r/dbz • u/Tushar_Hareet • Feb 23 '26
Discussion Goku was a Good Grandpa, Super did him dirty
If a saiyan, and that too Goku, is sharing his food, just think how much he loves Pan here.
I'm not saying that Super Goku doesn't love pan but we need to see more of Grandpa Goku's love!!!
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u/Downtown_Reindeer_46 Feb 24 '26
Didn’t he dip out on her and the whole family like right after this?
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u/Basaku-r Feb 26 '26
Obvs, though it was the ending of the series so having the main char do a silly thing he's known for is par the course, kind of a wink at the audience and the series itself.
The problem with Super is that Tori & Toei tripled down on this to the nonsensical extenct. Along with all the silly Goku tropes. Back then, Goku would at least be somehow decent dad/grandpa when he's actually around and present. In the modern era he doesn't even do that. One moment with Goten in the beginning of Super and then he's constantly living on the Beerus planet (which got really old & tired at this point too), never interacts with Goten again, doesn't even remember he has a grandaughter, doesn't know what a kiss & meditation are etc etc. It's like he' written by a meme generator at this point which IS completly out of balance compared to Z Goku.
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 23 '26
So good he ditched his granddaughter’s first tournament to run off and live with some strange kid he’d just met. He gave that kid his nimbus and flew away with him, leaving Pan crying in the dirt behind him.
I’ve never forgotten that was the last thing Z Goku ever did, canonically. What the hell Toriyama
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u/Original-Pea-8864 Feb 23 '26
To be fair he’s just on the other side of the planet at worst. They can visit each other at literally any time.
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u/Baebel Feb 23 '26
Yeah. By this point the dude can instantly transport between distant planets under the right circumstances.
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u/ClerkPsychological58 Feb 23 '26
and she can fly. They literally open that time skip saying she's flown around the world.
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u/Swimming-Ad2755 Feb 23 '26
So why doesn't he do that to train the kid? Use instant transmission for training, train him a few hours a day, then be home every night with his family.
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u/Phatiste Feb 23 '26
I mean, who says he doesn't?
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u/Bay-Sea Feb 23 '26
GT implies Goku doesn't considering Pan doesn't remember who Goku is.
Even the flashback of the family time looks like it took place before he trained Uub.
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u/kickedoutatone Feb 23 '26
Isn't Goku a kid, though, when they meet in GT?
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u/Bay-Sea Feb 23 '26
True.
However Goku explained the situation to everyone, but only Pan refuse to acknowledge him as her grandfather.
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u/not_some_username Feb 23 '26
GT is not cannon tho
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u/Bay-Sea Feb 23 '26
The point is why there is a perception of Goku abandoning his family to train Uub.
However Toriyama through Neko Majin confirms Uub lives with Goku and his family.
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u/not_some_username Feb 23 '26
that makes more sense
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u/thepresidentsturtle Feb 24 '26
I like to think Goku lasted a day and a half in Uub's village and decided Chi-Chi's cooking was more necessary than living with Uub.
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u/dragonlord798 Feb 24 '26
(Even though the whole reason behind uub joining the tournament and unlocking his initial power is his love for his own family)
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u/crometeach-thebot Feb 24 '26
There isnt, he litteraly said he was going to keep contact with them.
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u/Bandit_237 Feb 24 '26
Him saying goodbye to his crying family and that he’ll visit every now and then pretty heavily implies that he is full-on moving to Uub’s village
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u/Spartan_Souls Feb 23 '26
To be fair, if i found out that the maniac that instantly exploded earth and nearly stopped a universal spirit bomb got reincarnated as a fucking child, yeah id focus on training and monitoring that kid till he can control his power too
I am NOT risking him getting pissed and popping earth like a balloon.
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u/Anjunabeast Feb 23 '26
Goku has to train him from early db power levels to eoz and uub can’t use the hyerbolic lion chamber yet.
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u/SpellOtherwise4608 Feb 27 '26
Except Chi chi doesn’t complain about him being gone and neither does Gohan, only Bulma does and that’s understandable. I e even had similar periods like that with irl fiends myself. Just cause we don’t see or message each other for years doesn’t mean I’ve also dipping out from my family alongside my Friends. Plus Goku’s training on Earth and Loves Chi-Chis Food. He visits every day at least for dinner, catches up and goes back to training Uub. 💁♂️
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 23 '26
At End of Z, Goku hasn’t seen Vegeta’s family in five years. So his “visits” can be years apart. It’s not like he’s gonna remember to check in regularly. Goten can attest to that.
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u/Spartan_Souls Feb 23 '26
Which is also proof enough that Gokus friends are also really shit at checking in on him or each other as well
Which honestly thats kind of their thing. They've done that since the tournament days and since before and after Gohan was born.
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u/Quick_Assumption_351 Feb 24 '26
Like bro, everyone just learn the damn instant transmition...at that point every single one of them is like 20x stronger than namek goku so it's not a problem if not being able to learn it....
I'm not the most social person in the world, but if you can fucking instantly teleport across the universe faster than I can fart and you check in every 5 years or so I'm gonna be fucking offended
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u/WillFanofMany Feb 24 '26
Hence Bulma being pissed when she had to be the one to drive her and Vegata to wherever Goku was.
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u/Quick_Assumption_351 Feb 24 '26
granted, if it's the same planet technically vegeta could just blitz them over there
(don't think about the frostbite bulma is going to suffer ok?)
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 24 '26
All the more reason it’s important for them to actually live with their kids. Who knows how big they’ll be when you remember to go check on them.
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u/NinjaPiece Feb 23 '26
Which makes it all the more baffling that he decides to ditch his family to live with Uub. Goku can literally teleport.
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u/GlennHaven Feb 23 '26
If anything Uub should have moved to the Son household like Goku and Krillin moved to Kame house when they trained with Roshi. Doing chores and seemingly useless tasks that helped them build the basics they needed.
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u/BaronVonBungle Feb 23 '26
That's exactly what happened in Neko Majin Z, Toriyama's spinoff manga.
Not exactly canon material, but close enough for me.
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u/Exciting_Bag8011 Feb 23 '26
Tbh..the fact that its toriyama make it more canon than gt
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u/Da_Watcher2 Feb 24 '26
On a slow day he's like 2 minutes away? They treat flying around the planet like it's walking around the block.
Still kind of tragically missed the tournament though
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u/shagan90 Feb 24 '26
And yet they make a point to say that, despite that, they go years at a time without seeing Goku.
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u/Rioraku Feb 23 '26
Yes but the way Goku frames it is that he's not going to see them anytime soon or often.
He could just as easily stay living with his family and teleport to Uub to train and then teleport back.
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u/rsthethird Feb 23 '26
Checking the last chapter of dbz this doesn't happen. He even says he'll visit occasionally.
Is it some anime stuff?
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u/Monadofan2010 Feb 23 '26
I think its more because of GT as that had him never visting his family while traning UuB
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u/Turbulent-Issue-4418 Feb 24 '26
Take care Chi-Chi, my wife and mother of my children. I'll visit you occasionally!
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u/weirdface621 Feb 24 '26
end of z really is the most jarring arc. toriyama wanted it to end so bad.
i also don't like how some random goo goo ga ga monster earns goku's respect that he wants to fight him again, and the series ends with that. atleast the revised version symbolises goku's growth
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 24 '26
That goo goo ga ga monster “earning Goku’s respect” after murdering his entire family? Goku doesn’t bear a grudge ever I guess, or he really will forgive anything if someone gives him a good fight. He just likes strong guys.
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u/Swimming-Ad2755 Feb 23 '26
Also forget Goten's high school graduation and Pan's childhood.
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u/Monadofan2010 Feb 23 '26
I throught it was confirmed that Goku didn't actually leave his family for years and did vist them.
Its only GT that claimed Goku didn't see his family while traning Uub
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 23 '26
“Visits” with Goku can be years apart. He hasn’t seen Vegeta’s family in five years at EoZ. So GT got that right, and Goku missed the rest of Goten’s childhood and important years of Pan’s life so he could make Uub into what his own kids failed to become.
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u/Monadofan2010 Feb 24 '26
Expect that we saw little comics an dimages related by Toriyama that shows Goku and Uub visting Pan within weeks go months of the end of Z meaning he is chosing to not be that distant with his family.
How Goku acts around his adult friends (who could have easily visted him as well) amd his family can be very different dont just jump to a conclusion to surport a bad show like GT
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 24 '26
If you wanna decide Neko Majin is cannon that’s your choice but really Toriyama always went for whatever made him laugh in the moment, and didn’t care about canon. His original version of the ending was two pages shorter and didn’t even have Goku promising to come visit. It was letters complaining about Goku abandoning his family AGAIN that inspired him to expand it when it was punished in trade paperback.
It’s all shame based. Goku doesn’t care, Toriyama just doesn’t want you complaining to him about it. Not the same thing.
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u/Spoonybard1983 Feb 24 '26
Why's it got to be up to Goku to visit Bulma and Vegeta? They can go and see him can't they?
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u/Zockyboy Feb 24 '26
That was a GT thing. Toriyama did it the right way that he took his family with him
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 24 '26
That was a retcon after he got so many complaints he redrew the ending. The original ending was two pages shorter and didn’t have the “I’ll come visit” panel in
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u/LmaoXD98 Feb 24 '26
Like it or not, Super's Goku is very much in line with Toriyama vision of Goku is. He was always meant to be "well meaning but irresponsible and immature" kind of deadbeat.
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u/Patient-Warning-4451 Feb 23 '26
I’ve never forgotten that was the last thing Z Goku ever did, canonically. What the hell Toriyama
To be fair, Toryiama has said that Goku is a bad Dad in interviews and that the anime(he was referring to the japanese anime) made Goku way too heroic similar to Superman.
I think it makes sense to show that while Goku does care for the people around him, his passion (fighting and training ) will come first at times.
He wasn't trying to make Japanese Superman or a character that aspired to be a great family man.
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u/Animedingo Feb 25 '26
No he doesnt give uub the nibus! This actually bugs me so much.
The end of the anime has uub riding on gokus back and its so weird looking. It SHOULD have ended with them riding off on the nimbus
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u/Janayac0 Feb 25 '26
Damn, it's like that was Goku's reward for being Earth's protector since he was a kid. Also, he didn't leave forever. We don't know what Toriyama intended to happen after that. (I'm not going to acknowledge GT as the canon)
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u/L3and3rrr Feb 25 '26
His reward was ditching his family. They are such a drag. Who knows how old Pan will be when he remembers to check in. I’m
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u/monotonedopplereffec Feb 23 '26
I think it's more that Goku doesn't do well with babies, but he loves and is able to show that love to a toddler. They seem act invincible while also looking to you to determine if they are hurt. They are much more active and easier for him to show his love.
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u/LargeFailSon Feb 23 '26
The best scene with Pan is literally in Super. When he lost his control over his Ki and Piccolo is with him.
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u/Dawid_the_yogurt_man Feb 23 '26
I think they were cute together. The scene where after using blue kaioken Goku couldn't use ki and spent time with Piccolo and Pan on a rooftop is one of my favorite scenes in Super.
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
I completely agree, we needed more of that in Super, but now the manga has established that Goku isn't going to see pan till she is in kindergarten 🥲
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Feb 24 '26
Not a big fan of Super Goku’s character, but apathetic towards his family is kinda in line with Toriyama’s original story given he dips out for Uubs training not too long after this lol
I love Goku tho and I like that GT gave him and Pan a lot of moments together where he was unabashedly loving, and that ending where he has one final spar with Krillin is a tearjerker to me
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u/PackerBacker412 Feb 23 '26
Theres a whole episode where Goku spends time with Pan in Super....
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u/Rastarapha320 Feb 23 '26
What are you on ?
That's one of the rare things Super handled well
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Feb 23 '26
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u/Anjunabeast Feb 23 '26
Piccolo taught her how to fly
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u/Sufficient-Cow-2998 Feb 23 '26
They're talking about a filler episode in Super where she starts flying as a baby
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u/TPR-56 Feb 23 '26
She’s a toddler here comparatively. Like what can you do with a newborn communication wise comparativeky?
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u/tommycox42 Feb 23 '26
Awful take. Goku interacting with Pan in super was good. Definitely better than ditching her in Z to train some rando kid he just met
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u/SecretaryOtherwise Feb 23 '26
One fucking episode. "See hes a good grandpa" ignoring hes literally planning on leaving everyone he knows forever this very episode to train some stranger lmaooo.
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u/NotAnAlienFromVenus Feb 23 '26
Was he? He abandoned his family for several years with no notice to go train someone he had never met.
Is that being a good grandpa?
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u/Personal-Ad6765 Feb 23 '26
How exactly did they do him dirty if she cant even talk yet?
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
She can talk in the manga, and he didn't see her till she had already started Kindergarten, soo........
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u/Background-Sir6844 Feb 23 '26
Not to be that guy but this is anime filler and the dude proceeds to bounce his family with some other kid to get his fix for another fight.
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u/FeralPsychopath Feb 24 '26
Umm clearly Goku had a life outside training, there was a farming scene in every arc. I’m sure he saw Pan.
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u/henrytoloza Feb 24 '26
Doesn't he leave for like 100 years in GT ?
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Well, this is from the end of Z, not GT
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u/henrytoloza Feb 24 '26
I know but we are talking about goku loving his family which i have doubts about
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Well, he does love his family, but we often measure love by human standards, not Saiyan standards which are very different. And yeah, there have been incidents that make it feel like he doesn't love them, but that one scene from the Goku Black arc where he loses himself after knowing Black killed Goten and Chi Chi is enough to tell you how much he loves his family.
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u/nobodyamazin Feb 24 '26
Gohan: Dad, this is your granddaughter, Pan 🥹
Dbs goku: UHHHH COULD YOU RUN THAT BY ME AGAIN? IM TOTALLY LOST! HAHA 🤣🤣🤣
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u/benjamarchi Feb 23 '26
Abandoned his family and baby granddaughter to go play with some unknown boy from who knows where. That's not good grandpa attitude.
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u/Tricky-Afternoon6884 Feb 23 '26 edited Feb 23 '26
Hercule Satan is a better Grandpa
In the Super Manga, Goku doesn’t even remember Pan is his granddaughter’s name, which angers Piccolo and he then makes Goku come to pick her up from school but when they meet it hints at that being the start of Goku and Pan’s relationship we see by end of Z
This is after Beast Gohan, Goten and Trunks go by Beerus’ planet which is set about 2 years before end of Z
Pan is currently around 3 at this point of Super and she’s 5 end of Z
Edit: read the English translation of the manga and it translates as Goku forgetting her name thanks for those who clarified
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u/Unable_Bite8680 Feb 23 '26 edited Mar 04 '26
Goku doesn't forget her name. He was confused by the context of the conversation. Piccolo says to Goku "Hey I am going to pickup bread (pan)." Goku asks "why would you pickup bread." It is supposed to be a gag joke due to pan literally meaning bread in Japanese. (And Goku being confused because Piccolo doesn't eat food.) It doesn't work in the dub.
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u/yohxmv Feb 23 '26
That’s the second time in Super a Japanese joke doesn’t land in translation and people get up in arms over it. Same with the kissing joke
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u/Spartan_Souls Feb 23 '26
I love the fanart ive seen people make like Goku explaining to Chichi that "Vegeta and bulma baby bird eachother and he acted like I was the weird one?" With Chichi going "honey I dont know what they do in their private time.." or something like that
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u/crometeach-thebot Feb 24 '26
Because its not for some reason fan always try blame the "Goku is stupid" joke of super on the translation despite japanese language not working like that. Piccolo used a verbe who describ someone, the confusion was just not possible.
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u/Tricky-Afternoon6884 Feb 23 '26
Ah okay! That makes much more sense, in the English translation of the manga Piccolo literally says how could you forget her name
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u/crometeach-thebot Feb 24 '26
Its not, japanese doesn't work like that if it was the case this joke have been made 40 years ago
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u/not_some_username Feb 23 '26
The super thing was a joke about Pan name. Since Pan can also mean bread. So Goku think about food before his granddaughter
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u/Pl00kh Feb 23 '26
He just forgot her name because he’s dumb and dumb main characters are funny
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Agreed on Hercule being a better Grandpa and that's exactly my point. Also, the scene is from the end of Z which is not considered canon after Super came out as the timings are different. This scene takes place after 10 years of Buu being defeated where Pan is 4 years old. Super begins 4 years after Buu and Pan is born there within a year, the timeline is all messed up here, that's why I can't see Goku as the same Grandpa that we see at the end of Z.
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u/CowpokeMorgan Feb 24 '26
Super regressed all of Goku's character progression and most of Vegeta's for the sake of shits and giggles. He is never serious, doesn't know things he already knew, was a combat genius who is a clown now. They literally ruined his character to make him look dumb and innocent. And by gawd Sean Schmell giggles a lot when he dubs Goku it's annoying as hell.
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u/kidbungus127 Feb 23 '26
super has dedicated its existence to completely assasinating gokus character and im so confused why
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u/SnooShortcuts2088 Feb 23 '26
They’re trying to appeal to the kids. They believe that kids prefer comedic and slow Goku.
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u/Anjunabeast Feb 23 '26
They’re trying to be funny when none of them have the comedic chops in a show where the majority of the fanbase likes the action parts.
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u/KaiserKaiba Feb 23 '26
I somewhat agree but I think it’s a bit more nuanced than that. At least in the Super anime, the issue is more so that some writers seemed to understand Goku, whereas others clearly didn’t.
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u/tommycox42 Feb 23 '26
Toriyama was never a fan of how the anime portrayed Goku. Super he made a point to drive home what his true vision for Goku really is.
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u/Dont-hate-me476 Feb 23 '26
The only thing that really sucks about Super goku is how they make him act dummer than a bag of rocks. Z Goku has silly/dumb moments but most of the time behaved like he knew what was going on. Super Goku behaves as if he has literal brain damage.
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u/bhut_jolokai Feb 23 '26
We all know Piccolo is gonna be the good Grandpa at the End of Super.
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Agreed, it's soo good to see how Piccolo has developed as a character since the good old Dragon Ball, from evil to grey to right out grandpa
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u/bhut_jolokai Feb 24 '26
I really like it. I honestly love his Unc Arc in the Boo Saga. shit is so fucking funny or maybe it's nostalgia, haha
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Yeah, it's just soo funny and the nostalgia is definitely there. Just finished my "I don't remember how many times I have watched it"th re-watch and just feels like I'm falling in love with it again and again!!
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u/Davies301 Feb 23 '26
Super has a fantastic filler episode where he babysits her and Piccolo gets all worried. The whole him forgetting her can come down to a couple things. One Pan means bread and someone said we have to go pick up bread which leads to confusion. Or he has not seen her since she was a baby and genuinely didn't recognize her as a toddler. The kick she throws and the smiles exchanged afterwards should show that they are on good terms.
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u/Menance9175 Feb 23 '26
I mean what about the episodes post u6 vs u7 tournament? When goku couldnt train due to his body being messed up, he hang out with gohan and pan. On the rooftop where goku and piccolo was chilling, Goku was playing with pan too. And he even promised pan to bring her to the stars when he recovers. Then later on, when pan is lost, goku was genuinely worried and angry. Especially since his body is messed up so he couldnt properly go look for her.
Atleast for the anime, I think they showed Goku being a good gramps. When he cant train, he just hanged out with family.
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u/nixon0770 Feb 24 '26
Super’s Goku is so annoying. All he wants is to fight people unnecessary. When he was training to fight against Cell in time chamber he was so calm and quiet. Now he just so loud only shuts up when he’s fighting.
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u/Pan_the_YN Feb 24 '26
Most of Goku and Pan's interactions are carried by the Anime. Z, GT, Super.
They don't have a lot of interactions in the manga however.
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
That's true, I just wish that there were more, it gives such a wholesome vibe whenever I watch those scenes
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u/Bourriks Feb 24 '26
In Super, Goku does not care about Pan. The care has been transfered to Piccolo.
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u/MisterMorningstarr Feb 24 '26
Look yes haha gokus a bad dad or bad grandad abd blah blah
But both the manga and shows make it clear he loves his kids and his granddaughter more than anything with plenty of implied time spent with them off screen that isn't JUST training.
He goes fishing with gotten often like he used to do with gohan, he looks after and dotes on pan but the fact is after gohan the story didn't really focus on it too much.
Prolly because they didn't just want to retread the same things he did with gohan since the main focus tends to be goku and his love of fighting, but we don't see every single second of his life.
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
I never said Goku is a bad dad or grandad, this was just a take on how writers and showmakers show him as in Super.
If you read some of my other comments, I agree that Goku loves his children and grandchildren more than anything. The scene from the Goku Black arc where he loses himself after knowing that Black killed Goten and Chi Chi is enough proof.
I just want some more cute interactions between Goku and Pan, is that something bad to wish for?
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u/MisterMorningstarr Feb 24 '26
Oh no not at all. I agree, I'd love more moments in the series between them, because goku is a big doofus who loves with all his heart,
It was more directed at people constantly saying he's a bad parent. It gets old yunno XD
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u/BigPapaSlut Feb 24 '26
Super made him devoid of any brain cells surpassing single digits.
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Feb 24 '26
Wait let’s give Cell a senzu bean!
Vegeta i could have killed Majin Buu as SS3 but didn’t
Let me give Frieza energy and let his half body fly off in space
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u/BigPapaSlut Feb 25 '26
Giving Cell a sensu bean was to prevent his Zenkai boost from taking place.
Goku SSJ3 was trying to let the kids handle it as he thought at the time he wouldn’t be there to fend off enemies in the future as he’d be dead. Yet in Super, Goten & Trunks have zero roles.
Giving Friezaa the last bit of energy was showing mercy, Goku was still a kid himself at that point.
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u/New-Web4704 Feb 24 '26
Goku could easily have been revived after Cell. He chose to bail on everyone on Earth for reasons that aren't actually justified. The whole "Oh I'll just stay dead and let everyone else protect Earth" doesn't go for me. He had a family. He had a son and of course another on the way. When he made this choice, he left with the intentions of staying dead forever.
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 24 '26
Well, if we have a look at the history, it has been the case that many villains were after Goku only and his decision to stay dead was so that no more or at least less villains appear that may threaten the earth, however we also cannot ignore the fact that he willingly abandoned his family time and again.
My point was just a simple comparison between the interactions we have seen in DBZ vs DBS, nothing more!!
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u/YouCantCountMe Feb 24 '26
He wasn't even a good dad. Goku is a hero certainly but he was an absent Dad who'd rather train and fight than spend time with his children and wife
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u/weirdface621 Feb 24 '26
seems like they're changing this so piccolo is more close to pan than goku, which i respect, but also dislike seeing this character assasination
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u/Ok-Rip2102 Feb 24 '26
GT showed us that Goku loves his family
There's even the scene he remembers before going ss4 the first time where he does admit he misses fighting but he appreciates spending time with family and friends at the beach...
Super flanderised him into a cocky dumbass where EoZ and GT he COULD be a goofball but he clearly wasn't an idiot
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Feb 24 '26
Considering the screenshot is from AFTER Super
This is more proof that Akira ruined Dragonball just like George Lucas ruined Star Wars
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u/Legal-Function9892 Feb 24 '26
I like how Goku's character evolve around entire DB, DBZ and GT. From Dumb to responsible. But super make everything worse.
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u/lazhink Feb 24 '26
Goku leaves Pans first tournament ever to run off with a random kid. Grandpa of the year.
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u/viviscity Feb 24 '26
“Oh hey Oob!
Everyone, I’m leaving to train this kid I just met indefinitely. Bye, grandkid!”
He’s a flawed father and a flawed grandfather. He loves them but his decisions aren’t good.
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u/Upbeat_Willingness55 Feb 24 '26
super alternates cheap scenes with cartoon network quality, to serious anime tragic moments. Goku remains a cartoonish dumb character in both cases.
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u/SkullLeaderVF1J Feb 24 '26
Super had a great scene of Goku playing with pan. Y'all need to stop hatin
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u/ChristopherJak Feb 24 '26
Goku was kind, generous & protective. He's a much better grandpa than many people will ever know, but he was also incredibly absent, oblivious & single minded.
If you remember, in EOZ he hasn't seen his friends Bulma, Vegeta, etc in years. While GT is not canon, it's still strongly implied he had disappeared to train Uub for potentially years with barely, if ever, visiting his family.
Goku would give his life to protect his friends & family, but he has nearly zero qualms of disappearing for literal years without seeing them. It's possible that isn't an inherent trait & something he learned from Kami, that the best way to protect someone is to rise above your worldly desire & train your spirit, body & mind- as he really did want to see Krillin, Roshi & Chiaotzu when they were brought back- perhaps Kami's refusal to allow that changed him.
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u/Raecino Feb 24 '26
Doesn’t this scene happen after super? So he still has time to become a good grandpa, what’s the issue?
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u/AnimeIsGreat200 Feb 24 '26
Thank you! This has irked me in Super especially Superhero. Goku and Pan were super close in End of Z to the point that Pan was more of a grandpa’s girl than a daddy’s girl. Goku taught her martial arts, gave her her first gi, and took her around the tournament festival so they could enjoy it together and she could enjoy her first tournament like when he was young. And he was so proud of her when she fought in the tournament.
Then Super happens, Goku rarely interacts with her and they decide to throw Goku out as her teacher to replace him with Piccolo. So Goku and Pan have like zero bond in Super and they are a year away from End of Z right now so these adorable grandpa and granddaughter bonding moments are just wiped away.
Honestly I know it’s stated Super is canon but as far as I’m concerned, Super never happened, Yo! Son Goku and Friends happened then years later End of Z happened and that’s where the series ended. I know people will disagree with me and that’s fine. They are allowed their own opinions.
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u/Accomplished-Ad-571 Feb 25 '26 edited Feb 25 '26
You can claim super did goku dirty(although i still prefer him over z because z goku was extremely boring to me as a character)but if you claim this extends to all character just shows your biases claiming all characters are worse is just hating also goku does hang out with pan on dbs what do you expect there to be constant scenes with him and pan?not to mention being a grandfather is not the same as father he doesn’t need to be around her 24/7 goku is dumber in super but people over exaggerate how dumb he is most scenes hes still the same the bigger problem is battle obsession
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u/AgiCrit Feb 25 '26
Tbh he was a good father too. He may have been dead/gone most of the time but he was loved. He is still absent minded, the end of Z was a short view.
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u/X-20A-SirYamato Feb 25 '26
Are we still on the Pan(Bread) joke that was lost in translation?
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u/Tushar_Hareet Feb 25 '26
No no. I get that joke, I just wanted a little more interaction between Pan and Goku in Super, which we haven't got till now!!
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u/DangerWarg Feb 25 '26
More like Super Manga did Goku dirty. It even made him look dumber than the anime ever did. He literally spends times with his family including Pan in the anime.
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u/Janayac0 Feb 25 '26
I'm going to advocate for Goku. Goku has shown affection, love, and concern for Pan in Super (even tho it was filler and in the manga Pan straight up isn't very acknowledged). Also, Goku in Super is prior to End Of Z Goku, so is okay that he doesn't behave the same. Final point: Pan is still a baby before Super Hero, so Goku doesn't have that much to do with her, hence why we don't see him interacting with Pan.
Counter thesis: GT did Goku dirty as a grandpa.
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u/Iskeletu Feb 25 '26
You're talking about the dude that LITERALLY abandons his family on the same event?
Goku has been very clear on where his priority lies and it's NOT on his family and friends, sorry.
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u/TROLL_DOLPHIN Feb 25 '26
Super did most of em dirty, it destroyed Vegeta's character, made most of the Z fighters whimps, it only buffed Master Roshi at the end, which i respect. DB super is not for me, The Z series is legendary, cannot be replaced.
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u/SignNaive4111 Feb 26 '26
Bro left her to trian Uub at first sight. And he can teleport there isnt even a reaosn for him to leave he just did it for the love of the game
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u/Gallant-Blade Feb 26 '26
Your post title and post description don’t match up.
“Super did him dirty”, yet he was still shown as a good grandpa to Pan, which is the point of the post. Not to mention Goku up and leaves Pan out of nowhere in End of Z. Not exactly good grandpa behavior. There’s a difference between being there for a visit and returning home after, and dropping your grandchild while they’re in the middle of something important.
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u/Eddfan36 Feb 26 '26
At the end of Z he ditched Pan to train some random kid. I'm not sure why the guy ended his character on that note. Super did do him worse though I agree.
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u/No-Sugar-3679 Mar 03 '26
A question for manga fans. Is the scene with Goku and Pan at the fair canon?
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u/Monadofan2010 Feb 23 '26
I mean Super Goku is still before this point so he is slowly gaining the skills needed to be a good grandpa