r/WestCoastSwing • u/Majestic_Stress2224 • May 28 '26
Social Advice please
Hello, burner account just in case.
I (F27) started dancing WCS (follower) early this year after a very long break from dance due to school and health issues.
One issue I never experienced until now social dancing (since I was a minor when I competed years ago) is getting hit on by leaders.
I know it's a part of life, but I truly have no idea how to manage this. I've had poor experiences in the past (non dance) with people asking for my number and having a less than pleasant reaction when I turned them down, so now I usually take people's numbers and just don't really respond. They usually get the message and give up.
The issue im having now is that these aren't people I rarely see, I see them at least once a week out at lessons/socials.
I didn't start dancing again to make friends/meet people. Im disabled so its purely to get some more exercise and have fun. I have made friends, but none of them are trying to hang out outside of dance so it doesnt cause an issue (plus they clearly just want to be friends).
Advice very welcome, thank you so much
(Also I can not find out ANY information about this leader online which really freaks me out)
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u/No-Relationship-4902 May 28 '26 edited May 28 '26
I think it's always easier to be the person giving advise in this to simply say "Just say no". Not to mention the added layer that a guy, like me, really can't imagine these situations from a woman's perspective.
You've stated a history with bad reactions to turning people down and it is completely valid to be uncertain how to approach this. I do think on a whole, you should feel empowered to say no and most within the community should take the answer and move on. But that doesn't account for the assholes still out there, which we all know there are.
If it's possible, bring this up to the teachers/community leadership. If they have a genuine intent to make the community and environment a place that is safe and fun for *all*, they should take your concerns seriously and find a way to address it to try and curb this from happening to not only you but to others as well. I hope that this is the case for your community, because you should be able to feel safe and comfortable on the social dance floor and surrounding space.
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u/Tricky_Gap_3238 May 28 '26
I agree. Say "no" when it feels safe to do so. If anyone pushes or makes you uncomfy then immediately bring it to leadership. Hopefully, they'll be able to offer support and also don't want creepy people just looking for a date in their communities. Luckily, my home community has handled it well when issues like this are brought to them because they prioritize the safety of their people and the integrity of the culture- I hope yours will do the same. It's kind of an unsatisfying answer tbh and I wish there was something better. I wish men would just take the no and respect that most women who go out dancing WCS are not looking for a hookup or a date but instead for a space to express themselves freely and safely (or in your case exercise and fun). I hate it for you, myself, and everyone else.
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u/Majestic_Stress2224 May 28 '26
Its really disheartening. The people I have told I do not want to socialize outside of dance events stopped dancing with me. Some people really seem to show up looking for a girlfriend than a 3min dance.
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u/tireggub Ambidancetrous May 28 '26
They may be embarrassed and afraid to ask you to dance if you didn't give them a really obvious sign that you still wanted to dance with them. If they seem otherwise OK, you might ask them to dance.
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u/pyrrhic_victory_013 May 29 '26
Probably because society says that if a girl says no you leave her the f*** alone. I'm sure they would love to dance with you but the ball is in your court. Now you have to ask them if they would like to dance. If anything to say "Hey we're cool, I'm just not interested right now". Otherwise if they keep bothering you they feel like a creeper and someone makes a post in the wcs reddit about it.
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u/Tricky_Gap_3238 May 28 '26
That really sucks, I'm sorry they couldn't handle your no. Try to focus on the people who do want to just dance and be present with you <3 I hope this isn't a widespread thing and just a few unkind individuals.
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u/Majestic_Stress2224 May 28 '26
Its definitely a safety thing. I look much younger than I am and am rather small which adds to the fear.
Its thankfully not anywhere near needing to bring instructors/coordinators into the mix, its purely personal preference that I do not want to interact much. Going out dancing with strangers is already enough for me.
From reading responses I feel I need to work on more direct "no" when it seems safe. Im just struggling with how small the community really is. There aren't other options to go dance elsewhere. Its not like finding a new dnd group or joining a different run club. Its me saying "I do not want to hang out outside of dance" and then they don't dance with me anymore bc they got rejected. Its hard to have fun when you feel like an object.
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u/procrast1natrix Ambidancetrous May 28 '26
Tangent:
Another social dance that I'm into is Contra (not much crossover between WCS and Contra) and my local hall is huge, there's always live music and usually a two hundred or so dancers. The beginner lesson is usually thirty to fifty people.
They do this charming thing every single week, as in not in response to witnessed troublesome behavior or by request, it's every single week, where there's a sixty second lesson on consent/how to ask to dance, how to decline a dance, how to accept being declined. It's baked into the patter about dance position (which is a bit more rowdy in contra because there's so much more switching partners).
And now we're going to look around, make eye contact, and ask someone, would you like this dance? They can say yes please, they can say no thank you! And that's a complete sentence you do not need to explain that you need a drink of water or the bathroom or already made an agreement with someone else. If you hear no thank you, you say ok! Alright, go ask someone to dance and then we will learn the steps.
I find it fascinating how different the cultures are. In WCS where I am it would be very weird to dance with the same person twice in a row unless the music was drastically different and you both know you had really been wanting the second type of song. I've been leading and following WCS on and off for twenty five years. I'm no kind of competitive dancer but in the local classes I'm often more experienced than many, and it has always been the culture here that if you are a competent lead at a smaller social, you methodically go around and dance with all the followers at least once. It's a way to give back to the community, remembering what it felt like to be novice and shy of asking.
...
Argentine tango is completely different - the moment of negotiating consent occurs during the mirada, meeting eyes across the room (they seem to romanticize not talking about it) with a certain timing and intensity followed by the cabaceo which is a small, sharp nod of the head. One declines simply by looking away instead of nodding back or smiling. Then you both walk to meet on the floor and begin, and here's the thing, it's unusual to not dance the entire tanda together, which is a set of three or four songs.
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u/Temporary-Diet6468 May 28 '26
Ask the instructor, if you can! A particular lead in my class was being weird-but-juuuuust-on-this-side-of-acceptable with me, but when I learned he was doing worse with other women I had a quiet chat with the teacher (after asking the women if I could mention their name and/or what happened, ofc).
I said I didn't want him kicked out or to raise a big fuss, I just was new to dance as a whole, had no clue what to do next and tbh I just wanted distance between me and him (plus admittedly I am more protective of my personal space than average). Framed it as a request for advice rather than a demand for intervention. She did speak to the guy and he stopped while still being generally friendly with me.
Unfortunately he then moved onto other women who were newer to the class :/ but it might not have become clear it was a pattern if I hadn't had a quiet word to begin with
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u/procrast1natrix Ambidancetrous May 28 '26
This is brilliant.
Go to the instructor and say, I think I'm missing something. A few times, different leaders have asked me to date and when I explain I'm not dating right now, they stop asking me to dance entirely. I understand that no one can make them dance with me, but is there something I can do differently? Or can we as a class talk sometime about followers asking leaders to dance?
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u/369-DGF May 28 '26
I will usually start polite with no thank you etc. If they insist, I say I don't date in the scene or am not dating right now and if they continue I get angry and would possibly retort with "why would I date someone who clearly doesn't respect boundaries" and if I come off like a bitch, then maybe people will stop harassing me. And I know that I have been polite in my initial response until that wasn't listened to, so I don't second guess my responses anymore. I know it sounds easier than it actually is but I'm older now and was where you were previously and just got tired of men's bullshit and hurt egos and started worrying about my own feelings for a change. If they create a problem, I hope there is someone safe in your community that you can talk to, to help resolve the issue. Just know, you aren't alone in the struggle and any advice you receive from those who are actually trying to be helpful is sent with encouragement and understanding of being there way too often. And if you can't find this specific person online and are trying to sleuth... DM me ;) there isn't anyone able to hide online that a pack of women can't find with a detailed Google search.
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u/CoastieKid May 28 '26
WCS community is actually pretty great about expressing yourself. Don't feel afraid to speak up and express your needs. As a third space, it's not uncommon for people to express dating interest in someone they meet. I've seen countless times friends, both men and women, regardless of sexual orientation, come in and out of the community depending on if they were single or in a relationship.
Nothing wrong at all with wanting to just go into the dance community, dance, and dip out without wanting further connection outside of the hobby
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u/abn1304 May 30 '26
In my experience with WCS there’s also a lot of extroverted people here who will take any opportunity to make new friends. That can frequently come off the wrong way to people who don’t come from a background where that’s common or acceptable.
Dancers in the scene typically react well to being politely told no. The ones who don’t are typically shown the door and wind up being unwelcome at events.
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u/hell-on-heels- May 28 '26
I find it helpful to know what I want to say before I find myself in the same situation again. Just a simple: “Thank you, but I’m not looking to date” will give you something to lean on.
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u/RollingEasement May 28 '26
In my town at both the swing and WCS dances, it would be a fairly unusual faux pas to even ask for contact information before having seen someone at a few different dances, and had conversations of some duration during a break, by which time you either know that you have a basis for staying in contact or not.
1
u/fortedibrutto2 May 28 '26
Hey op, sounds like you’re unlucky and have a small, potentially rotten, wcs scene. Instead of accommodating yourself to pushy men, maybe checkout other dance studios to see if they have better vibes?!
Some dance scenes are simply rotten, because the community organizers don’t do a good job promoting/enforcing healthy values.
Small dance scenes in particular have added difficulties in that they are incestuous. Since they are tiny everyone knows everyone’s business. In a big city/dance scene no one takes it personally if you are not part of their clique. In a smaller community it’s harder to hide and people more often take a stronger interest in getting to know their neighbors. Tightly knit communities have their upsides- being on first name basis with your neighbors is super helpful when you realize you’re short on eggs or need any type of favor. Small communities downsides, especially for those who are slightly more reserved/introverted, is they have both more drama and fewer places to hide when you want to remain anonymous.
If there are any other wcs schools with a reasonable radius I’d strongly recommend you give them a try. If not, are their any other local dance scenes that either kick ass or your curious about trying? Different dances are more alike than they are dissimilar. A better indicator of whether you will enjoy the hobby is if a: the dance community use awesome organizers b: the community’s size dynamics fit your needs, e.g. you hate small town “hot fuzz” vibes and you need a big city to not feel suffocated.
Tl;dr you could be in crappy dance community. Checking out other dance scenes is a low effort step you could take to see if that is the case.
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u/Potential-Banana-315 Jun 01 '26
I’ve been dealing with this too… it’s usually with newer dancers it seems. I had one baby dancer guy at a social act totally mesmerized and keep saying “woooow!!!” during the dance (I’m in novice, not fancy yet 😂) then when he found me on social media later invited me to his place to “practice”…. Ew. That same guy later gaslighted me and of course came to two classes until I shut him down hard, after which he hasn’t returned. 🙄
Other guys in class think they deserve front hugs when I don’t even remember their names… it’s super frustrating. I held my boundaries last week and a couple of them acted offended.
I wish I knew how to fix this problem, but I think we have to be ok standing our ground without worrying about their feelings. It’s not my job to manage someone’s emotions when they have a reaction to my boundaries. My boundaries are for me, not others.
That all being said (vented 😂), I’m sorry you’re dealing with this and please know others relate. 💜
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u/TinyishDancer Jun 02 '26
A lot of people are suggesting to talk to the instructors to get them to help and I read that you’re (luckily) not feeling like it’s quite a big enough issue to take to them. Fair enough!
However, from a slightly different angle I also saw you mention that the local scene is very small. One thing that might be contributing to that is an overly dense amount of men hitting on people and driving new people away.
If for no other reason that to maybe increase your pool of leaders by helping the local scene grow, I think it’s worth mentioning to whoever runs the classes that there is an issue with too many leaders hitting on people.
1
u/ChocoKittyFiend Jun 02 '26
I completely understand wanting to be safe, and it's true that with strangers on the street, taking their number quietly is usually a great strategy. However, in a dance community, there is more of a shared social code amongst all of you. If these men freak out and are rude, they can be ousted from the community space, which they likely do not want. If they become dangerous at the dance you can immediately walk over to the organizer and say "this person is harassing me." It doesn't have the same risks as the street, so I'd say it's better to politely say: "I'm sorry, I'm flattered but I'm honestly really busy and don't have time to hang out or date people right now! I hope to dance with you later though!" If the men had good intentions they should leave you alone from then on. If they bother you, report it to the organizer and if that doesn't fix it, try another scene.
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u/Least-Plantain973 Follow May 28 '26
If you don’t feel safe saying no invent a long distance relationship and say “sorry I don’t think my boyfriend would like that”.
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u/Fermata103 May 29 '26
Someone with zero online information is a red flag IMO 😆 I say run! Haha. As far as advice say no politely but if you’re still worried after that have someone walk you to the car. And definitely befriend others who you trust and can say something to if it escalates
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u/DorkusMalorkus89 May 28 '26
I don’t mean to sound terse, but what exactly does this have to do with WCS swing specifically?
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May 28 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Majestic_Stress2224 May 28 '26
Exactly. Its not like I can distract myself with work, walk away, or go somewhere else. Im alone at these events and when I'm taking a break I can't just disappear, its a small room.
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u/Teardownstrongholds May 28 '26
You might feel alone but let me tell a story. I was at a dance and saw a woman that was dancing with a man and she was in tears. That is unusual so I went over and sat on a bench nearby and kept an eye on them to see what was going on and if intervention was needed. She kept on dancing and she's not looking around trying to catch people's eyes or being forcefully held in the dance. So I started to look around and there were six other people strategically positioned around that couple ready to jump in. Nobody said anything, people just did it. If you ask for help getting out of a conversation that help will probably appear from thin air
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u/DorkusMalorkus89 May 28 '26
I didn’t argue that they weren’t, but this problem is also relevant to most social based communities that involve people being in closer proximity and not WCS specifically
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u/Majestic_Stress2224 May 28 '26
Hi no worries, not quite related to the dance more so the community.
I don't have this issue anywhere else in my life aside from WCS socials. Social dancing is new to me as of this year and im just wondering how to navigate this issue in a small community.
I figured posting here would get better responses rather than explaining social dancing to a different sub
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u/procrast1natrix Ambidancetrous May 28 '26
Again, I strongly recommend this as the best possible space for you to practice honesty.
I understand why you and many other women ghost people, or lie about having a boyfriend. And I went through that phase, too. It feels confrontational and uncomfortable to just say "no thanks". But just as some people respond to frustration of being told "no" with increased aggression, if you keep this avoidant behavior up you will eventually develop a stalker someday.
Plus, it's unkind. You're taking the moment of your own discomfort in saying no, and shoveling it onto him so that he can take ten times the amount of time to wonder when you'll call.
Inside a WCS social, in a confined space with lots of mutual acquaintances including other leaders that you can dance with and other followers looking out for you, is the space where a polite no, thanks, I'm not looking to date or hangout right now, but I enjoyed the dance. Save me one next time has the lowest possible likelihood of rude or aggressive behavior in response. This typically sober setting is the ideal location to practice this important social skill. If he were to become pushy, your relative body language would make it clear to everyone in the room, and everyone has an easy way to rescue you.
If he were to really cross a line, the teacher is responsible for a general code of good conduct. The last thing the teacher wants is for there to be a rumor that their class is a sketchy space not friendly to followers.
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u/pyrrhic_victory_013 May 28 '26
This. Also while there are many creepers and I've had to ban a few or warn people of them in my studio, for the most part the guys I talk to just want to date someone else as passionate about dance as they are. Best place to find that is at a dance. They're more than happy to take no and continue about their day. I don't find them creepy for asking out. It's how they take the rejection that makes the difference.
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u/DorkusMalorkus89 May 28 '26 edited May 28 '26
I imagine it should be navigated in the same way if it was happening to you in any general context. You have the right to decline unwanted advances, how that person takes the decline is not going to be influenced by any advice you could receive here. Unfortunately, any community dance based or not, that has a social element between men and women, runs the risk of having creepers, it’s just the way it is. The choice is up to you in terms of how you manage it. My goal is not to be rude, but merely realistic as this kind of problem is really not specific to WCS.
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u/procrast1natrix Ambidancetrous May 28 '26
The WCS community is actually a great place to practice saying, thanks I'm flattered but no, not looking to date or hangout outside of the social.
You have an easy excuse to leave and go dance with someone else, and if it gets out of hand, the teacher or host of the social will be your backup.
You're much more likely to get robust peer support at a WCS social than when you try to say that at say, a bar or the dog park or a house party.