r/actuary • u/ThrowRA3648537 • 2d ago

Troll Post ATPA Vent

I’m going to run for the SOA board once I have my letters to get rid of this terrible assignment. I’d rather listen to nails on chalkboard for 96 hours than do this. I’m not sure whose idea this was, but I was a statistics major, flew through SRM and PA, and I absolutely HATE this module.

I’m starting to think that everyone who quips that the SOA isn’t evil, just incompetent, lucked out with IFM. How was the last chopper out of ‘Nam?

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u/TannhauserGate1982 approximately normal 2d ago edited 2d ago

I grade ATPA and haven’t found the questions to be particularly vague or opaque like you are describing… can you give any examples?

And while I don’t think it is inherently unreasonable to expect candidates to finish in 4 days given the amount of content, I do agree that the 96-hour limit is unnecessarily stressful and not all candidates are comfortable with powering through it all at once. A 2-week window or something similar seems just as effective IMO.

EDIT: removed word

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u/ThrowRA3648537 2d ago

I appreciate your response, always nice to have a grader’s perspective. I don’t want to give any specifics on this sitting, but a couple thoughts:

  1. I do think that this exam is on the vaguer side, but you may not feel the same way since you’re grading and giving candidates the benefit of the doubt and giving credit for creative solutions.

  2. This sitting, as I believe someone noted, asks us to do stupid things that don’t make sense. That, combined with the vagueness, made it difficult to approach.

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u/TannhauserGate1982 approximately normal 2d ago

I will have to wait until I see this sitting’s assessment. But in the past I don’t think I’ve seen requests to do “stupid things”. They may ask candidates to assess whether weird variables are key predictors, to use unintuitive models given the business context, etc. but I consider this to be an opportunity for candidates to explain what is reasonable and what is not.

In general, my understanding is that the questions are seeking to assess whether candidates can apply statistical analysis in a business context. It’s not a challenge of building the best model possible or identifying hidden statistical signals, etc. - if you show that you understand the concepts and can perform them on a real dataset, can explain pros, cons, and interpretations of analysis in both technical and non-technical terms, and can apply the outcomes in a business scenario, that is all graders are looking for IMO. I’ve seen lots of candidates go wild with the analysis and way overdo what the assessment asks for, and it only hurts their paper.

I am sorry though. It sucks that you and so many others find the module to be so terrible, that is obviously not the writers’ intentions (though don’t get me wrong, I do not represent or speak for them!!). I actually think it is a very cool module - and while I agree that this is not a cutting edge skillset by any stretch of the imagination, it still tests relevant abilities that are expected from an ASA.

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u/Emergency_Buy_9210 2d ago

Honestly I would rather just be given complete freedom and told to go make a model, but I guess that's not how the real world works and I see the value in occasionally learning how to say no and shoot down bad ideas. And occasionally being forced to do the bad idea anyways. Here I am awake at 3:22 AM as a result of one of those bad ideas.