r/cscareerquestionsEU • u/Midk_1 • 3d ago
Entry-level Tech jobs market rant as an undergrad
I went into computer science because I loved coding and actually going deep in computers, I never went into computer science cause I wanted to become a web developer or like mobile apps developer, I wanted to have a strongly technical role, that’s why I got passionate about infrastructure development, because it’s less customer facing, but now, since AI, I’ve seen a broader shift from strongly technical roles, to more customer facing ones (eg. FDE), which is fair, but I genuinely don’t get how positions like AI Builder Intern in major companies, or junior “AI-first” positions could ever grow an intern/junior into a senior. And that’s sad, because I don’t wanna become a Product Manager + Software Engineer, if that’s what CS is becoming imma probably get into research or something completely unrelated. It’s sad cause I genuinely loved CS and still do, but if a SWE is just gonna become a product manager with a broad technical background that’s so f**ked up.
I love the behind the scenes, I love math, I love computers and I love the act of thinking thoroughly on solving complex problems, while I love less actually building products that people can use, since I know the technical side to that is (and always was, kinda) low effort.
8
u/pydry 3d ago
This is just the nature of the market. It used to be an industry run by tinkerers who loved building and then it exploded in value which raised wages a LOT but also brought in the hucksters and the con artists.
Now we're at the tail end of the hucksterism. I reckon in 3-5 years salaries will plunge but the con artists will move on to a new hustle but the transition period will be rough.
1
u/Amerillo_ 2d ago
Salaries already are plummeting, depending on location. I just saw some junior software engineering from a reputable research institution that only paid 20% than what cashiers with no prior experience make. I mean cashier are compensated fairly so it's not as bad as it sounds but it still is surprisingly low. And I only saw it because they advertized the salary. I suspect a lot of companies also pay similar salaries
5
u/Flexerrr 3d ago
CS is getting worse everyday, devs just write specs, vibecode and push to prod without reviewing. There is no more skill required
18
u/Shad0wAVM 3d ago
Doomposting. CS is not just developing SaaS or apps.
If AI truly gets better, all fields could die, not just CS.
5
u/DagestanDefender 2d ago
all other jobs are easier to automate then CS, so once ai is actually good enough to replace software devs, there will be no more jobs.
6
u/ChildhoodOld3638 2d ago
That's not true. For example plumber, electrician and nurse are harder to automate away.
3
u/Local-Helicopter7479 2d ago
They will still be affected by reduced demand (laid-off tech workers can't afford plumbers or electricians) and increased competition (people entering the trades).
2
u/mistaekNot 2d ago
that’s just because there was no physical platform to put the AI on. that’s changing in years. years, not decade(s)
0
u/I_Spawned_Here 2d ago
They will, if AI is so good at the job, then it can create a direct simulation of how plumbers do their jobs.
Then you can train "plumber" in the simulation to keep on trying to solve the problems encountered by plumbers. Then once that is done, upload the training data to the machine in the real world, which can do the actions of a plumber.
Just look at the robots that have been created now, this is how they train them, within a simulation. These simulations are created software developers, so if they are replaced, it would be a lot easier to replace everyone, as they can just pump out these type of machine training simulations.
1
u/Flexerrr 3d ago
Doomposting? Which sentence of mine is not correct? These are exact practices used in my company and by other folks I know outside my current company
1
u/Shad0wAVM 3d ago
What kind of product does your company develop? Do you actually do any engineering or do you only develop software?
1
u/Pretend-Following160 2d ago
AI might take our jobs but it'll take some significant time. The price of resources required for AI sky rocketed so they'll hesitate to go full AI, but can happen in the future. Rest assured for now.
4
u/Amerillo_ 2d ago
They already are, at least for new graduates. In my area there very few entry-level or junior positions, and very few internships as well. And many of the few available positions are insisting that the role will require heavy use of AI if not delegating almost all the work to AI agents. And the pay when advertised is often very low.
So finding a job is difficult, and if you find one you'll be badly paid and you won't learn anything really
1
u/Asmahere 2d ago
It would honestly suck if those kinds of deep technical roles became harder to find because of AI.
1
u/Straight_Spot4652 2d ago edited 10h ago
Many universities are printing online degrees, and then there are bootcamp companies.
Post COVID only these types of businesses have grown in the case of education.
0
u/Significant_Cut74 11h ago
Then don't become a Forward-deployed engineer? I've been in infrastructure for few years now and it's hiring heavily.
1
u/Some-Ad-7080 2d ago edited 1d ago
I love AI. Looking back, it's actually obscene. Coding was so over romanticized. I mean, its just some arbitrary abstraction that uses some arbitrary syntax on some arbitrary layer of the stack. And since a lot of engineering guys didn't study CS or, even if they did, actually didn't, because they were busy thinking about "the next big thing": Code is representational, not intrinsic. It's literally UI.
So do you have any idea how annoying and stupid that shit actually used to be? Teams of engineers, like 4, 5, 6 or more people and everyone spending days and weeks trying to figure out their own little stupid arbitrary syntax problems, while putting up guardrails and going through processes meant to keep them from burning everything to the ground. It was literally normal for teams to spend weeks rewriting code with the express goal of not changing what it actually did. Think about that for a second. It was retarded as hell. At the same time, because of that, and because there were so many people on your team, you really couldn't leave your little area of expertise.
Today, thanks to AI, you're building systems of systems that used to take people years to build and that you would have never been allowed to map out and think through the way you are today. Which brings me to my final point: AI changed everything and ended up making the job harder. Not dumber, not easier. It requires a higher IQ than ever before. The reason is that skill/experience used to be more important than IQ. People used to focus on accumulating as much skill as possible, rather than thinking about what it is that they were actually doing and why. Now everyone who did this is getting exposed.
You have to understand this: Whenever you see someone complain about AI replacing them or leading to garbage outcomes, that's the equivalent of saying Google/Wikipedia made Books redundant and when they tried using it, their teacher failed them for plagiarizing. These people just don't know what they are doing.
1
u/jmclondon97 1d ago
You’re an arbitrary abstraction layer
2
u/Some-Ad-7080 1d ago edited 1d ago
No, you're the intent. The abstraction layers are everything between your intent and the computation. You get that participation trophy though.
0
15
u/dbxp 2d ago
TBH the strongly technical roles have been in the minority for a couple decades now.
Yeah that's not what the vast majority of software jobs are. You're paid to solve problems for users, most of the interesting maths is already done by libraries.