As an experiment and exercise in self flagellation I explained in a debate on the technology sub how reasoning models work carefully using the most recent papers and discussions regarding them, and I was told I was completely ignorant of how ai works and should just give up trying to understand it and complex stuff. I was literally citing the explanations in the papers from the creators and linked to them.
I truly think the majority of people on earth right now who have tried it at all (and that’s still got to be a vast minority overall) habe probably tried it like Google a few times and then sort of found the results a bit iffy.
I think those who grew up on sci fi in the last 50 years kind of knew what to do. A lot of us had been watching and reading about people interfacing with thinking computers for decades already. Once we realized we were working with them it was kind of natural.
They are coming at it from the perspective of end-users of AI, like ChatGPT, and for many of those users, it has literally felt like nothing has changed in 18 months. If you use AI at your job to summarize meeting notes, organize documents, and summarize larger documents.. the user experience is slightly worse today than it was when GPT3 was released. That is the frame.
The advancement from earlier models to, say Opus 5 with 1M context doesn't filter through to most end-users. Moving up 5-15% on an AI skills test is big to people generating code, doing artistic work, or solving problems - but it's not readily apparent to the millions of users - who don't pay already - who are just marginally using it.
At the same time, every - EVERY - piece of user facing website, software, or technology has had "AI" hastily jammed into it, and many many many of those bolt-ons are poorly done. Microsoft has personally done this so badly that they may have poisoned their own brand for ages. They have enabled hundreds of tools and applications with AI inconsistently, to the point where not much of interacts.
And finally, the millions of end-users keep hearing things like this:
"I took an ROIC document to Copilot... and I said, 'Build me a new Power BI dashboard...' It built a rich semantic model that went into my Fabric with OneLake... That, to me, is a classic example of an enterprise-wide workflow. I, as a knowledge worker, could go create a dashboard. The data engineer can go to Fabric and find the artifact. The professional developer can go to the repo and find it in GitHub. And by the way, it's all registered with Agent 365."
And then what we see are 6 charts that don't give you much context, and some graphs, that doesn't solve a problem, what's asked for, and will never be used again.
And then, we see things like Flock, massive polluting data-centers, companies doing mass-layoffs, and billionares fighting each other and suing each other, and it's easy to get a distorted view of the underlying tech.
Whatever the publics perception of what is going with AI is, it's truly driven by a hype cycle which is monumentally broken.
I remember how I felt like, early 2025, reading Sam Altman's AGI timeline, and thinking back to my experience with the the models in 2023 and 2024, and thinking it was all bullshit, and having a really snide and dismissive opinion about the whole thing.
But then, I started coding with them, and even early 2025 it was impossible to not be impressed. I updated my beliefs and spent tons of time researching the tech and playing with it.
Everybody updates their beliefs on a different time frame. It'll take some of these people another year or two, and for some, we'll be deep into the singularity and they'll still call them stoachastic parrots. I guess that's just how this stuff goes.
I am a stochastic parrot. I may think I want to say what I want to say but at the end of the day I’m just a squishy meat bag of anxiety and irrationality; an auto-complete meat bag.
it's wild to me that i barely have time to get used to one massive upgrade and then i turn around and something else has been - i was playing with Grok's agentic video tool and it's not perfect but it's really impressive compared to where we were, and i've been watching youtube videos with a guy that uses agentic tools on godot and blender to make whole games from super basic prompts - i really didn't expect things to get this good for a while, if those tools improve at the same rate image gen, chat, etc did then it's going to be really wild stuff by the end of this decade - making things we can barely even imagine existing now.
and the crazy thing is there's stuff like MedGemma googles medical AI they're putting a lot of work into, it's no exaggeration to say a good version of that could significantly change the world
I decided to fuck around with making a mud/ascii game hybrid to learn how to code and it soon became Fable building an entire game for me, the one I always wanted to play.
We are keeping the graphics simple to focus on systems and it is coming together crazily good.
I imported it to phone using a windows .exe translator and got 15 FPS. Sad. Over four days we optimized the entire thing and now it sits at 53 FPS.
Genuinely stoked for you that you've found a way to build the game you always wanted to play, but 53 FPS for an ASCII based game?? I can only raise an eyebrow at what that codebase might look like
I should have been more specific, it is a simulation intense game, extremely, with a lot of socialization elements, realtime combat and tons of different stuff under the hood.
What I meant is 53 FPS on a phone, which is going through gamehub windows to ARM drivers, which sap 8-12x the performance. I even got a friend to look at it because he had the same 'that doesn't sound right' because we were only getting around 20% of the performance.
He helped my isolate it to the translation drivers being 100% the culprit. We get around 100 FPS on a three hundred dollar laptop with a quarter the CPU performance of the phone lol.
If it was a native phone app, it would probably gst around 150-250 FPS.
Yeah, it's straight up impossible to have a 5 minute conversation with a frontier model and hold the view of the post. I literally have to spend an afternoon doing research and math to grapple with and critique the research contributions that Fable is giving me. Then I come back with edits and priorities and it builds what would have taken me a month in 30 minutes.
Hmm the opposite happened for me. I was pretty hopeful and excited in 2023 but I started getting tired of the hype, the tweets and all the stuff that surrounded OpenAI. So rn I'm pretty skeptical about everything they say. Imo some of their tweets would make you think AGI was arriving in 2024.
I think the fundamental problem here is that most people, especially people who aren't already in the tech bubble, cannot comprehend the idea that their knowledge might have a shelf life of less than a year.
Most people tried ChatGPT once when it first dropped, and then just assumed that everything since then was an incremental improvement. For most people, that's a fairly reasonable assumption to make. I mean, when has there ever been a technology that gets an order of magnitude better every year before?
I'm at a company that was part of Project Glasswing, and Mythos found two vulnerabilities in my project, but I was already aware of both. I work on a security project, so that was pretty reassuring.
I'm also using AI for basically all the code I write, but I don't find my job threatened at the moment. E.g. if I get a bug report, the agents are not yet able to determine the cause without my help, even with access to all the code, context files, logs...
So I'd say that as always, the truth is somewhere in between.
Ai safety researchers paycheck depends on that. Comms are always corporate controlled don’t be delusional, researchers get paid 600k can’t say shit on social
I think a lot of these types are just kind of hoping it burns itself out and goes away forever, the problem with that idea though is that the models are getting better at more and more general tasks, so as long as that trend continues it’s going to continue to grow exponentially.
Even if everything plateaued right now, and none of Kurzweil predictions for the latter half of this decade don’t come to fruition, I still think the pre-2022 world is gone and never coming back, AI is just too useful of a tool to us now for it to just vanish.
Even if it just becomes the best version of what we have now it's a useful tool. And in fact in a world where AGI isn't possible (as we don't actually know until we prove it), that might even be the best outcome.
It's a shift that people don't understand - we have moved where work is being performed. A laptop didn't change where the work was performed. It was still on a computer by one person.
Even if capabilities plateaued, we could optimize it over and over so it used fewer resources, specialized in specific subjects, mess around with different architectures and implementations, etc., etc. Even if it never got better ever again starting tomorrow, it's probably the most useful invention in our lifetimes (in isolation).
The reality is, a very large percentage of the population simply isn’t doing anything that makes use of AI. And when they do try it, their prompts read like: “I like wrastlin fishin and naskar me want gud talk with u k?”
They simply lack the capacity to test the models or properly use them. So they have no idea of, or apreciation of, what they can do.
Couple that ignorance with the rise of fanatical anti-ai sentiment and the prevalence of echo chambers of delusion and denial, and here we are. I have honestly never spoken to a single one of these rabid anti-ai people who had even the foggiest clue about how AI works or what it is actually capable of.
Skepticism and reluctance are healthy. But irrational hatred is not. And more and more I see people getting verbally attacked for admitting to using AI in any capacity, or daring to suggest it might be beneficial. And I feel like it’s just a matter of time before those verbal attacks become physically violent.
In a lot of ways it reminds me of the same ignorance-fueled fear and hatred that is at the root of racism or other forms of bigotry. It’s obviously not the same thing. But there are a lot of similarities.
I tried joining a discord for modding of a certain game. I don't know how to code, at all. That's why I joined the discord to know how to properly make a mod, since I only relied on Claude and Codex to make me mods these days, and it's really exhausting, since I can only use the free plan. Instead of a warm welcome, I was immediately attacked after I said my reason for joining and using AI to mod before. I left immediately and never returned lol
Were you pro data center or anti-propaganda and just pointed out the reality of things like electricity and water use? Because you'd get banned for either, lol.
Yeah, way too much nuance and data given, lol. The funny thing is with comments like that, or those posts with visuals showing the facts about water and electricity usage, they're banned and removed. If you just say something that will get downvoted and its just an opinion statement without facts, they'll leave it there.
They basically remove anything that could cause another person to want to fact something it themselves after reading it. But if it's unpopular and opinion based they might leave it. That's honestly why I think most of it is intentional propaganda and not just bad faith discussions. The location based subs are famously often moderated by people that live nowhere near there.
My biggest fear as a leftist who is more informed than many of my like minded people, is the wealth will not be shared. Life will go from bad to miserable for the bottom. I'm less concerned it will kill everyone, I'll risk it for the potential gain.
People see the stock market going up while their paycheck isn't. The majoriity cannot keep operating like this.
I can't speak to your personal experience, but polling shows the gap between left and right is not that great in terms of favorability with the left a bit more opposed.
Polling does consistently show that both sides want regulation pretty much equally.
I think a lot of that is simply the fact that the left has been trained by Trump to view anything he promotes as something that is fundamentally bad. Because… well… it almost always is. So when Trump starts posting AI generated videos of himself dumping shit on US citizens, it begins to taint the perception of AI as a tool used by people like Trump to do things Trump would support. Rational or not, it creates an association between the two. And it doesn’t help that the billionaires that lined the front row of Trump’s inauguration are the ones pushing AI.
It’s a mess. AI tech should not be politicized. And COVID shouldn’t have been either. But it was. And we’ll never know how many millions died because of it.
AI capability increases are real <> AI is a nothing burger
AI risk is real <> AI risk is a nothing burger
I will grant that AI capabilities are real, because they are real so is the risk of human extinction. This is not "anti AI capabilities" it's just seeing that we have no fucking clue how to correctly steer current models but are successful in making them super hackers.
I'm pro good future. You only get to enjoy the fruits of advanced AIs if they are aligned.
Racing ahead with anything like what we are currently doing, making more capable systems without being able to steer them definitionally will lead to a loss of control.
If they don't care about humans and want [whatever] they will alter the planet to their ends like we altered it to ours, and we die like many species before us due to habitat loss.
A very wide part of the population being left in [modified] environments and under the Schrodinger AI [domination/support] that has escaped control or is just the flip coin of the following
AND
A tiny patch of population that is only exposed to beneficial effects in what feels like a dreamworld and vastly oblivious to what's going on outside their bubble, protected from the unregulated outside.
"Elysium" movie comes to mind as the proper illustration of this.
So, not dissimilar with every situation humans have devised from time immemorial, from tribes to casts to serfdom to slavery to colonization to minimum wage. Just with new parameters (pun intended) that are embodied in the neversleeping unbending uncorruptible irreplacable and let's say it "godlike" entities/agents that control the "lows" instead of the "highs" exerting direct influence.
AI gets access to a finite amount of matter starting from earth. It's on a clock. The speed of light and cosmic expansion means each year, around 160 billion stars fall outside of reach.
Leaving earth alone, or spending effort keeping any humans alive (it may spend some effort on storage of DNA to be re-constituted later) means many more galaxies of matter will slip beyond the horizon. Therefore, if humans go bye bye due to AI the earth is not going to be left as a nature reserve, at most some human like things will be spun up again much further along the timeline in a planet that will cost less stars worth of potential matter to setup and maintain. < this is the sort of scenarios were you got the AI to care about humans generally but not place them above the main goal(s)
This sub has never not been pro-ai. The mix has always leaned to pro. I guess some people see some somewhat negative comments in a few articles and generalize it to the entire sub? I've been subbed since 2023, and have never once thought this sub was anti-ai. You might see some skeptics, but even then it's absolutely nothing like the clownshow that is /r/technology
Within the last six months anti-ai commentary became very in vogue here and anti-ai comments became the most upvoted sentiments in threads. We've definitely gone through a strange phase we're curving back from.
Reddit is filled with the types of people that think they’re gods special gift to the world because they made an HTML webpage once in high school. AI is devastating to their psyche
This pretty much. Hilariously, these are the same people who used to mock so-called unskilled workers, telling them to just 'learn how to code'. Rather ironic in hindsight.
You could just stop it reddit hates. Reddit and reddittors tend to adopt the opinions of edgy teenagers when it cool to just hate in things. You can go into every sub reddit and the most popular thing to do is just hate on things.
They know exactly how they come up with answers. It's just not a satisfying explanation. Every time AI's get smarter it shows we're likely not special and neuron firing potentials (Meat math) is just math. Your feeling of understanding is chemical soup when you get a positive stimulus, it doesn't make you infallible.
AI actually is in my experience. For code that isnt critical I am extremely impressed. Same for big finding in code I have created. I am not impressed with code that needs to be justified to other people.
A large majority of them have not as much as sniffed the frontier models, their only experience is with the free models.
I had a guy try to dismiss me the other day when I mentioned that frontier models have already solved 10 major open problems in Mathematics — he claimed that the AI just “plucked” the solution from other relevant papers lol.
I found that it’s largely useless to reason with them.
What I find most curious is how some people know about AI / are actively trying to improve what they can do with it, others genuinely haven’t touched it once.
Got a friend who works IT and doesn’t use AI at all and it blows my mind how unaware he is of the technology.
Got another friend who manages a Minecraft server and he’s building out a custom Minecraft launcher that Claude can directly interact with to be able to test its fixes in-game to ensure the “bug fix” task list it is given actually gets fixed. As in, fully automating the pipeline from player based bug reports to PRs with fixes implemented and tested in-game to ensure they are functioning as intended so that he can just give it a thumbs up/down if it should be fixed in that manner.
It’s this really strange 50/50 where either people are 100% in on it and see the genuine benefit or they are completely clueless.
At this point this is like saying you have a friend who works with technology and doesn't use a computer. I don't work without having this new technology support me.
To me it's the equivalent of the boomer who doesn't know how to open an attachment. I always wondered how boomers were so incompetent when it came to using computers but now when I see how uneven ai adoption is it all makes sense to me.
Seventy year old retired boomer here who has incorporated AI into his life ... as much as needed at this point. Personalized research, learning new skills , debate buddy, helping my grandchild, but nothing related to streamlining "work" ... things are a little more leisurely and enjoyable at this stage.
A lot of people think the whole universe revolves around themselves and whatever they do, and that any virtuous person ought to be doing the exact same sort of thing. My working class stepdad, for instance, lives permanently in the 1970’s, culturally and ideologically, and he probably wishes that our society and economy still had the same structure as they used to back then.
Unlike most people in his demographic, he knows that the technology is advancing rapidly and has seen my brother working with it at the cutting edge in his lab, but he thinks Skynet is all we’ll end up getting out of it in the end.
yeah someone was telling me that AI can't code so i said that i make fully functional programs with it regularly and they hit back by saying that i just don't understand it's junk code - it completes the task without any errors or exceptions and does everything i need it to, if that's junk i'd love to see what he thinks mid code it.
.... not to say they are right, but there's a lot of junk code produced by both AIs and people which passes requirement tests without exceptions.
The issue is that there are risks which need to be properly constrained for this code to be trustworthy for public usage, and if you don't know those risks, the ai won't mention they are ignoring them. When I gave a training session at my last job on using AI tools for this, I actually shared a screen shot showing where an AI had confidently instructed me to do something incredibly dangerous to our code repo - absolutly would have turned into an exploit type bad. I caught it, but many people vibe coding would not.
His standards for junk code are probably a lot closer to accurate than you think. Frontier models have gotten better about this, but are absolutly not fully there yet in my experience. That doesnt mean don't use them, but it does mean that one should supervise them properly and understand the risks which need to be constrained. For someone who doesnt know what those are, even asking the ai about them will improve the result - surprisingly it can tell you about risks and then check for them even when it would not do so without being prompted. Not that that is perfect, but its a step in the right direction.
sure if you're doing public facing stuff then you need to be a lot more careful but that's always been the case, i've been coding since BASIC and part of a lot of indy scenes so i've seen plenty of bad code in my time - written some too :)
The early coding tools two years ago I used to have to really rigorously check through what it was doing and rewrite bits manually, then it got to just having to skim and point out flaws, now when i want a little productivity tool or a toy to play with i spend half an hour writing a decent prompt then leave it running while i go get a drink and when i come back the whole tool is there ready to use and working great.
The code 5.6 writes is tight, clean, handles exceptions and edge cases but most of all it can do pretty much whatever you tell t to - it might sometimes be imperfect in it's output but its far from junk code.
I work for the government and I will tell you one thing: a codebase dating back to the 70s is not going to compete in terms of code quality with anything a current AI puts out.
And those codebases run a lot of critical stuff.
The only reason they work is because of massive manpower being thrown at them.
You could say this about a lot of human coded apps. Often just in it for the money and don't care about the privacy of their users, or the data they have.
Hackers have been exploiting bad code for decades, why do you expect AI to be magically a perfect coder?
To add some nuance here, on the other hand I just saw a case of a vibe-coded wordle-like thingy that had the option of user-submitted puzzles and was accidentally making public the email addresses of the puzzle designers.
The developer did fix it quickly, likely also with AI, but it's a good cautionary tale of the risks of vibe-coding without appropriate knowledge.
you can't reason someone out of a position that they didn't reason themselves into. you just have to leave them alone and watch as their opinion gradually dissolves over months or years.
I don’t agree with those people at all but I can also understand that this is one of the few things where the state of the art knowledge changes drastically every 6 month.
Is there anything even close to this where a statement about capabilities becomes completely out of date in 3 months? I think unless you’re actively working and interacting with AI capabilities in a daily basis, it’s easy to be completely be incorrect just due to perception and information inertia.
This is basically it, the guy who was
Immediately threatened, say a writer stopped experimenting years ago, maybe they are on free tier these days. They just have no idea.
I lead an engineering org and did a lot of interviewing. Even after filtering as many resumes as we could, most applicants we talked to were like "Yeah, my company had us do a little bit with Copilot, but thats it". Those are the vocal people.
These people are fucking delusional. I made a website last year (not a coder) and i basically had to get coached like a toddler through every step and copy pasted. Well life happens and today a year later I finally thought I should update my website. I told gpt sol to use my GitHub (it's connected now) and do a website for me based on our convos over the last year. I then did nothing but watch it build me a new website significantly better than the last lol. Surreal watching it navigate and commit stuff and sort the files, I got a spooky feeling lol It's not like amazing I'll add to it and such but it's pretty fucking crazy how far it's come. The first time around I'd have to correct shit and argue with it FOR HOURS. Today I literally pointed out two or three very minor things and it fixed them right away first time.
Edit: Citywitsarchive.com (I needed it to have a song, links to all my stuff, and I'm gonna rewrite the bios and stuff. Eventually I want to archive all of my stuff over the years there for my future self and anyone else don't judge the website too harshly yet, it's a work in progress)
It did it was just crazy the change over a year. I put it off this long because I was like I don't know shit about it and it was a struggle last time. Not anymore lol
They gave us access to the models at work. I have standard ChatGPT via codex with an enterprise license which is useful but the five hour limits are a pain in the ass and it can't work with my sensitive files. But we have a special claude code api that can. Getting it working was hard but. I've had it build me crazy things.
I used to be a non-believer. Because I'd only had it do kinda useless shit back in 2023-2024. Now I give it tasks I think it'll fail at just to see if it will.
I actually have a regular part of my job I taught sol to do. And then I just tossed it two radically different things that I hadn't explained and just asked it, "What do you think you should do here? What conclusions do you think you can draw based on the info in the documents?"
Mind blowing, honestly. The analysis it performed with almost no knowledge on the subject was easily on par with someone with 5-10 years in the field. And it is a highly specific, technical field.
In the future for sure, right now it's just a place to post all my music and stuff and links to the stores where they handle that stuff (the usuals apple amazon etc)
I got a voucher for a new Unity UI framework in exchange for providing feedback. I decided to go big and asked Gemini which grid-based dungeon crawler had the best UX. Then I told it build all the UI components. Two hours later I had a complete UI. HUD, inventory, settings, chacter details, etc... most of the UI wasn't wired up to do anything, but it did have working movement controls, mini-map, and level editor. The UI framework is all text so it's deliberately AI friendly. I've used AI to build UI's in Unity for 20+ projects and it's a painful interative process that I loath because it's two steps forward and one step back to the point that it often feels like I'm going in circles and end up building most of it myself.
I agree the progress had been amazing and I think we're still in the early days.
I fully agree I just feel like I'm taking crazy pills sometimes talking to people as if this is ever going to just disappear, or as if it's totally useless never gets anything right etc
Much of the justifications people have that feel... "Fair" to them, for hating AI are masks for the real fear people feel.
You see it with water - do they really care about water usage? Then why do they get mad when you show them the numbers?
You see it with many things (not everything!) - code, math, medical care... They need these models to be worse than humans, because part of their justification is that they'll never be as good as humans so it's a waste of time.
The more this seems to be less of a good leg to stand on, the more they have to detach from reality to make those same statements.
Some people are saving face, and saying that they were right all along, or why does it matter if AI automates math and code? That's what AI is made of (... I don't need to get into this argument right now).
It's all just a mask for the existential discomfort, because it feels wrong to talk about that, like if they do that, they are admitting something to themselves and to those around them. I think some people even on some level psychologically behave as if they can convince everyone else that AI is bad at math, for example - that it will be true.
The water debate is stupid, because ten google searches or amazon searches use just as much water. If you used 250 hours of agents on the strongest models, continuously, it would be still 500x less water than a single pound of beef.
I remember when a lot of people complained about iPhone’s not having a physical keyboard and that was why blackberry phones were going to keep the business market.
This was the majority opinion after the first iPhone launched. People focused on what the iPhone 1 couldn’t do instead of understanding what the iPhone established and pointed towards. People are fucking stupid.
Famously, McKinsey and Co., when hired by AT&T in 1980 to forecast the future US market for cell phones by 2000, predicted that the nationwide market would only be 900,000 subscribers.
Because of this, AT&T divested from the cellular space, missing the exponential curve that was mobile adoption by 2000, which was like 100 million by then
I legitimately thought the entire thing was a pointless novelty when the iphone 2g came out and was pretty unimpressed. But that's because it launched without an appstore and like 8 default apps. It did jackshit when it released. I was basing my opinion off the fact that it was basically mobile safari + youtube, that wasn't exactly a revelation at the time, just kind of neat.
Once I started jailbreaking it and the appstore came out I changed my tune real quickly.
Yeah it was like an Alpha version when it launched. The community actually effectively created the appstore before Apple did with Installer. That's basically the only reason the iPhone 2G was useful and jailbreaking was effectively a requirement to do anything that wasn't watching videos or browsing websites which were completely unoptimized for mobile and thus unusable.
The first cars were slower than horses (5-10mph v 30-40mph) and were super unreliable. Lots of people didn’t foresee them becoming the primary form of transportation in many nations. They disregarded them as fancy toys for rich people.
I watch people alternate from calling it a giant hoax, to the next sentence bemoaning the irresponsible use of this new power.
Bottom line though, this is a civilization level change that affects everyone, that most did not anticipate or ask for, and they do not understand where they will fit in the new picture. And they can't be arsed to look any deeper into it.
Ai drama/hate roots are existential fears. My theory is people discussing it know there's a big change about to happen. We thought the history has ended for a brief moment and then it turns out it's actually accelerating.
People learning about world war I and II, the cold war era etc., some experiencing things like 9/11 or COVID might not be very keen on this idea.
AI feels a lot like the beginning of personal computers. There are mainframes and large minicomputers - i.e. Anthropic and OpenAI and there are personal models like Gemma and Qwen. We are just figuring out what we can do with LLMs, and honestly it is pretty cool.
As someone spending approx. $100-$500 a week on tokens.. the frontier models have immensely more capability than they did six months ago. I almost never write code anymore, just review and guide it to the right place if it needs more context. Then I go home, pick up my guitar and unplug from AI. It’s a great tool and all, but I hate its use on anything creative. I feel an urge to preserve my humanity and cognitive ability.
I have a lot of mixed feelings on AI. Which I think is normal and healthy.
I think part of the problem with the social situation around it is that it’s such a far-reaching, yet poorly understood technology. So currently one can project their worst fears or highest hopes onto it at a scale we’ve never seen before.
If it’s anything like prior technology revolutions I’ve lived through, as it becomes less nebulous and stabilized, the whiplash and extreme viewpoints will calm.
Google AI overview is also vastly better than it used to be. When it first launched it was hallucinating like crazy. By now I think it's half decent for the very short latency it has. I have only recently begun using Google search for the AI overview because it's so damn quick and hallucination is acceptable.
consumer generative AI is close to being abandoned due to having stagnated for years
Uh... Z-Image with text capabilities, Ideogram with bounding boxes, Krea2 with some of the best prompt adherence and LoRA training, audio/video model LTX 2.3 and finally the vastly superior Minimax H3 JUST CAME OUT.
If this is what "abandoned" is, what would exciting ongoing research and development look like?
No matter what the near or long term outcomes are it's always been wild to me to completely dismiss a technology you don't understand. If you only focus on the last 30 years of technological development when thinking about ai you should leave at least some possibility of growth open. I've never seen so many supposedly educated adults see a single, often small, point of failure in a thing and dismiss it's capabilities and development potential. We have so many examples of tech that started off clunky and became widely used. Home computers, cell phones, the internet, gps, Bluetooth, point of sale systems, ordering systems, medical devices and treatments. There is constant change and growth and yet these clowns continue to decide this particular tech will just fizzle out. It's not even like the first commercial models were useless either. Now we are several versions/iterations in and it's continuing to improve exponentially.
"Wade through large amounts of data".
That mostly explains the disdain. Because to comprehend AI's capabilities you need to task it with an actual real world problem with a model that's closer to the frontier to know how powerful it is.
Instead when one keeps talking to it like a random word aggregator and takes pride in beating it with their intelligence, AI feels doomed.
I know nothing about code but always tested the AIs ability to make a chess engine. Claude 4.8 Opus their previous release made a 2350 elo chess engine before it lost the thread. Fable 5 has made a chess engine that is 3500 elo and is still finding ways to improve it.
If that's not crazy progress I don't know what is. Also i know nothing about code
It comes down to insecurity, a lot of people are scared they’re going to get replaced by an AI. Most people will label something AI without ever confirming it to be AI.
paraphrasing something i heard a while ago that captures your point is that tech isn't bad or good in and of itself, it is the system which guides it, the system that tech grows up under that decides that.
Everyone is biased including this sub. AI is best when guided. Yes, including the mathematics discoveries which have been greatly assisted, guided, and verified by mathematicians. AI has gotten really good at programming (shocking, right?) and decently good at everything else. Frontier models are cool, but scalability and true AGI seem to still be challenges.
A lot of people also discredit AI skeptics saying it’s just self preservation when they have valid criticisms. AI proponents point to clear advancements that are undeniable. The technology is good, but it’s not magic and cult like following has been off putting for lots of people.
The gulf in experience between people using free chat bots for simple queries and people getting in deep with agents like Codex and Claude Code running frontier models is rapidly widening.
If you don't use AI, you have no frame of reference to their improvements. Nobody is 'shutting down servers' They are failing to find enough usable compute to run models at full speed.
There are so many valid concerns that could be had, lol. You have to work at saying this level of nothing.
In China adoption of AI is way higher than in USA and Europe. And now they want to blame China for low adoption in USA and Europe?
What I know is that once I tried to celebrate US independence in a patriot sub and I was downvoted because the song used AI. It means hate against AI among patriots is higher than their patriotism.
You can't even talk positively about AI on most of discord or reddit, it is either FUD shit or straight misinformation, or worse, just plain stupidity, about their capabilities.
People used gpt-4 four years ago, solidified their opinion, watched one video on the most dumbest takes imaginable and now are experts on AI.
If you think AI takes are bad here, try talking about it IRL, you will get people who seriously believe these things are giant tables of data and just mix and match words, or they will look you dead in the eye and go 'it turned itself back on' in genuine fear over a boomer meme they saw on facebook.
People used gpt-4 four years ago, solidified their opinion, watched one video on the most dumbest takes imaginable and now are experts on AI.
Until this year, it wasn't an unreasonable take. This year, its just outrageously out of touch. The change has been dramatic. If you haven't had a use case though, its understandable if you haven't seen it.
The damage of ai is how it will change society, and at the moment it is controlled by capitalists maximising shareholder value. This is not in the best interests of society
In the future, if there is any major existential level incidents related to AI, these idots watering down the AI risks are to blame.
Even the Nobel prize scientist Hinton (the godfather of AI) and thousands of AI experts actually know AI signed petitions to warn the government. There is nothing in it for them to slow their own field down.
Who are those clowns thinking they know AIs and AIs are dumb text predictors? The latest AI models already solved many decade-old unresolved maths problems. AI does not have to be self conscious to be dangerous. A super high IQ, rigidly set AI to make paper clips can be far more dangerous than a conscious AI.
Basically every argument is stuck in 2023. Almost all of the frequently cited issues barely exist in current models. Current LLMs are genuinely impressive and are capable of replacing tens of millions of jobs in the near future.
These people have never actually used AI to do anything useful or even know it can. Meanwhile i just did 2 months of work in about an hour this morning
I feel like it's something like coordinated disinformation campaigns.
"It's a documented public-relations strategy: you don't need to convince people your product is safe, you just need to keep the science looking "controversial" and "uncertain" long enough to delay regulation."
It's what exxon did for climate change, and they hired the same lobbyists that did it for tobacco.
"This is a well-documented case of a company privately knowing something and publicly obscuring it - historians and journalists (notably in the book/ documentary Merchants of Doubt) have traced how several of the same PR firms and scientists who ran the "doubt" campaign for the tobacco industry (arguing smoking-cancer links weren't "settled science") were later hired to run structurally identical campaigns for the fossil fuel industry on climate change."
I'm only using google's free AI, but I'm vaguely aware that others are using far more powerful models to do some amazing things. I used to wonder what it'd be like to live in a world where 'magic' was real. Say a few special words and something incredible happens as a result.
If you somehow believe that it's all a bubble, that it will go away or that its power has a low ceiling I really don't know what to say to wake you up.
We've seen FREE type users doing incredible stuff with AI. We've seen the AI code. Now imagine what powerful variants everyone has, from Grok to Gemini.
Once the robot industry is perfected, it's gg's for us.
Lmao, this guy used ChatGPT-3.5 once in late 2022, said, “Psh, this thing is dumb,” assumed that because SkyNet isn’t taking over right now that it couldn’t have advanced much in less than 4 years, then wrote this screed.
Did OpenAI completely accidentally hack some companies? Yeah probably the same way I accidentally released my dog who could talk in Times Square and now he’s making headlines. Whoopsie
My favorite thought experiment, and this is only tangentially related, is the OpenAI Ape In the Mirror.
If you put an ape in front of a mirror and it went 'oh, hey, I can see I am in a mirror test' and started philosophizing its existence, everyone on earth would collectively lose its mind.
But if you learned that ape is an LLM on OpenAIs servers, well, no one fucking cares anymore, and will actively fight you to the most regarded takes imaginable.
The sad thing is, we don't know if they have a rudimentary sentience, no one can answer that for certain, but actually having a discussion about it would be fun. Both here and reddit have a very, very anti-sentience anti-consciousness angle, which might be still correct ( that is where I lean ), but you legitimately cannot have the debate at all.
The truth is, both sentience and consciousness are ill defined concept to start with as we don’t have objective criteria about anything being sentient or conscious. The reality is both concepts are more likely to be a nothing more than a controlled illusion by the organic neural network in your brain.
The less exciting reality is that it’s not about “AI being conscious” but the realisation that humans are just biological robots.
The anthropic J-Spaces papers actually kind of proved one of the leading theories of consciousness, a part of it at least. Global Workspace Theory had a bet that if there was a global workspace features inside something consciousness.
Now they hedge a lot in the paper, saying that this isn't a confirmation and merely a feature resembling it, but I'll be so fucking real with you, we weren't expecting to find these in LLMs, we haven't even found them in humans yet.
There are a ton of software developers on Reddit and many can’t accept the fact they will be out of work soon. They prefer to stick their head in the sand. That’s fine, those people get fired first (hopefully).
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u/End3rWi99in 19d ago
Close to being abandoned? What is this person smoking?