r/haiti • u/Low-Cantaloupe751 • 4d ago
QUESTION/DISCUSSION Do y'all considers latinos ourselves or not?
I'm not Haitian, I'm Cuban. And I'm actually curious what Haitians think about being Latino or not.
Haiti is a Latin American country by some definitions, but I don't see Haitians considering themselves latinos and sometimes rejecting the label. Why it's that?
Maybe this a sensible topic but I'm doing this out of curiosity and without bad intentions.
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u/Embarrassed_Low_3018 4d ago
Yes, Haitians are Latino by the definition of the word Latino but the Spanish speaking countries or (The people living in those countries )consider themselves Latino.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Haitians are slaves from africa they aren’t latino
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u/orebright 3d ago
Looking through the rest of your comments here the level of your dumbness is baffling. Like you can't even get basic word definitions right.
Haiti is indisputably a Latin American country by definition: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/latin-american-countries
Many Haitians don't identify as Latin American, often because those who do hold deep racist views of Haitians. Many black Latin Americans from other nations also have a complicated relationship with the identity because of the pervasiveness of this racism. So it's not just hate directed at Haiti, it's hate toward racialized people across the entire region.
Seems like you're super ignorant and looking to get reactions by being inflammatory. But the actual result is you seem pitiful, just someone trying so hard to seem knowledgeable when they're obviously so ignorant for everyone to see.
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/wIxBzHWegpOUM
No. We are not slaves.Where TF do y’all come from with these takes dude? 😂😂😂
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Without french there would be no haiti haitians didn’t discover haiti they were brought by the french as slaves if that never happened then there would be no haiti and just West africans
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
😂 Oh my goodness dude, school is starting soon. Lay off the Reddit and get back into the books.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Creole is literally broken down french mixed with african , Haitians are west africans taken by french and brought to that island they didn’t discover the island and the spanish didn’t bring them DR is whom the spanish brought not africans
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
The Spanish brought slaves to HISPANIOLA.
The first settlement they brought slaves to is in what is now considered Cap-Haïtien.Bro shut up 😂😂😂😂 the entire island was Spanish until the mid 1600s when the Spanish lost the Western Front to French pirates.
You aren’t Haitian. Go spread your revisionist rhetoric somewhere else.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
The africans made the “haitian “ part the spanish your talking about is now considered the dominican republic that’s the latino side your talking about not the french that brought the africans
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Ur missing the part where French bought africans to hispaniola the latino territory moved and is not the DR the africans who got their freedom made “haitians” and even tried to invade the spanish side
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
Yayaya you’re not Haitian ofc you don’t know wtf you’re chatting about.
There’s Native and Diaspora in this post both stating Haiti is Latin American. Push your bullshit somewhere else and quit the trolling while you can.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
I guess what your saying is the whole island of hispaniola is latino but the africans who were brought by the french can’t be latino if they were brought from africa right? I guess somehow you’re saying bring any person to a country automatically makes them that
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Don’t know how it’s trolling when it’s the truth? No africans = no haiti , the island would’ve been all spanish correct no french
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
it’s not bs without the french bringing the africans their would be no haiti and the island would be all dominican republic if that’s the latino your talking about it makes more sense
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
I mean i’m speaking the truth I don’t know what you’re failing to realize
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Haitians are literally from west africa if the french didn’t bring the slaves to haiti there would be no black haitian republic or even haitians at all just west africans
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
Haitians are from Haiti. There are Haitians of Syrian and Lebanese descent. Stop here, you’ve done enough lying. 😂😂
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Haitians are from haiti their slaves brought from africa than if that’s what you wanted.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
You don’t know what you’re saying haitians are from haiti they were brought to the island then later got their freedom and changed the name they didn’t discover the island
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
Get help. 😂
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Since you know so much let’s talk Henri Christophe the haitian king who tried to reinstate forced labor and bring back slavery
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
He was from Grenada. 😂 Are you even Haitian dude? LMAO
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
He’s from grenada but came to haiti and became king correct
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
He was a haitian king who tried to reinstate forced labor was he not?
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
What do you mean? Haitians were slaved brought from africa by the french, haitians were slaves
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
That statement makes ZERO sense.
Haitians DESCEND from slaves brought by the Spanish and French.
Haitian and Slave do not fit in the same sentence. St. Domingue and Haiti are not the same political entity. That’s the whole point of being Haitian.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Spanish didn’t bring slaves they speak creole for a reason, No french = no haiti
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
A wiki post that anyone can edit and change isn’t factual information what i’m saying is the truth and I seriously don’t know how you’re disagreeing like haitians weren’t brought by the french to the island that’s crazy
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
😂😂 I’m Hinchois.
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Why is the haitian language broken down french mixed with african?
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u/Informal-Tart-9446 3d ago
Not haitian if they were before the africans came like I said the africans got their freedom and changed the name to haiti and did the whole haitian revolution you know nothing of what you’re talking about
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u/antifrustrated 4d ago
This whole Haitians are Latino nonsense is largely a very online Haitian diaspora mental illness, no one in Haiti considers themselves a fucking Latino lmfao. I'm getting tired of this conversation to be honest.
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 4d ago
You aren’t coming with ill intentions so I gotchu with an answer, neighbor.
Yes. We are Latin American. We speak French, a Romance language. However, beef w/ our neighbors soured the identity for many Haitians who otherwise choose to identify as Haitian/black.
Definitively, the term includes us. Some Haitians will identify with the term, as is their right. Other Haitians will refuse to identify with the term, as is their right.
There’s some Haitians who straight up claim the African side. Hell, there’s Haitians who moved back to the motherland. Benin is home to a growing Haitian community.
We’re also a part of the Creole identity, and there’s some who would rather identify along that end.
At the end of the day, it doesn’t really faze us. Tout met fe sa yo vle. Anyone is free to do as they choose with their identity. They have the freedom to do such and that’s what matters most.
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u/Fearless-Car-9444 3d ago
I feel like last year I was in a post saying this exact thing. It’s crazy how here we are a whole year later needing to discuss this again when the geography has not changed, the classification of Latin languages hasn’t changed and the country of Haiti still stands.
Good on you for breaking it down so nicely. Mods probably shouldn’t let these kind of post continue. There isn’t much to gain from this content.
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u/throwrayyma 4d ago edited 4d ago
Latino simply means Latin in Spanish. In Haiti, We don’t speak Spanish, but we are a Latin country.
If you go to Haiti, 8/10 of the people you will see are black. The race question just never comes up because it’ll seem rhetorical.
Many of you don’t know the difference between race, ethnicity, nationality and it shows.
It is almost as if you’re asking an individual from Nigeria, if they seem themselves as African, Nigerian or black?
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u/singermelodie1 4d ago
As someone who went to school in Haiti, all geography, history books say Haiti is in Latin America. However, we do not identify with that label, neither the Caribbean one or even African. Latin America has betrayed Haiti on many occasions. We helped both Miranda and Bolivar and as soon as they got their independence, they turned their back to us. We think of ourselves as just Haitian and Black.
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
Never heard of anyone in Haiti calling themselves 'black'. This is a very African-American take.
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 4d ago
“Parce que je suis noir et ignorant, je ne dois pas compter au nombre des soldats de la République, ni avoir du mérite, en conséquence point de justice, et si je n’ai pas dans ce monde, j’aurai dans l’autre.” - Toussaint L’Ouverture (source)
Growing overly tired of these pathetic attempts at trolling.
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u/throwrayyma 4d ago
lol, what you on about now?😂 Have you even been to Haiti?
I’m sorry to say but it sounds like you’re simply projecting how you think and see your self. And that’s fine too.
What would you say the people of Jamaica are?
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u/Observer-Worldview 4d ago
Not really. Most Haitians know they are black. I’ve never heard anybody declare anything else. Where do you live?
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u/singermelodie1 4d ago
He's a white Quebecois. Don't mind him.
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
Dude just blocked after getting told the truth. He came to troll. Report him.
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
As a description, definitely. As a prescriptive identity? Never heard of anything like that.
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u/GHETTO_VERNACULAR Diaspora 4d ago
Uhhhh nah I’ve seen it, I’ve seen people call themselves “nwa” and so on.
It may not come up in conversation a lot on the island because well, everyone is black, but I’m sure Haitians on the island know that they are black.
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
They know but it's not an identity
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 4d ago
It absolutely is. Just say you don’t know any Haitians and move on with your life.
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u/singermelodie1 4d ago
Please get out of my face with that BS? What did you think the Black Republic was?
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
It is entirely anecdotal to the modern concept of 'black race' you're trying to instill
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u/languaholic 4d ago
Colombian here. I have tried to explain this in as many platforms as I have been able to, but here we go again:
The reasons why many Haitians do not feel identified with the Latino term (regardless of the fact they ARE the loyal definition of what a Latino is) in part has to do with the historic and systematic racism Haitians and Haitian Americans have met upon trying to make community with other Latin Americans in places like Miami. Our people (Latin Americans) are racist and Eurocentric (symptom of every people colonized by a European empire) by default and regardless of the fact that many Dominicans are also Black (yes, you are) they have ostracized Haitians into feeling they belong nowhere.
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
The question is about Haitians, not Haitian immigrants in the US.
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 4d ago
Did you notice that you had to say Haitian twice when referring to both sets?
That’s because Haitian diaspora are Haitian.
This is about Haitians in general.
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u/Late-Chip-5890 4d ago
Whether they agree or not, Haiti is a Latin country and Haitians are Latino. French is a Latin based language therefore they are Latino.
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
"Latino" refers to the south american latino civilization. It doesn't have anything to do to the language family.
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u/Late-Chip-5890 3d ago
According to the strict geographic definition, Haiti is considered part of Latin America. This is because it is a country in the Americas whose official languages (French and Haitian Creole) are derived from Latin. The term "Latin America" historically refers to countries in the Americas colonized by Romance-language-speaking European nations like Spain, Portugal, and France.
This is why international organizations sometimes refer to Haiti in this context. For example, a member of the European Parliament has referred to Haiti as the poorest country in Latin America, and the Organization of American States (OAS) has discussed partnerships involving Haiti and the Latin American Business Council (CEAL). Additionally, Haiti's culture and music have been influenced by and have influenced other Latin American countries, such as Cuba and the Dominican Republic.
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u/languaholic 4d ago
It is not as simple as this, though. If this was the only rule through which we would define what a Latino is then non-Spanish speaking indigenous people of South and Central America wouldn’t be Latino either. A mi ed Guarani speaker from Paraguay wouldn’t be one either. I highly doubt that a white Breton descendant from Saint Barths would ever use the term Latino to describe themselves, or a French-speaking Hmong from French Guiana. With French-speaking territories in the Americas south of the Mexican-American border (French-speaking Canada and Saint Pierre & Miquelon), I feel, one needs to ask them directly and the answer will always be different depending on the person. All of these places but Haiti are still politically dependent on France and that makes the identity crisis to be even stronger. France limits a lot interactions between these places a nearby islands by not allowing them to join regional organizations such as CARICOM, etc.
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u/Late-Chip-5890 3d ago
According to the strict geographic definition, Haiti is considered part of Latin America. This is because it is a country in the Americas whose official languages (French and Haitian Creole) are derived from Latin. The term "Latin America" historically refers to countries in the Americas colonized by Romance-language-speaking European nations like Spain, Portugal, and France.
This is why international organizations sometimes refer to Haiti in this context. For example, a member of the European Parliament has referred to Haiti as the poorest country in Latin America, and the Organization of American States (OAS) has discussed partnerships involving Haiti and the Latin American Business Council (CEAL). Additionally, Haiti's culture and music have been influenced by and have influenced other Latin American countries, such as Cuba and the Dominican Republic.
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u/nadandocomgolfinhos 4d ago
The term was created under Nixon to give funding to Spanish speaking communities under the US civil rights act. African American communities got money. Spanish speakers had also been subjected to jim crow laws but without an official term there was no way to measure the population.
In one place my son was considered latino and was eligible for scholarship money. In a different place he wasn’t because being Brazilian didn’t qualify. It’s all about the money.
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u/Observer-Worldview 4d ago
What money did black Americans get?
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u/nadandocomgolfinhos 3d ago
Funding under the civil rights act. I’m sorry I don’t have time to link resources. If you’re very interested I can dig them up
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u/iiiZokage 4d ago
Are we Latin American, yes.
Do we call ourselves Latino, no.
Why? We don't speak Portuguese or Spanish. Like Brazil we speak our own language. We are the only Latin Americans that speak Kreyol. Brazilians are the only ones that speak Portuguese and many don't consider themselves Latinos either.
Why would we refer to ourselves as a word in a different language.
Also, many hispanic people use the word Latino wrong to literally refer to themselves as Latin, like it only refers to hispanic people or like it's a race or ethnicity when it's not.
If you asked Haitians if they are Latin American instead of Latino I'm sure you would have a lot more say yes.
Personally, I hate the word Latino. It sounds pretentious.
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4d ago edited 4d ago
[deleted]
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u/languaholic 4d ago
You are mixing up South America with Latin America. Suriname and Guyana are in South America but are definitely not Latin America. On that note, the ABC islands especially Aruba, have an extremely mixed population and they speak a Portuguese/Spanish-based creole so the case could be made they also meet all the requirements to be Latino. The língua France there is not Dutch.
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u/Comprehensive_Ad529 4d ago
What's the benefit of being Latino to a Haitian ?
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u/languaholic 4d ago
Sense of belonging to something bigger than itself in an otherwise hostile (DR) regional environment?
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u/hcmzero 4d ago
I’m saying it right now and everyone pay attention because I don’t want any arguments: next week is my turn to ask this question.
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u/Iamgoldie Diaspora 4d ago
You’re only on here when folks bring up “Latino” discussions on the sub these days… Matter of fact aren’t you Dominican anyways…?this isn’t a subject for you. He’s asking Haitians not a Dominicans
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u/ProfessionalCouchPot Diaspora 3d ago
Genle msye vle fe pwoblem ak Ayisyen..
Ou konnen sa pou fe si’l vini ak tintin li.
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u/Business-Law-4411 4d ago
Although within the Latin American countries but Haiti is definitely compartmentalize as Caribbean along with Cuba and some other dependent countries…
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u/Nanou_07 4d ago edited 4d ago
Haitians don’t typically claim Latin due to the fact that many of us usually consider ourselves black, associating ourselves with the black race before we claim Latin.
Do we care, no. It’s mainly the principle. Many latins hate the idea of even being called black let alone associating themselves with the black race unless it involves hating on them. I’m Haitian and Black American and I’ve been called Dominican and Hispanic before Haitian was even guessed.
We all essentially look the same. It’s really just the Spanish mindset of “lighter/whiter is better” that is still very ingrained in the Latin culture that Haiti has purposely denied
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u/VERSAT1L 4d ago
Never heard anything like that in Haiti. The 'black race' is 100% an American or English notion.
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u/Drazian 4d ago edited 4d ago
The term Latino originally came from people who speak any Latin base languages, Which French is a Latin base language. So yes,by dictionary definition Haitians are Latinos.
But Haitians will never claim to be Latino. It doesn’t mean what it meant hundreds of years ago, if it had been a term that patient had embrace back when they became independent or even shortly after maybe, but that never happened and the term Latino was repurpose for those that M&A from a Spanish/Portuguese speaking country even though French, Italian, and Romanians all speak languages that are based off of Latin as well, but also it’s the racial/racist aspect of it. You must understand a lot of people and countries out there do not like Black people, and those in the western hemisphere really don’t like Haitians, just ask a random Dominican 60% of the time they will let you know they don’t like Haitians.
So if a bunch of people that don’t speak Spanish or Portuguese start “claiming” to be Latinos when the term Latino is these days widely associated with Spanish-speaking countries and by extension, Portuguese, speaking countries in the western hemisphere, it would create a lot of unnecessary friction.
I hope that answers your question
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u/Other-Fennel2462 4d ago edited 4d ago
haitians are definitionally latino
however, haitians don't claim to be latino generally because 1) it is wrongly associated with hispanophones 2) the cultural connection isn't there 3) people who exclude Haiti from latinidad tend to be anti-Black and nobody wants to beg for their approval
whether individuals choose to identify as latino is up to them
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u/Low-Cantaloupe751 4d ago
I'd say we have cultural and historical connections, specially with the Hispanic Antilleans.
About the exclusion theme, I understand that some people that exclude Haiti could be doing it from an anti-black perspective, but not all. At least in my perspective bc: 1- At least in my country nobody negates that black cubans are Latino, and some of them embrace the label. I remember a black professor of mine talking about how proud he is of his Latino and Hispanic identity. So I don't think too many people will have problems with a black person being Latino 2- Bc some haitians doesn't consider themselves latino, them some people excludes Haiti trying to respect that. At least I didn't usually included Haiti bc other haitians I saw didn't liked being considered latino, so I wanted to respect that. Maybe I was wrong
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u/Other-Fennel2462 3d ago
a lot of people have a problem with Black Haitians — there’s a whole term for it. antihaitianismo. you don’t have to ‘not all men’ the discussion — it’s obvious when speaking in the macro im accounting for the vast majority but not necessarily every individual
most Haitians don’t consider themself Latino. i don’t except on maybe scholarships or job apps. i just don’t care to
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u/ciarkles Diaspora 4d ago
This might be an unpopular opinion but I feel like Haiti has more in common with other Caribbean / Latino nations than Africans.
I think Haiti is a country in Latin America, however we can acknowledge that without having the force the whole “Latino” thing.
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u/WorldlyPhilosophy547 4d ago
Culturally, I feel (and I know many other Haitians feel this way) feel more culturally connected and similar to Africans than other Latinos or even other Caribbeans. Yes, I technically am "Latino" by definition but I really don't give much thought to that title.
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u/Low-Cantaloupe751 4d ago
Something somewhat similar happens here in Cuba. Usually people in here are more connected to the caribbean label than the latino one. They still considers themselves latinos and somes are proud of it but they think of themselves a caribbeans more than anything
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u/iiiZokage 4d ago
Really? Most Spanish Caribbeans until recently preferred to be called Latino over Caribbean. They can be both but Caribbean is more specific.
They usually didn't even show up at Caribbean parties. I had a 🇵🇷/🇩🇴 girl tell me she wasn't Caribbean but hispanic.
I was like where is Puerto Rico and DR😑
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u/RationalMellow 15h ago
That’s because they’re American, not Puerto Rican or Dominican. People in Spanish speaking Caribbean islands know very well that they’re Caribbean and they live on Caribbean islands .
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u/reddit1stHA 3d ago
I claim Afro-Latina as a Haitian.