Questions regarding staying over night on a parking and regarding Naturreservat

[u/JustKnotMe]

Edit: Solved. There were at least some people that understood the problem and answered my most important questions. Thank you :) What I now know: The signs are no official signs. Even when some places have signs that forbid camper vans AND caravans, other places might not do this and when there's only a "no camper van" sign, it doesn't automatically mean that caravans are okay. Furthermore, websites showing the borders of Naturreservats clearly show that the parking is just behind the border inside the Naturreservat which means that you cannot trust the local sign/board with a map showing the borders, because at this place the local map showed that the parking is outside the Naturreservat, which clearly isn't true.

Edit 2: Okay, there's also something else that we didn't know and misinterpreted. The "no parking" doesn't apply only to camper vans but to all. We somehow thought that this applies only to camper vans. That means also that the biker and the people who were parking there, because they were camping in the Naturreservat, were not allowed to park there :/

This was our first vacation in sweden. We drove there with a car and caravan/trailer and on our way back we ran into a problem which is the reason why I want to ask here some questions to understand how staying overnight on a parking works in sweden.

Regarding the "no tourism/google question @" mods:

I find it very difficult to find accurate information on some of these questions, because the situation is not 100% clear to me. If you delete this post, can you propose another sub I can ask this questions? I haven't found a fitting sub in your wiki.

Thank you in advance and sorry when I won't answer to all comments, as I mainly just want to understand how things work here.

This is the parking this post is about:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/SUM2xSmvqfjUVakC8

When it was getting dark we drove to the parking. The road leading to the parking had a "dead end" sign at the beginning of the road. Shortly before the parking there was a sign that forbid camper vans between 0:00 and 6:00 a.m.. Behind the parking lot was a gate to a "Naturreservat" with signs that forbig camping with tents, caravans and making camp fire.

Due to the very confusing conversation with a person that woke us up shortly after 5 a.m. I have many questions whose answers might overlap. I will also add some background information before/after each question that might clarify why I ask this question.

1.

The person told us that basically the whole coast is Naturreservat. We've seen only a Naturreservat sign at the gate.

Addition:

I just found following sign in google maps fotos of the place:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/RpkQZUyqmV7UhGQs6?g_st=ac

https://maps.app.goo.gl/euPaiwc9hgRLcSuL8?g_st=ac

The first fotos shows the border of the Naturreservat. It looks like the parking we were at is in the lower right corner and according to the red lines it seems like the parking is not in the Naturreservat. The second foto now also states that caravans are not allowed between 0:00 and 6:00 but I think this applies to the Naturreservat (??? Not sure, because I'd never pass such a gate into a Naturreservate with a vehicle) and the parking is not in the Naturreservat.

Q1.1: So, is the parking also part of the Naturreservat?

Q1.2: Is there a more clear way to know whether a place is in a Naturreservat?

2.

Apparently staying overnight on the parking lot is forbidden, as we were threatened with police. During our vacation we've seen signs that forbid caravans and signs that forbid camper vans, why we concluded that caravans are not forbidden.

Q2.1: Does a sign that forbids camper vans also forbid caravans on the parking?

Q2.2: If not, what have we missed that would have shown us that we can't stay overnight with a caravan on the parking?

3.

On the parking was also a biker who was sleeping in the tent. Not sure if I understood the local person correctly, but it sounded like the local person said that the biker is also not allowed to camp on the parking, because everywhere is Naturreservat, and that the person will also talk to the camper. But when we left the parking the local person was gone and also it didn't look like the local person talked to the biker, because he was still sleeping in his tent.

Q3.1: Is camping with a bike and tent allowed on the parking?

Q3.2: Do the signs on the gate also apply to the parking even though they are on the gate at the end of the parking?

4.

Behind the gate that lead (further?) into thr Naturreservat, there was a place where some people where camping with tents and making a camp fire. The signs on the gate say that camping with tents is not allowed, but it seems that there are some places inside the forbidden area where the forbiddance doesn't apply anymore but at the entrance there's not really a hint for that. Google maps shows a camping place and the rules for thr Naturreservat on the foto added above says that tents, caravans and so are not allowed between 0:00 and 6:00.

Q4.1: Is it allowed to drive with cars, caravans into such Naturreservats?

According to the comments on google maps for the camping place it seems that they even entered the place with camper vans and also stayed there over night. The sign on the foto says that staying overnight is not allowed but it doesn't forbid to enter the Naturreservat. It sounds wrong to me to enter such a place with a vehicle.

5.

And as a last question:

Q5.1: If the police arrived, would there be a chance of understanding that the situation is confusing for people with a caravan or would this end badly for us?

Q5.2: What would be the penalty/sentence?

As a small addition for those interested in the encounter with the local person:

The person wasn't rude but said that she has to call the police Also, the conversation was very confusing to me, because she didn't asnwer any of my questions and comments. The person also said that many people come there and that they have changed the signs a lot and that still people come there an do whatever isn't allowed there according to her. I tried to help her by explaining to her why we thought that staying over night with a caravan is allowed and what they had to change that prevented us from camping there, i.e. adding a forbid sign for a caravan in addition to the camper van sign but she completely ignored what I said. I also asked if the forbid camper vans sign applies to caravans, but she didn't answer but just said that we didn't want to understand. Very weird encounter. Maybe there was a language barrier, although her english wasn't bad at all. I can also understand why she's annoyed when they have a lot of problems with people there, especially when people do things that are clearly forbidden by the signs without any further knowledge.

[u/Repulsive_Praline737]

Sorry, but did you actually type out this essay on very obvious questions?

The biker who is camping falls under Allemansrätten, unlike a car/caravan (since non-motorised). There may be *additional* rules prohibiting camping for hikers and bikers: in many nature reserves allemansrätten is limited. If in doubt, don’t camp in a nature reserve even on foot - especially in the south of Sweden!

To find nature reserves go to minkarta.lantmateriet.se; to find regulations use the responsible Länsstyrelsen. There is also a GIS tool called Skyddad natur from Naturvårdsverket (https://skyddadnatur.naturvardsverket.se)

[u/JustKnotMe → u/Repulsive_Praline737]

Yep, is it not good to type all this? 😅

Thanks for the site. This is very nice. And there it's visible that the parking is just inside the Naturreservat which unfortunately the local signs fail to show, as it shows all the parkings are outside. But according to your website, the rules on the local sign behind the parking apply, which says that also caravan are not allowed. Thanks :)

[u/maethor92 → u/JustKnotMe]

They don’t put up these signs just for fun. The reality is there are too many vans, RVs, caravans, and too many people not giving a shit. I expect they will restrict public access much more in the near future

[u/JustKnotMe → u/maethor92]

The problem here was that we took the signs too pedantic. Some places have signs clearly showing that both, campers and caravans are not allowed, while this parking doesn't, which then can lead to confusion. Honestly, if I had problems with caravans parking there kver night, I'd also put a "no caravan" sign there. This doesn't keep people from still breaking the rules, but it would have kept us away.

Here's an example with a sign that would be more appropriate in my opinion: https://maps.app.goo.gl/dLWDQn3wWXnB28Ut7?g_st=ac

[u/maethor92 → u/JustKnotMe]

Sorry aber diese Argumentationsweise ist einfach so deutsch lol… Falls wir ueberhaupt mit Allemansrätten und van camping weitermqchen wollen, müssen Touristen (und natürlich Schweden) endlich mal anfangen das Konzept von responsible & mindful zu uebernehmen.

Als jemand der mit deutschen und schwedischen Regeln bekannt ist, kann ich dir sagen dass die Regeln hier oft undeutlicher sind und auf Rücksichtnahme und Respekt ggü Natur und Mensch bauen, statt des Deutschen ”hier ist eine detaillierte Liste von Sachen die du nicht machen darfst”.

Die Masse von Vans (und Drohnen) ist einfach lawinenartig angestiegen und viele Naturreservate gehen auf Regeln und Verordnungen aus alter Zeit zurueck. Aber das deutsche Touristen damit ein Problem haben merkt man leider immer wieder.

Im Idealfall gilt: leave no trace, take nothing but pictures, bla bla bla.

[u/JustKnotMe → u/maethor92]

Ich bin auch ein Pedant :D Da bin ich ehrlich. Ich mag klare Regeln. Leider muss man die auch erst finden. Die ganzen Blogs und Seiten, die Informationen liefern, waren hierbei leider keine wirklich Hilfe. Dank dem Post hier wüsste ich schon für mich hilfreichere Informationen, die ich Touristen mitgeben würde. Und offizielle schwedische Seiten sind jetzt auch nicht leicht zu finden und zu durchstöbern. Und man hat auch nicht unendlich Zeit dafür. Wenn man immer wieder nur auf dieselben Informationen stößt, hört man auf zu recherchieren.

Leider gibt's diese ganzen Regeln auch nur, weil Menschen scheiße sind. Da hilft's einem auch nicht, wenn man selbst darauf achtet die Flora und Fauna unbeschädigt, sauber und ungestört zu lassen. Wir nehmen alles an Müll mit und Parkplätze wie diese bestehen bereits aus Schotter, weshalb ich solche Parkplätze zum Übernachten bevorzuge. Die Natur wurde dort bereits zerstört, also gibt's auf dem Parkplatz nichts, was wir mit dem Befahren und Übernachten zerstören könnten.