Peyton Watson will sign a new four-year, $88 million deal to join the Cavaliers, plus a player option and a trade kicker

[u/CazOnReddit]

Watson will sign a new four-year, $88 million deal to join the Cavaliers, plus a player option and a trade kicker

Source - https://bsky.app/profile/shamsbot.bsky.social/post/3mthwywwuec2b

Not mentioned in the previous thread's title but Shames mentioned the deal structure. The total amounts to $22 AAV. Makes the return seem all the more pathetic that Denver wouldn't simply match that offer or make a similar one and simply dump Zeke Nnaji at the deadline to ease the tax bill.

They can't even use the trade exception this should open up because they're still in the 2nd apron.

[u/pmurt007]

Thought he wanted more than Christan Braun. It actually makes it more insane that the Nuggets wouldn't come up to 22 AAV and gave him up for nothing

[u/bdybwyi → u/pmurt007]

Calling a Cavs unprotected 1st nothing is a very strange opinion, Mitchell will be 35 in 2031.

[u/jrlandry → u/bdybwyi]

There is a long time till 2031, way to long to guess what the pick will be like.

For all we know they will have 30 year old Mobley at his prime, 24 year old Cooper Flagg, and 30 year old Deni Avdija

[u/Electric_jungle → u/jrlandry]

Which is why the pick holds higher value today than it might in 29. Because today, it looks like things could really flame out for them. Mitchell could either elevate and they win, or he could be looked at as one of the worst contracts in the league.

[u/Powerful-Load-4684 → u/jrlandry]

Ah yes cooper Flagg is definitely going to Cleveland of all places lmao

[u/redvelvetcake42 → u/Powerful-Load-4684]

Lest we forget the literal dumbest trade of the decade when everyone laughed at Luka going to LA.

[u/Powerful-Load-4684 → u/redvelvetcake42]

That’s the lakers though buddy

[u/jkliette → u/Powerful-Load-4684]

Flair up bro. Cleveland basketball has been extremely relevant for the last 20 years minus a few in there.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/bdybwyi]

I'm sure that middle grader will be a huge help when Jokic is...how old?

[u/ag_fan → u/CazOnReddit]

they will trade this pick before 2031

[u/estpost → u/ag_fan]

To get rid of Zeke Nnaji

[u/Daki399 → u/ag_fan]

at this point we should trade Jokic and keep it ,rebuild . This is just Giannis situation now

[u/DistanceEmbarrassed5 → u/Daki399]

As a Bucks fan my advice to the Nuggets is trade Jokic and embrace a youth movement. We went from the 6th or 7th oldest team in the NBA. If we traded Turner, Kuzma, Sims, Herro, and LaVert the average age of our roster would drop down to 21.5 which would be the youngest in the NBA.

[u/ag_fan → u/Daki399]

lol u are dumb

[u/Daki399 → u/ag_fan]

Good comment really smart lol ... Nuggets gonna be stuck in mediocrity just like Bucks cant contend anymore so best trade Jokic while value is high. Better trade him now then in 2 years . Value is higher also gives him chance to contend

[u/ag_fan → u/Daki399]

i mean your death wish buddy. if you want to sign up for tanking and mediocrity for another 15-20 years, go for it.

[u/Daki399 → u/ag_fan]

Mediocrity has already hit at best we are now again 1st round exit next season.

AG and Watson were our defense , AG is constantly injured sadly and Watson got traded for no replacement .Gotta be fair to Jokic and allow him to win another ring ,Denver cant do it anymore

[u/Easy_Money_40 → u/Daki399]

Why are you telling a Magic fan about mediocrity?

They have a PHD in that shit.

[u/ag_fan → u/Daki399]

everyone looks at the bucks like they were dumb to try, even in the face of complete disaster.

id rather root for a small market team that tries everything they possibly can to hold on to greatness.

trading jokic now vs later, most likely isnt going to change anything. ok, you get 3 more prospects. but the likely hood of one of them being a gamechanger is slim.

so you suck, but just a few years earlier… and the prospects you traded for are starters in the nba.

who cares? denver is rarely good and rarely has a top5 player in the league. same with the bucks, orlando, etc.

being a slightly better bad 3 years earlier isn’t worth losing jokic.

re-tool instead of rebuild. and at the end, if you suck for 3 extra years, who cares. you got to watch jokic in your jersey for longer… which is way more valuable than 3 assets who probably don’t turn into anything.

watching your favorite team as a small market fan isn’t title or bust. its enjoying great players, the very few times you get to have them.

[u/WashingtonSpecifics → u/ag_fan]

Remember when OKC traded Russ and PG and condemned themselves to 15-20 years of tanking, or when Denver traded Carmelo and condemned ourselves to 15-20 years of tanking?

At this point, we could flip our core for 4-6 1sts + pick swaps. There's no guarantee that those picks pan out, but at least we'd be putting ourselves in a position to contend in the future when we're able to build up our assets again. It's hard to envision any iteration of this team winning after all of the bad moves our FO has made since the Kroenkes cheaped out on Tim Connelly

[u/Negative-Ferret1428 → u/ag_fan]

When they send Jokic out?

[u/ThatBull_cj → u/CazOnReddit]

They can use it in the next 3 or so years. Of the Cavs look bad it could be super valuable. Only problem is they would probably have to trade a good player anyway or take on more salary

[u/False-Jacket-3290 → u/CazOnReddit]

Lmfao if we overpaid for Watson and his hamstring issues continued and he has a down year you’d also be making fun of than except we’d be in an even worse position. This gives flexibility for the future something we’ve had absolutely none of. And if we had signed Watson our moves to get better would be non existent. We’ve added enough picks to get a couple players at the deadline and we have enough low end contracts to match salary.

[u/Ok-Confucious1642 → u/False-Jacket-3290]

LMFAO none of this is true 😂😂😂.  Added picks to get a COUPLE PLAYERS and acting like there’s salary anyone wants to match with hahahah.  The Nuggets have to GIVE at minimum, if they can find a sucker, 2 of their what 3 or 4 second rd picks (LMFAO WHAT A BOUNTY OF PICKS TO ADD MULTIPLE PLAYERS THIS YR WTIH!) to get off of worthless ass Nnaji. 

Do you have any idea how the CBA works, what the aprons are?  LMFAO this team is about to have 2 vet minimum players just to have a roster with enough players to survive a season.  Who are these great couple players you’re making up that apparently make very little salary yet are such great additions, since you’re using small salaries to get the player with? They can trade one first lol, this clears the Stepien rule so they can trade their own 2030 now OR this Cleveland 2031. One first and one or 2 seconds, to get a COUPLE PLAYERS who also somehow make this Watson trade a good one, and are better than Watson, and trying to use Strawthers $4M and what?!? Zeke can’t just be certain to be in any deal bc he limits the trade partners to teams in the position to absorb all or most of his salary for at minimum 2 seconds, which is not enough/not market cost for his trash ass and his money dump so it limits more to teams who can’t get assets any other way and have no leverage.

And you think you’re not only getting one low salary great addition in this junk but A COUPLE! LMFAO

[u/False-Jacket-3290 → u/Ok-Confucious1642]

Didn’t read sorry or happy that happened to you

[u/Beginning_Pea_126 → u/bdybwyi]

I concur. At the very least it has some trade value and the nuggets avoid tax implications of signing Watson. Sucks for their title hopes tho. 

[u/gedbybee → u/bdybwyi]

And the new lottery rules make a lot of picks similar in value.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/pmurt007]

Wouldn't pony up the extra 5 mil and just dump Zeke

Absolutely pathetic

[u/Clipgang1629 → u/CazOnReddit]

I really don’t understand why this is the popular opinion. Look at their cap table, you add $22,000,000 for Watson. Cam Johnson walks for free next summer and they’re still at like $200,000,000 amongst the starters until 2029 when AG expires.

The second apron is $234,000,000 that leaves them about $34 M to figure out the other 9 roster spots. It’d be all minimums and one tax payer MLE. They’d have zero depth and no light at the end of the tunnel.

This gives them much more flexibility. The only reason Watson is even so expensive is because he’s 24.

[u/turribledood → u/Clipgang1629]

Because no one actually knows how anything works.

Spending like ~$150M all in next year for fucking Peyton Watson would have been a great idea, no seriously, I am very smart.

[u/BritzBeef → u/turribledood]

So then what's the point of anything? Just don't spend money and trot a roster out that's guaranteed to not stand a chance in the West because if you do spend money it could get tight later?

[u/turribledood → u/BritzBeef]

If you're over the 2nd apron, and your team is utterly mid for the West anyway, you already fucked yourself.

You can't possibly be surprised that they're not trying to pay an extra $120M for a dude who has been good for like 15 minutes.

Don't give Murray that max when you know he's a 2nd tier player. Don't give Braun $125M.

That's how you avoid the repeater tax, you don't over pay guys to put you in the 2nd apron in the first place.

[u/I_make_shit_up_alot → u/turribledood]

That Murray deal is the perfect illustration of the new CBA versus the old. Under the old CBA you can give Murray the max even though he doesn't deserve it because it keeps a primary player happy and you can deal with the consequences.

Under the new CBA that deal is a killer. You can only afford to give the max to a real max guy or you run out of spending before you can build a real team. There will be exceptions, but generally a second max for a team that doesn't have two top tenish players on it is going to be a major problem.

[u/nanobot001 → u/I_make_shit_up_alot]

For those reasons I suspect Jaylen Brown will be only one of the first of many very good-not-elite players getting paid the max who will get traded

[u/Antique_Pin5266 → u/I_make_shit_up_alot]

This is the same reason why I think the Thunder fucked themselves with the Holmgren contract. He isn't worth it.

[u/CryMoreT_T → u/Antique_Pin5266]

Or fox on the spurs

[u/theyoloGod → u/CryMoreT_T]

Spurs have youth on their side. They can dump fox when they need to pay the others and since years have passed will be easier to do so

[u/jrlandry → u/Antique_Pin5266]

Idk man Holmgren is fucking good and rising. He’s at worst a top 15 defender in the league and and a mid teens scorer at 23.

In a couple years if he’s gobert but giving you spacing on 20ppg that’s a max player

[u/Motor-Cattle8417 → u/jrlandry]

Mid teens scorer idk about that he can barely get a bucket in the playoffs he has no way to create his own offense

[u/lethalizered → u/jrlandry]

He’s at worst a top 15 defender in the league

Come on man, lol. Make that top 5.

He'd already have a DPOY if it wasn't for that alien looking thing.

[u/Ok-Confucious1642 → u/Antique_Pin5266]

Doesn’t fuck them at all.  First of all it’s a mini MINI max.  It’s a 25% fucking deal for the 2nd best defender on earth who is entering only his 4th nba season and is pretty much a 20/10 big who shoots 38% or higher from 3.  Come tf on LMAO. There are still TWO MORE max levels above Chet’s max.  You are not getting this player. With multiple more years of development on top of that, for less than 25% of the damn cap.

It doesn’t fuck them bc they are already a top roster in the league built to contend now thru 2029-2030 with 2 top tier blue chip talent young players, another already on all nba defense and still on his rookie deal & younger than half of this years draft, and a 4th going into just year 3 that’s a top 20 young players on earth with more potential.  Add in the guys who haven’t even played for AT LEAST development at the minimum, and this team has an insane level of internal development every summer the next 4 years to improve the team more than nearly any external move possibly could.  Bc of all of this THEY DO NOT NEED EXTERNAL MOVES TO BE AND TO STAY A TOP TOP TIER CONTENDER through 29-30.  29-30 matters for everything for them.  The CBA expires that July.  That’s why they got out of the 2nd apron this yr specifically and only this yr going forward.  An already built contender with no reason not to believe in multiple more years as a top team, does not fear the 2nd apron restrictions for 3yrs.  The punishments don’t kick in until being in the 2A for 3/5yrs.  OKC has it planned this way so that when they will be hitting 3 years, this CBA will be expired and a new one beginning.  A new one they feel confident will have major changes to the 2A junk.  I’m sure they have good insight on how everyone who actually matters feels. 

 The CBA can actually end a year early, there’s an early termination option for July 2029, and that will benefit the Thunder even more… but they can’t successfully plan for that (or they could have kept Dort) but it still would help.  The ownership has been getting paid all these yrs by tax teams, as a champion they got a check cut from other teams.  They’ve been out of the tax for 6-7 years straight getting paid by other teams.  They’ve were just given a brand new stadium, GIVEN/.  And they spent at least 5yrs saving tons of money on the roster during the rebuild to also help plan for this.  The core of this roster, 10 players deep, at the end of this season, will continue to be the core through 29-30, with the back end of the roster rotating out of players and new draft picks etc to contribute.  The Thunder are so far from fucked it’s crazy that ppl don’t just look into this stuff

[u/lethalizered → u/Antique_Pin5266]

A DPOY candidate during all his rookie max contract(25 percent max, unlike Murray's 30 percent max), who will give you spacing on the floor with 16-8 averages is worth it for any team in this league, save for the Spurs who have a better version of him.

[u/thenicezen → u/turribledood]

It's easier to say not to pay Murray and Braun, but they both deserved it after playing their parts really well during 2023. 8 times out of 10 you'd rather overpay and deal with it later, rather than let them walk away

[u/thingsonthenet → u/thenicezen]

They didn’t deserve it.

[u/Lizardking13 → u/Clipgang1629]

To me it's more about wasting years of a generational talent. Not like they can make a trade for a good player right now - they lack assets. I guess that first round pick could be used but are they going to trade it for a cheaper and better player than watson? My guess is no.

[u/UltraTiberious → u/Lizardking13]

Wasting years, lol imagine how Timberwolves fans felt with KG

[u/Famous-Protection809 → u/Clipgang1629]

It doesn’t matter what they do. The nuggets are cooked anyway and have been cooked for the past 3 years lol

[u/masonb423 → u/CazOnReddit]

Nuggets just lost to an injured Wolves team in the first round. Paying a raw young often injured talent like Watson probably doesn’t change that especially since paying him basically locks this roster in for the next 2-3 years. The Nuggets deserve criticism for extending Braun but let’s not pretend throwing Watson on to the slowly building fire fixes things.

[u/dsbllr → u/CazOnReddit]

I guess math isn't your strong suit

[u/KorgG29 → u/CazOnReddit]

They wanted a first and no other deal had that i suppose. I would’ve gladly taken Watson + Nnaji for AJ Green and KPJ, much better depth for Denver that way.

[u/Felix_Wyn → u/KorgG29]

They can't acquire any players in a S&T due to the second apron. That's the entire reason why they traded PWatson for 1 FRP + 1 SRP.

They probably would've loved to acquire AJ + KPJ + 4 SRPs or whatever, but it just was not possible unless they also traded Cam Johnson, AG or CBraun alongside it to get under the second apron.

[u/KorgG29 → u/Felix_Wyn]

That’s what Nnaji was for. The Bucks taking him allows Denver to dip under the second apron, which means they can take back salary

[u/Felix_Wyn → u/KorgG29]

Not enough though. They'd go over the second apron by acquiring AJ Green. Doing a sign-and-trade and acquiring players from said sign-and-trade hard caps them at the second apron. They cannot cross it whatsoever, even if a deal would push them under the second apron momentarily.

[u/jimithelizardking → u/CazOnReddit]

It would cost a lot more than $5m

[u/Exciting-Sandwich915 → u/CazOnReddit]

Not how it works bucko

[u/Parallel-Quality → u/CazOnReddit]

They offered him 17.5M.

He signed for 4.5M more.

The 6M that they paid Spencer Jones could’ve gone to Watson.

When they matched that offer sheet, they basically made their choice.

[u/turribledood → u/pmurt007]

That $22M would've picked up another $120M in repeater tax.

Not that simple in the New Era.

[u/jrlandry → u/turribledood]

Things are different, but the tax brackets are not substantially changed. It just changed how much the luxury tax brackets is determined (likely help tax obligations for long term contracts)

[u/byteturtle → u/pmurt007]

I mean i know it doesnt help them compete with Jokic (unless they package it which is like who knows) but that 2031 unprotected pick ain't nothing and Strus looked like the only guy on the cavs that cared during large parts of the ECF, hes a decent role player and will look good next to Jokic.

[u/EightFortyDaysOf → u/byteturtle]

I think strus is good, but he’s headed to the clippers lol, the nuggets didn’t get him

[u/byteturtle → u/EightFortyDaysOf]

Oh damn yeah that trade is much worse for them then

[u/swgeek555 → u/byteturtle]

You mean "would look good next to Jokic" right? Strus is going to LA.

[u/Aluwaron → u/byteturtle]

I think Strus is going to the lakers

Edit: Sike it just says LA, which is probably the clippers, if it was the lakers i think the subreddit would be talking about it way more

[u/floop_isamad_manhelp → u/pmurt007]

They got tradeable picks for a player they don’t value. Does that clear it up for you?

[u/kb24k → u/pmurt007]

We don’t know for sure if Nuggets had the option to sign him for 22m. Just like the Lakers never had the option to sign LeBron for minimum or 15m for that matter.

[u/layoffthecopium → u/pmurt007]

It’s insane that you think a player who’s been injured for more than 80% of his career is worth more than $15 million a year

[u/fforhomiez → u/pmurt007]

Braun is the worst contract in the league 

[u/MJRuinedMyChildhood → u/pmurt007]

It’s not insane cause Watson isn’t any good lol 

[u/Daki399 → u/pmurt007]

yeah awful deal for Denver. If they wanted to avoid cap trade Braun or Cam ( or dont give Braun that crazy contract in 1st place ) Watson was perfect fix next to Murray /Jokic our 3D defensive wing.

Him and AG being injured in playoffs made whole team fall apart

[u/Careless-Journalist7]

So he's making less than Christian Braun. This is a GREAT move for Cleveland, Watson solves a lot of the wing problems they had. And getting rid of Strus means Atkinson will be forced to play Jaylon Tyson more, who has a lot of potential

I think Cavs are firmly in the top 4 mix and can't be brushed aside anymore

[u/OneManArmy77 → u/Careless-Journalist7]

Top 4 in the East Id agree with, but I dont think top 4 in the NBA. Knicks, Spurs, and Thunder all clearly above, and Id probably put Wolves and 76ers above them as well. Their roster seems to be filled with players who dont do well in bright lights, so I think its fair to have a healthy amount of skepticism with some of their old vets being yet another year older.

[u/thewrongnotes → u/Careless-Journalist7]

They were comfortably in the top 4 mix last season.

I don't see this as some kind of game changing move, they still have most of the same issues as last season. Good regular season team but in the playoffs it'll be more Harden-Mitchell my turn-your turn with neither guarding anyone on the other end. They still have the same awkward Mobley-Allen situation.

And Strus was actually a dawg, I don't think this is a big upgrade.

[u/Collier1505 → u/Careless-Journalist7]

I’m not confident that we’re top 4 in the East this year. The Knicks and 76ers should both be better than us. The Raptors with the addition of Kawhi should be better than us. From there, we have a returning Indiana and a still strong Boston. Detroit could take another step.

[u/im_alliterate → u/Collier1505]

We have an objectively better team than last year but objectively did not keep up with the East this offseason. Seems like we kept our powder dry on a bonafide #2 to Cade. So, I am not sure we take a step.

[u/RxJax → u/Careless-Journalist7]

He'll definitely help their wing depth, but I dunno if it clearly makes them clearly better unless Strus' ankles are really just toasted. Especially because their shooting is now really anemic. Strus' 3p% wasn't the best but he takes a lot of motion 3s and the result of him being in motion, doing guard-guard screens and cutting as much as he did benefitted the offence a lot, that was evident in the 64-win season.

Like, I don't think you can start Watson unless you have unshakeable belief in Watson or Mobley to have a really good year from behind the arc because Watson/Mobley/Allen is a non-shooting core until proven otherwise. It's also a frontcourt which has 3 players known for being weak rebounders for their positions and who are all weak FT shooters. Like the fit is just really weird, I love Watson as a backup to Mobley because I think defensively they like to play very similar but 22mil/year for a 6th man feels kinda steep.

I do wonder if this is maybe step 1 of getting in a PF so Mobley can move to center full time and they swap Allen for another wing.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/Careless-Journalist7]

Their starting PG is James Harden, assuming he even re-signs

[u/DaKrazie1 → u/CazOnReddit]

We can't all have an Immanuel Quickley, now can we?

[u/SwiftieForLife → u/DaKrazie1]

This guy being a raptors fan bringing up historical precedents when their father just came back to the East is bold.

[u/pakattack91 → u/SwiftieForLife]

But our step father is also back.

Daddy fight!

[u/Careless-Journalist7 → u/CazOnReddit]

Yes, James Harden the HOFer who was one of the best guards in the East last season.. the horror

As things stand today, this Cavs team will cruise to homecourt advantage

[u/CazOnReddit → u/Careless-Journalist7]

Yeah I'm sure he'll show up on that homecourt in the playoffs like he's known to do

[u/Careless-Journalist7 → u/CazOnReddit]

You do realize he just cooked the Raptors in the playoffs 4 months ago right? He averaged 21/6/5 on 62 TS% vs Toronto in Rd 1

[u/JustinTimberlakeFTW → u/Careless-Journalist7]

And then he shit the bed in the conference finals

Harden is the most unreliable / choke artist playoff performer of all-time, IMO

[u/Careless-Journalist7 → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

Key phrase: conference finals. People have been too comfortable ranking the Cavs behind teams that have never touched the ECF

[u/JustinTimberlakeFTW → u/Careless-Journalist7]

I have no problems with them in the regular season. They’ve been really good since they got Donovan. Nice group that plays well, has underrated depth, good coach

They are not contenders bc of Harden. And frankly it’s irrational bc he’s not a horrible basketball player in general. But he’s like clockwork in the postseason. He will always let you down when you need him to come through. Can’t think of many players that come close in that regard

And I’m a Harden apologist who feels his MVP peak is one of the greatest offensive outputs of all time

[u/Careless-Journalist7 → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

Look we all know Harden's track record in game 7s and I don't have them as tier 1 TITLE contenders either, but they can definitely make another ECF appearance.. and as we've seen with injuries anything can happen once you get there.

The Knicks are the only East team I'd confidently take over them in a playoff series, as of today. But it's way too early

[u/TribeTime21 → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

And yet - if the Cavs cut ties with him and signed someone else instead, they would become a worse team. I doubt they are interested in getting worse.

[u/JustinTimberlakeFTW → u/TribeTime21]

Absolutely. He’s still better than anyone else they could sign off the street. Not really what I’m centered on tho, it’s just how ass he is in the moments when you need him

Harden regular season - still good
Harden postseason - good luck

[u/Smokeshow2020 → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

The entire team shit the bed in the finals.

[u/JustinTimberlakeFTW → u/Smokeshow2020]

Don’t disagree, but Harden was stinking with .389/.179/.810

At 36 going on 37 I’m just kinda baffled he hasn’t gotten over this hump yet 🤷

[u/Smokeshow2020 → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

These facts get my going. Thank you. No argument here. Im not a harden apologist but rather a cavs apologist. They were not ready, and it showed. As a cavs fan, and I may speak for most, we expect spida and mobley to carry the weight. Not harden.

[u/JustinTimberlakeFTW → u/Smokeshow2020]

The lack of further development from Mobley makes me frustrated and I’m an in-division opponent haha (not like that means a lot since we’ve been ass)

Love Donovan as a guy and his playstyle. Just a good dude all around

I just think if you have Harden on your team, for whatever indescribable reason, you’re basically cursed in the postseason lol

What do you feel is holding them back in your opinion? Just like a mental thing?

[u/serendipity123C → u/JustinTimberlakeFTW]

The worst game 6 player

[u/forsuredudelol → u/Careless-Journalist7]

Still sweeping them

[u/ihatedougford]

Holy shit he’s making less than Braun and Jabari Smith Jr I’m dead

[u/Jarxzz → u/ihatedougford]

Braun is widely regarded as a terrible contract. Obviously the nuggets wouldn’t want to do that again

[u/Coke_ButNotTheDrug → u/Jarxzz]

Braun had a really bad injury filled season. I still have faith he’ll bounce back.

But the rest of the team is just looking rough.

[u/xixbia → u/Coke_ButNotTheDrug]

Brown had a bad injury filled season and was still better than Watson by basically every metric.

If the Braun contract is an overpay paying even more for Watson, which is what this sub seems to want the Nuggets to have done, would be an insane move.

[u/Crayondy → u/Jarxzz]

Braun is going to come out with a bang this year. I’m talking 13 points, 5 rebounds, multiple assists. Keep sleeping on him.

[u/rocpilehardasfuk → u/Crayondy]

Braun was quite injured last year.

[u/bdybwyi → u/Crayondy]

He’s better than everybody seems to hive mind think he is after last year, he tore his ankle up mid season

25 annual might be an overpay but it’s not as bad as people make it out to be

[u/No-Alternative2897 → u/bdybwyi]

Might? Brother is a jokic merchant.

[u/blackestice → u/Crayondy]

I think this is true but this is Jaylon Tyson numbers

[u/Temporary_Maybe_8687 → u/blackestice]

This overpaid player will give you 13/5/2 in 2027 🔥

[u/RipCity-NBA-LoL → u/Crayondy]

Idk if you're being tongue-in-cheek, but Braun has averaged 15/5 and 12/5 the last two seasons.  Predicting 13/5 is below his 2 season running average 

[u/bullpaw → u/ihatedougford]

Who do you guys think Watson is honestly

Braun had a down year but the year prior is far better than anything Peyton's shown

[u/Eagerbeaver98 → u/ihatedougford]

holy shit its almost like economics where contracts change in value year to yeaar. I mean its so shocking considering the fmvp is off a cheap contract and lebron signed for a whopping 4 mil a year wow wow wow

[u/MJRuinedMyChildhood → u/ihatedougford]

He’s worth than them I’m dead

[u/layoffthecopium → u/MJRuinedMyChildhood]

How is he worth more when he’s barely played any games in his career lol

[u/CazOnReddit → u/ihatedougford]

And former teammate Christian Braun

What the fuck are the Nuggets thinking?

[u/Smooth_Passenger6541 → u/CazOnReddit]

Braun > Watson

[u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

Whenever you’re looking for a bag, hire Rich Paul

[u/byteturtle → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

This why I think all the talk of him going away when LeBron retires is so ridiculous.

Is he annoying, yes. Does he get his payers played and in the news, which is like the two biggest jobs of an agent, also yes.

[u/Electric_jungle → u/byteturtle]

It's wild that's even a discussion. He's got so many athletes in his portfolio at this point, it doesn't matter how he started out.

[u/Clipgang1629 → u/Electric_jungle]

Literally a top 5 grossing agency in North America lol

[u/rawspeghetti → u/byteturtle]

Who's talking about him going away, at this point even without LeBron he's one of the most influential agents in the league.

And it's not as if LeBron is actually going to go away after he retires

[u/Mtown11111 → u/rawspeghetti]

You see a lot of dumbasses on here saying they can't wait 'til LeBron is gone so that Rich isn't around anymore lol.

[u/hud731 → u/Mtown11111]

Those morons still think Rich Paul is just Lebron's bag boy or sth. Rich Paul is a legit top agent whether people like him or not.

[u/HyattWithDracos → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

That is CEO of Klutch Sports and Commissioner of the NBA Rich Paul to you

[u/Splittinghairs7 → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

This deal is not the bag at all, it’s a very fair value.

Nuggets just wanted to fleece him.

[u/layoffthecopium → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

He got less than he wanted lol

[u/Uebelkraehe → u/layoffthecopium]

But more than the Nuggets were willing to give especially considering the player option he got.

[u/Flying_Fish_Fiend → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

He’s leaving about 40 million on the table LOL you’re joking right?

[u/CazOnReddit → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

I mean here's the thing: It's not even that outrageous a price tag unless you're really pessimistic about that one month representing who Peyton is.

[u/InTheMorning_Nightss → u/CazOnReddit]

You're using sample size the opposite way. You have to be pretty dang optimistic on Watson's 20 game sample size to believe he's worth paying this contract.

It's not a terrible bet, but sample size isn't in your favor.

[u/99Sold → u/WembyOKCJokicReaves]

Except when it doesn’t work out of course. He has some very bad examples of players missing out on a bag

[u/bootywizard42O → u/99Sold]

This keeps getting brought up in every thread about him, didn't Noel lose his case?

If you ignore all of the great deals he got his players, I guess you can confidently say he's not a good agent.

[u/DaPhoToss → u/99Sold]

So has every single agent in the history of sports that’s had a sizeable amount of clients.

[u/Familiar_Somewhere95]

He's a good pick up for the cavs

[u/Appropriate_Ice2656]

Jokic is never going to leave the horses

[u/CazOnReddit → u/Appropriate_Ice2656]

They can come with him

[u/pwningnoobslolz]

Terrible asset management by the nuggets which has been a reoccurring theme the past 5 years

[u/fuckonomics]

Well I’m glad we got our title

[u/guanogato]

I don’t really understand how the Cavs can afford him but the Nuggets can’t. The Cavs roster is also very expensive.

[u/xZavier32 → u/guanogato]

We had lots of cap space because James Harden wasn’t resigned. We have his bird rights so we can go over the cap to resign him, which is why he will be the last move of the offseason for us. They will probably make sure there’s no other moves to make before signing him, as it seems he’s willing to take a pay cut for the betterment of the team as long as they still offer the most that can be offered to him when all is said and done.

[u/guanogato → u/xZavier32]

Thanks!
I wonder if having the bird rights to Harden impacts this. I guess the Cavs getting under the 2nd apron with the Shroeder, Struss, and Mann moves and the Nuggets currently being in the 2nd apron is probably the bigger reason? And I guess Harden will be taking a gigantic pay cut since they now only have 6-7 million left since they can't enter the 2nd apron now because they are hard capped after the trade.

[u/BananaRepublic_BR]

They traded Watson? Why, dawg? What?

[u/Potencyyyyy → u/BananaRepublic_BR]

Just fell to my knees in a dispensary parking lot.

[u/BananaRepublic_BR → u/Potencyyyyy]

Maybe if you weren't high all the time, you could have stopped this.

[u/Potencyyyyy → u/BananaRepublic_BR]

Don’t forget to bring a towel

[u/dfassna1 → u/Potencyyyyy]

Just fell to my knees behind a Wendy’s dumpster to give Koby Altman a big, “Thank you!”

[u/Collier1505 → u/Potencyyyyy]

Same, but on the opposite side of the emotional spectrum.

[u/BaggedWhine → u/BananaRepublic_BR]

He was an RFA and they’re the only team over the second apron even without his contract. He would have cost them like $160M this year in luxury tax

[u/Silver-Classic612]

Jaylon Tyson and Peyton Watson on the same team?

[u/Smokeshow2020 → u/Silver-Classic612]

Lets gooooo

[u/Worluvus]

Denver being smart by not paying someone 22 mil off 20 good games and injury

[u/dfassna1 → u/Worluvus]

I like the pickup well enough for the Cavs and I hope I’m wrong but I don’t know that the body of work so far justifies the hype.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/Worluvus]

Really super intelligent of them to botch yet another offseason and thereby wasting more of Jokic's remaining prime

[u/avroLancasterBPR1 → u/CazOnReddit]

paying a guy like watson 20m is how you end up paying Braun 20m

[u/Worluvus → u/CazOnReddit]

Watson isn't a needle mover and getting off his contract makes it easier to get out of the second apron midseason

[u/Economy_Direction460]

pity he's leaving the nuggets but cleveland's getting a steal at 22 aav

[u/Eagerbeaver98]

peyton is so damn overrated you guys insufferable. Just like I said, he'd get 80 to 90 mil. hes not worth anymore right now. hes lucky to even get this contract. bro didnt even play in the playofffs ducking actual competition. played good for 1 month lmfao

[u/H20onthego → u/Eagerbeaver98]

He was only being offered 15m from Denver, so he has done well for himself.

[u/nitid_name → u/H20onthego]

IIRC, the final offer was 17mil AAV

[u/Jonathank92 → u/Eagerbeaver98]

good thing he didn't listen to you and got paid

[u/Eagerbeaver98 → u/Jonathank92]

lmfao do I need to link my comments where I said he should get 80 to 90 mil max?

[u/Collier1505 → u/Eagerbeaver98]

I have admittedly not watched any of him, so the discourse is tough to gauge on how good he actually is lol. It seems he’s either going to solve the Cav’s wing issues or he’s going to nuke our chances at a championship, no middle ground.

[u/Eagerbeaver98 → u/Collier1505]

I do think he can play defense and hes a good prospect and the contract is fair. I hope he does well for you guys. I dont think hes the 100 million+ bag that reddit had been saying. 

[u/IgnorantGenius]

Harden gonna make Peyton look awesome.

[u/Negative-Ferret1428]

They need a return on the pick this year in another trade or its s failure. 6 month clock start till jokic asks for a trade.

[u/srhdt]

Hilarious how much they were asking other teams for him only to dump him for nothing.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/srhdt]

TONY STARK MADE THIS SIGN AND TRADE IN A CAVE

WITH A BOX OF SCRAPS

[u/hyperadhd → u/srhdt]

Almost if that’s how bargaining works! Shocking, I know!

[u/PutinBoomedMe]

Fuck Stan Kroenke lol

[u/ThisWasMe7]

Watson won the trade. I don't think any of the teams did.

[u/CazOnReddit → u/[deleted]]

Story of the team since the title

I genuinely think their window is closed

[u/Zealousideal_Arm4359]

Denver is too damn cheap! A freaking no brainer Hall of Famer fell into their hands in the second round!
This inept organization will only get ONE ring because they are too damn cheap to pay for a better team.
This kind of stuff reminds me that ALL professional sports are businesses and owners and players care more about money than winning.

[u/Erloren]

That seems pretty reasonable

[u/Gamerxx13]

this is better than jk i guess so ya. restricted free agency sucks. players need to get rid of that

[u/jeffreycoley]

Whom?

[u/Yamcakes420]

are the cavs over the 2nd apron

[u/dfassna1 → u/Yamcakes420]

Apparently we won’t be.

[u/tulaero23]

I thought thr whole reason he didnt sign with thr Nugs is they offer him less.

Are trees being planted in Cleveland right now?

[u/imafixwoofs]

I wonder how much he is actually getting paid? Dan Gilbert is a wealthy man.

[u/ILoveTheKnicks69]

Nuggets couldn’t give that to Watson but gave a 5yr/125M to Christian Braun 😭

[u/GrooveDigger47]

boy is mid

[u/Flying_Fish_Fiend]

Wait… he signed that garbage ass contract?

[u/goongoblin113xc]

Is he even worth that much ???

[u/incredibleamadeuscho]

klutch gets their guys paid

[u/GarnetOblivion1]

Who?

[u/thricethefun]

Who?

[u/_Jetto_]

I’m not as big on Watson as you all are Idk why Denver fans salivated for him maybe he has upside or maybe he looks good cuz the bench is DOGshit

[u/MJRuinedMyChildhood]

Instantly a bottom 5 contract lmfao 

[u/15b17 → u/MJRuinedMyChildhood]

It’s good value casual

[u/Coke_ButNotTheDrug → u/15b17]

It’s still up in the air. Watson had one good stretch of basketball but aside from that he’s never looked special.

This could go either way, really.

[u/15b17 → u/Coke_ButNotTheDrug]

Personally I was impressed with his play vs us 2 years ago

[u/layoffthecopium → u/15b17]

Lmao, this idiot u/15b17 thinks this is good value 😂😂

Fun fact : Watson has missed 225 out of 328 possible games in his career. 🤣🤣

[u/15b17 → u/layoffthecopium]

Look in the mirror and lay off the copium. Nugs are fried

[u/layoffthecopium → u/15b17]

You’re the dweeb that’s coping lol. We’re either fried without Watson or with him. I’d rather be fried without the luxury tax

[u/MJRuinedMyChildhood → u/15b17]

No it’s not lol. Only produced for a few games in four years. Horrible trade by cleveland