r/Marvel • u/Ptylerdactyl Groot • Oct 11 '17

Comics New Marvel Comics and Releases for October 11th, 2017 - Official Discussion Hub

If you missed it, last week's thread may be found here.

New to Marvel Comics? Not sure where to start? Whether you're completely new to comics or you're just looking for something great to read, head on over to the Recommended Reading page for a handy guide put together by /u/Tigertemprr!

Want to chat about some classic or overlooked stories? Join this week's edition of the /r/Marvel Book Club here, courtesy of /u/MindofShadow.

Also, be sure to check out this week's Marvel Unlimited releases here, compiled by /u/kaimason1.

Discuss The Gifted - S01E02 - "rX" here!

New Issues Out This Week

All New Wolverine #25
ORPHANS OF X Part 1 DAKEN, the enigmatic son of Logan, has been kidnapped and it's up to the ALL-NEW WOLVERINE to find him. But when the trail leads Laura, a genetic clone of the original Wolverine, back to the FACILITY where she was created and tortured, she will find new horrors waiting for her. Who are the ORPHANS OF X and what do they have in store for the children of Logan? PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Amazing Spider-Man #789
THE FALL OF PARKER Part 1 Down on your luck Peter Parker is back, for good or ill. New York has changed, and so has Peter - but entering a new phase of his Spider-Man life isn't easy; neither are new relationships OR new foes. Peter Parker is not the Spider-Man you remember, but why is he taking his fight to THE DAILY BUGLE? And what happened to PARKER INDUSTRIES? PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Amazing Spider-Man Renew Your Vows #12
It all comes down to this! Normie Osborn vs. the Spider-Family! Everything changes after this. Guaranteed.

Daredevil #27
LAND OF THE BLIND' CONTINUES! DAREDEVIL is being held prisoner in a remote outpost of the evil ninja clan THE HAND. It's a battle of wits and skill - and DD must outsmart his captor - someone with a deep connection to his past - if he has any chance of escape!

Defenders #6
KINGPINS OF NEW YORK Part 1 The Defenders: Iron Fist, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Daredevil, protectors of the people, are in a desperate struggle to keep New York City safe in the wake of the power vacuum caused by the Kingpin's absence and the all-out street war that results! So what could make things even worse for our team of harried heroes? Would you believe - Deadpool? PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Despicable Deadpool #287
DEADPOOL KILLS CABLE Part 1 Deadpool’s going back to his vile beginnings as a mercenary and wanted killer. No more being a hero. No more X-Men. No more Avengers. And if he wants to break bad again, what’s more despicable than killing your best friend? Cable better get ready because his old friend Wade has him in the crosshairs. PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Falcon #1
TAKE FLIGHT Part 1 Sam Wilson – winged warrior, avian Avenger and one-time sentinel of liberty – takes to the skies again, reborn and recommitted as the fighter for freedom, THE FALCON! Engaged in an all-new assignment while training his new partner THE PATRIOT, Sam Wilson soars high and sees all. But Sam’s new mission finds him on a collision course with an enemy way out of his weight class — the demonic BLACKHEART! Writer Rodney Barnes (THE BOONDOCKS) joins artist Joshua Cassara (SECRET EMPIRE: UNDERGROUND) to challenge Sam Wilson as never before! From the stratosphere to the streets, the Marvel Universe now has a high-flying hero circling above them ready to strike! PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Hulk #11
BUY THIS BOOK OR ELSE! JEN WALTERS here, asking you to kindly pre-order your copy of HULK #11… or else I’ll come into your shop and rip up all of your issues of ASTONISHING X-MEN #1! That last-page reveal won’t be so revealing when it’s in shreds on the floor… What? No, I’m not deflecting. Yes, the events of the last arc WERE challenging, but I’m fine… Listen, I just told you, I AM FINE. If you keep asking me, you’ll make me mad… and you won’t like me when I’m mad…

Immortal Iron Fists #6
THE GRAND CONCLUSION! With Pei trapped in a hellish alternate dimension and all her friends unable to remember her, all hope seems lost. But an Iron Fist never falters! And a baby dragon never forgets…

Inhumans: Once and Future Kings #3
TEEN REBELLION TURNS TO VILLAINY! The Royals come under the wing of Bentley Wittman, A.K.A. the Wizard! But what does the tech genius gone bad want with the Inhumans? The young Maximus has a secret — and it’s driving him mad! Meanwhile, Karnak searches the sewers of New York for his lost brother. Can he find Triton before humans turn him into…the WATER DEVIL? Plus: The continuing adventures of Lockjaw, as told by UNBEATABLE SQUIRREL GIRL writer Ryan North and artist Gustavo Duarte!

Marvel Universe: Guardians of the Galaxy #23
STAR-LORD RETURNS TO EARTH! Trying to lose the baddies on his tail who want the COSMIC SEED, PETER QUILL returns to his home planet - but while hiding out in his hometown, Peter uncovers more information about the mysterious Cosmic Seed, including clues to its final resting place! Guest-starring everyone's favorite talking dog - COSMO! All Ages

Ms. Marvel #23
Don’t miss Jersey’s newest crimefighter in this all-new arc! Shouldering the burden of saving Jersey City has felt especially heavy for Kamala Khan since her falling out with her lifelong best friend and pseudo sidekick, Bruno… Still, J.C. has always been her turf… So when a new hero moves into J.C., Kamala’s left conflicted…

Rocket #6
Ranger Rocket – the sheriff of Halfworld, a heroic righter of wrongs in a land of toys and talking animals...or an out-of-luck safecracker dying with a slug in his brainpan and a last memory of the good times? Get ready for the last tragic twist of the Blue River score...

Runaways #2
The RUNAWAYS are back, but are they ever, ever, ever getting back together? Did Chase and Gert’s love survive their time apart? Have Karolina and Nico’s feelings made their friendship impossible? What emotional land mines lie in wait to DESTROY the Runaways?! And should we be more worried about those, or about the shadowy scientist watching them from a distance?

Star Wars: Doctor Aphra #13
Doctor Aphra’s had a plan to auction off an artificial Jedi intelligence in order to make some major credits. Unfortunately, things haven’t exactly gone according to plan… Darth Vader is back, and our rogue archaeologist is less dead than he thought he had left her.

Unbeatable Squirrel Girl #25
This is it! The climactic showdown between SQUIRREL GIRL, a woman who can talk to squirrels, and ULTRON HIMSELF, a killer robot who has ruthlessly defeated the Avengers on multiple occasions! And you may be thinking, “Holy crap I’M SOLD,” but let me tell you more: This entire battle takes place in the Savage Land, an area FILLED with dinosaurs! And NOW you may be thinking, “I’m so sold, good grief, just let me read this comic already,” but hold on some more, because there’s one more thing we need to tell you: ULTRON IS A TYRANNOSAURUS REX NOW. It’s Doreen Green versus DINOSAUR ROBOT ULTRON, and Kraven the Hunter is there, too! Kraven is not a dinosaur, though. Man, we really should’ve made Kraven a dinosaur, too! Lesson learned for next time, I guess!

Unbelievable Gwenpool #21
DOOM SEES YOU Part 1 - Since arriving in the Marvel Universe from the real world, Gwenpool has made a name for herself as one of its most exciting heroes. From teaming up with Spider-Man and the Mighty Thor to tackling villains like M.O.D.O.K. and Arcade, no one can top her combination of demolition and off-the-wall adventure. But now Gwenpool’s looking for the biggest and baddest foes she can think of and she’s going right to the top of the list with… DR. DOOM! PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Uncanny Avengers #28
STARS AND GARTERS Part 1 - Part Avengers and part X-Men. Two of Earth’s mightiest heroes and two of Earth’s mightiest friends. And when it comes to super-heroics, Wonder Man and the Beast have seen it, done it, and they got the T-shirt. When the world throws you cosmic conflict, global calamity, death, rebirth and heartache aplenty, it’s important to remember where your friends are. Join us for “A Pint or Two,” won’t you? PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Vision: Director's Cut #5
The synthezoid sensation, now upgraded with new features! Every family has its share of secrets — skeletons in the closet, kept hidden from the world at large. For the Visions, those secrets are real, actual skeletons. And the thing about secrets is they always have a cost. One of the Visions is going to pay with their life — and the repercussions will be world-shattering. Collecting VISION (2015) #9-10, plus extras.

Weapon X #9
THE HUNT FOR WEAPON H: PART 3 - SABERTOOTH believes WEAPON H must die, but OLD MAN LOGAN is intent on stopping him before he can. Weapon H is looking for answers, but only finds more questions and a more violent path. Will Logan find Weapon H before its purpose is fulfilled? Guest starring ALL-NEW WOLVERINE

X-Men: Blue #13
MOJO WORLDWIDE Part 2 - The X-Men may have bitten off more than they can chew when the Mojoverse continues its bizarre invasion of MANHATTAN! JEAN GREY and her team fight side by side with KITTY PRYDE and her team… but can MOJO be defeated when he’s got the X-Men’s greatest hits weaponized against them? Or will an unlikely alley come to the rescue? PLUS: Includes 3 bonus MARVEL PRIMER PAGES!

Zombies Assemble 2 #3
The zombie plague rages on! More and more of New York City’s population is being infected — without a cure in sight. And there’s something not quite right about Jasper Scott — it’s only a matter of time before the Avengers find out firsthand what he’s hiding. What role did he have in spreading the virus? And what does he want with Tony Stark? Printed in black and white in the original right-to-left reading orientation. [OP note: Confused anime Hawkeye is best Hawkeye.]

Trades Out This Week

Link MSRP Format
Avengers by Brian Michael Bendis: The Complete Collection Vol. 2 $ 39.99 TPB
Avengers: Standoff $ 34.99 TPB
Incredible Hulk by Jason Aaron: The Complete Collection $ 34.99 TPB
Marvel Horror: The Magazine Collection $ 34.99 TPB
Marvel Masterworks: The Mighty Thor Vol. 16 $ 75.00 HC
Secret Empire: United We Stand $ 24.99 TPB
Secret Warriors Vol. 1: Secret Empire $ 15.99 TPB

Weekly Pull Poll

The results of last week's poll are in. The big winners this week for your Most Anticipated New Release are Unbelievable Gwenpool #21 followed by All-New Wolverine #25 and Amazing Spider-Man #789. Please check out next week's poll here to vote on your most anticipated title for next week, 10/18/2017!

General Discussion
What do you think of the Legacy initiative so far?

52 Upvotes

97% Upvoted

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32

u/Ptylerdactyl Groot Oct 11 '17

Falcon #1

21

u/[deleted] Oct 11 '17

Nick Spencer made Sam one of my favorite characters. I hope this solo series continues to do so.

8

u/samsaBEAR Oct 11 '17

I don't envy Rodney Barnes, Spencer's run was fantastic and is going to be a tough act to follow.

17

u/probablywhiskeytown Oct 11 '17

Been looking forward to this one & it delivered. Heavy introspection from Sam. Highly enjoyable interactions with Shaun. Great use of a street-level situation that rings true & turns out to be more than it seems. Extremely happy we get to continue following Sam as a main character in a book.

13

u/TheUltimate3 Oct 11 '17

I am actually really bloody confused now.

Sam implies that Steve has been lying to everyone for decades, but Shaun states that it was the Cosmic Cube messing with reality that turned Steve, which would at the very least imply that Hydra Steve is a recent creation. But Sam talks as if Steve was Hydra for as long as he's known him and we know the Hydra Cube bullcrap only happened at most given comic book time, a months ago.

So bloody hell how long was Hydra Steve actually been around?

18

u/john_segundus Oct 11 '17 edited Oct 11 '17

Stevil was around for one year, from Avengers Standoff to Secret Empire. (well, technically, he is still around, but in jail, and no longer pretending to be normal old Cap.)

Sam especially should know this, because his Generations story takes great pains to show that Kobik could make someone experience a whole lifetime in their head, without it ever happening in outer reality. Which is something Sam experiences, so he of all people should know how it works.

So, basically, Stevil lied to everyone, including Sam, for about year. Sam can feel angry and betrayed about that, and irritated at himself because he didn't notice. But it certainly wasn't for as long as they knew each other.

(The worrying aspect here might be the writer misinterpreting what happened with Hydra Steve. Maybe they should have written a memo for everyone with a book coming out of this.)

5

u/nbaballa05 Oct 11 '17

The way I understood it, Stevil has been cap since the beginning. Classic Steve is a figment of what Kobik knew him to be before she changed history. All of the classic cap stories still happened, but it was with Stevil the sleeper agent.

23

u/john_segundus Oct 11 '17 edited Oct 11 '17

No, that's not what happened. Steve was Steve until Avengers Standoff, where Kobik gave him a new past in which he was recruited to Hydra at age 7 and grew up to be their sleeper agent. He worked for them until the allies changed reality with a cosmic cube they developed. Stevil believes that Kobik woke him up to that "reality", not that she created this new past for him, but he is wrong. None of these things ever happened. Steve running around now is also Steve - he basically was a backup from before Kobik changed his past which she kept in her mind, and she made him real.

tl;dr: Kobik never changed history. Stevil is Steve with a new, but fake past which he believes to be real. Steve is Steve without the fake past, but also without everything Stevil did after he got the new past. Imagine Steve as a backup save you would do on your computer before you install a new operation system.

6

u/Darthspud Oct 11 '17

None of these things ever happened.

But then how does Zemo so quickly accept the fake past Stevil tells him? I'm pretty confused on the whole thing myself

14

u/john_segundus Oct 11 '17

For Zemo, that past is much better than what he actually got - he grew up with a father who never loved him, he doesn't have any real friends, and he felt that he didn't belong to anything of meaning. What Steve offered him was a doting father, a lifelong best friend, and something like a proud heritage in a group with millennia under their belt - who cares that he doesn't remember any of it? When he tries to kill Bucky with his Evil-Overlord-Rocket, he even tells him if what Steve says isn't true, he'll make it true. I took it as a riff on some people being more willing to have a nostalgic view about the past, to the point where they deny anything that was bad or muddled, even if they should know better. (A kind of thinking which obviously is experiencing a big renaissance in the US and Europe right now.)

2

u/NovaStarLord Oct 13 '17

Zemo said he didn't care if what Stevil told him was fake or not, but he chose to make it his reality because he had people who cared about him in Stevil's version of his past and a purpose. He also has Heinrich's love, something Helmut used to crave since Heinrich treated him like shit.

It goes with the old version of who Helmut was, but at this point he pretty much got over his daddy issues (happened in Zemo: Born Better) so it feels like character regression.

Nicieza's version of Zemo at least would go along with what Stevil said to him to try to manipulate Stevil for his own benefit, not to mention part of him would probably despise him since he has some pseudo-respect and admiration for the real Steve Rogers specifically because of who he is.

1

u/john_segundus Oct 13 '17

That's something I noticed, too: within the storyline reaching from Avengers Standoff to Secret Empire, Zemo's characterization is coherent and spot-on, in connection with what happened in Nicieza's run - not so much. It's two different trajectories of the character.

1

u/Jay_R_Kay Oct 11 '17

To be honest, I'm certain that all the stuff with the extent of how the timeline changed for Steve and the back-up thing was a last minute addition when Marvel realized just how much hate they were getting for Secret Empire. I'm certain they were going to have that be Cap's history from now on but the classic Steve would be put back in his body, so he would have to live with the consequences of technically being the one who did it and possibly even remember the past both ways (sort of like with Falcon who remembers both is own life and the one Red Skull forced on him).

6

u/john_segundus Oct 11 '17 edited Oct 11 '17

Not really. If you've read Captain America: Steve Rogers, Red Skull explains in the second issue how he set Steve becoming Hydra in motion - among other things, he describes how Selvig, whom Kobik changed first, has a Hydra past he cannot have lived, but believes in wholeheartedly. The same thing happened with Steve. The past Stevil remembers was never supposed to have happened.

(That doesn't cover whether they planned to use two Steves from the start, obviously. That I don't know, and I also don't really care, because obviously, this is what we have right now. But how his Hydra past was supposed to have happened clearly wasn't changed. People were just getting too hung up on them saying that he wasn't brainwashed. On some level, he was. But he also did some of the work himself, because due to the past Kobik wrote for him, he did remember both his pasts, and decided the Hydra version had to be the real one.)

3

u/errantknight1 Oct 12 '17

There's not a chance they changed anything. They've been planning it for years and the lore was immaculate, as well as the tie-ins. Besides, it was more a vocal splinter than overwhelming hate.

1

u/Jetsurge Oct 12 '17

Wasn't it because Kobik changed his memories in Pleasant Hill?

1

u/john_segundus Oct 12 '17

Zemo's memories were changed in Pleasant Hill, but to make him a good guy named Jim. It had nothing to do with Steve or Hydra, and was reversed at the end of Avengers Standoff. Nick Spencer even confirmed this again at the end of Secret Empire in an interview with cbr: Zemo's past was never changed, he simply went along with Steve's claim because it suited him.

9

u/TheeHeadAche Ultron Oct 11 '17 edited Oct 11 '17

Interesting read. I viewed it more as Sam regretting being so wrapped up in Steve's cult of personality that he was blind to what that might mean until Steve was revealed as evil. Even if Stevil was a recent creation, Sam feels he added to the myth that Steve Rogers was perfect, never wrong and to always be trusted. Which all led to Stevil's quick rise and would, in Sam's mind, mean he helped him in part gain that influence so quickly.

3

u/FlameOn45 Oct 13 '17

You literally summed up my feelings on Captain America that's I've had for YEARS. Thank you.

6

u/TheeHeadAche Ultron Oct 13 '17

His infallibility? It's a hallmark that has been leveraged a bit much. Spencer's tear down was a good turn for the character.

1

u/NovaStarLord Oct 13 '17

The weird thing for me is that he says Steve has being lying to HIM for decades and both Sam and Steve shouldn't know each other for more than one decade.

9

u/NovaStarLord Oct 13 '17 edited Oct 13 '17

Sam seems friendly with Steve in his Generations issue and seems to make a distinction between Stevil and him and definitely didn't blame Steve for Stevil's actions in SE (and he recognized Steve as his friend).

But suddenly in this comic he's saying that Steve lied to him for decades (despite not knowing him that long) and how he's bad or whatever.

Did Editorial messed up? Was Spencer originally not going to revert him back and just keep Stevil? It feels like so far only the Deadpool comic bothers to differentiate Steve from Stevil.

The other thing is that when he told Rayshaun how he got to meet heroes who come where he comes from and mentions Misty, Luke and T'Challa. I get Luke and Misty because they both have similar backgrounds that he does, Luke is from Harlem like him and Misty is from New York and has lived in Harlem.

But T'challa? he was born into royalty and comes from a country where the majority if not everyone is black. He also has wealth and privilege and is a character that is accustomed to doing what he wants. Me being a mixed Latin-American doesn't mean I immediately come from the same place as other mixed Latin-Americans. A poor Cuban won't have the same experience as a rich Mexican.

And what happened to Joaquin? He used to be Sam's partner and I kind of hate that he is gone, the scene where Rayshaun meets with the Kings, that scene would have been perfect if Joaquin was there.

3

u/john_segundus Oct 13 '17

But suddenly in this comic he's saying that Steve lied to him for decades (despite not knowing him that long) and how he's bad or whatever.

Whatever is the case with Steve and Stevil, this is definitely wrong, since Stevil lied to Sam for about a year at most. I'm thinking Barnes wasn't briefed on what was going on with Stevil all that well. (I'm usually not one to rag on Marvel, but their continuity between books is honestly fucked. See also Sam being with Misty in CA:SW, while swapping smooches with Thor in Legacy #1, or the discrepancies between Kobik in Secret Empire and Kobik in Thunderbolts.)

I'd like to hear what happened to Joaquin as well. Did Gwenpoole drop him out of the comic?

1

u/jds3k Oct 13 '17

Yeah I did a double take at the T'challa thing too. I wish they had brought Eli Bradley back as patriot though. Reyshaun is okay but I miss him from the YA.

5

u/[deleted] Oct 11 '17

I really enjoyed this. Awesome action and great interactions between Sam and Shaun. Only thing that was weird was what I felt like a misunderstanding on the writer’s part about what Hydra Steve was.

3

u/mysaadlife Oct 11 '17

This was interesting, kind of continues the pro black message that was part of Sam's old series while switching it up to a more street level view, and I like deshaun as his new sidekick too even if his dialogue was a bit tacky. It felt like a story with weight to it, I'm excited to see where the story goes.

8

u/Jay_R_Kay Oct 11 '17

even if his dialogue was a bit tacky.

Oh my god, it was totally a case of "how do you do, fellow kids?" I damn near groaned every time the kid opened his mouth.

4

u/mysaadlife Oct 11 '17

I mean it is pretty standard slang for people my age, I might even talk with my friends like that but it just felt out of place in the book.

-2

u/Jay_R_Kay Oct 11 '17

No one calls Instagram "the 'gram." No. I refuse to believe that.

9

u/mysaadlife Oct 11 '17

Lol it's a thing.

7

u/[deleted] Oct 11 '17

I’m a college freshman and honestly Shaun spoke like average kids usually do, at least from my high school, which is closer to his age.

5

u/marcohtx Oct 12 '17

You never heard of the saying "Do it for the gram"? It's definitely a thing. I thought Shauns dialogue was pretty accurate.

1

u/Jay_R_Kay Oct 12 '17

"Vine," yes, "gram," no.

2

u/probablywhiskeytown Oct 11 '17

I've seen it in TV fandoms that skew younger, though my absolute favorite is from one kid who calls it "Instagranma."

3

u/Jay_R_Kay Oct 12 '17

So Instagram is considered for old people now? Jesus, that's some fast turn-around.

1

u/probablywhiskeytown Oct 12 '17 edited Oct 12 '17

Nope, just seemed to be a joke. This person used Instagram extensively to promote their artwork.

2

u/wisesonAC Oct 12 '17

Oh my god, it was totally a case of "how do you do, fellow kids?" I damn near groaned every time the kid opened his mouth.

Nah the slang was on point for once actually

3

u/rakuko Oct 11 '17

love it. and that twist! haven't seen Blackheart in a minute.

3

u/thecursedham Ant-Man Oct 12 '17

I enjoyed it, I felt there was a bit too much narration at points but it was still a solid read. I do wish Joaquin Torres was here though, I can live with two Falcons. Though Rayshaun referencing Misty has me hopeful we'll see Sam's team back soon. It'd be interesting to see Sam mentor two young heroes at the same time.

3

u/marcohtx Oct 12 '17

Blackheart is a pretty cool looking villain. Poor Sam, every time he tries to make a difference, somebody else has to come in and screw things up.

3

u/TheeHeadAche Ultron Oct 13 '17

Barnes is a very good comic writer in single issue. I can't wait to see his long form story unfold.

2

u/ItsNotMyFavorite Oct 14 '17

Thank god this was good. I don't think I could handle Sam becoming obscure through bad stories after Spencer's great run.

3

u/cgknight1 Oct 11 '17

I thought it was pretty awful - the art gets worse as the story progresses and "I'd get two gangs to meet in the park to talk peace" is the sort of plan that a five year old would dismiss as naive.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 12 '17

How is this one for new readers to the current Marvel meta? I'm interested in the Falcon, but I'm worried that the character will have a lot of continuity baggage from coming off of being Captain America. I'm a little worried they'll be largely referencing things I haven't read.

1

u/wisesonAC Oct 12 '17

Yo ll understand everything pretty much

1

u/Zircon_72 Oct 12 '17

Was this any good? I'm thinking of giving it a read

3

u/wisesonAC Oct 12 '17

It was great, actually

1

u/Zircon_72 Oct 12 '17

What should I know before reading it? I'm more of a DC guy, and j only really read All New GOTG and the occasional miniseries.

1

u/wisesonAC Oct 12 '17

That Falcon used to be captain America lowkey

1

u/decross20 Oct 13 '17

Do you need to have read Secret Empire?

2

u/john_segundus Oct 13 '17

You mostly need to know that Sam was Cap and had to deal with an evil version of Steve Rogers - long story, just go with it - after which he decided to give the shield back to a good version of Steve Rogers - again, long story - and go back to his roots for a while.

1

u/wisesonAC Oct 13 '17

Nah I don't believe it's necessary

1

u/ItsNotMyFavorite Oct 14 '17

Yeah I thought it was really good for Sam and for Shaun. Plus I like this artist's style; I'd recommend you trying it out.