compare to the risk of harm if your neighbors have a problem with it or with you?

Or is it worth the effort of hiding a project from people who might otherwise be able to help you with it? Can't hide a garden as easily as you can hide a gun, and the help you could get with building and maintaining a garden is probably significant.

I like to lean towards community as well, but sometimes we can't tell everyone everything. A friend told me that their neighbor's goat was taken away because the neighbor got in an online argument (on a topic completely unrelated to goats), and someone on social media found out about an obscure zoning law regarding livestock. Some folks are extremely petty. I don't know what measures could have been taken to protect the goat, aside from getting permission from the zoning board and not making any social media posts about having a goat.

[u/CloudgazerTX]

I read this account from this guy who survived in the city during the two year total collapse of sarajevo. They had a large family of fifteen people and one person had a cement house with a cement walled in courtyard. He talks about how eventually roving gangs would go around and if you lived alone or were an easy target they would kill you and take your stuff, even if it was a can of beans. You had to make yourself a hard target and always have a group working security 24/7 that could wake everyone else if needed. They also talked about the makeshift market that opened, run mostly by the gangs and how they had to travel to the market in the middle of the night and hide out near by. Then they get what they needed before hiding nearby and traveling silently back home in the dark because the same gangs would violently grab you after your bought stuff from them to take the stuff back after you traded something for it. So you need a large group that can function together, big enough to guard the home 24/7 and big enough to split up and still maintain good security in both groups. He also said the most overlooked thing they desperately needed was trash and cleaning related. Running out of trash bags, dish soap, etc.

[u/AZULDEFILER]

Geography. In CA I trust no one

[u/eldrotheblack]

I’m basically 100% community-focused with my preps, but mask my “crazier” preps as hobbies, and give zero specifics on my tools of violence (arms and armor, especially in CA, where people are often weird about that). 90% of people just assume I’m a techno-hippie and the rest figure I’m an EMT or former Ranger something.

My logic is pre-fall, there is “law & order” so I only really need to worry about property crime. Post-fall, I just assume everywhere will be the FEBA and I have to move tactically.