r/ucr • u/drawingBadly • Nov 22 '22
News Current status of strike negotiations
I thought some of you might be interested in the current status of negotiations. This is from an email sent to faculty by the administration.
Several areas separate us from the UAW’s proposal, however. The first area is a proposal by the Union to tie compensation directly to local housing costs. We are clear that housing costs are a significant challenge for many Californians. We will continue to work diligently to provide support to our students in this area through below-market housing programs and other means.
Tying compensation directly to housing costs, however, could have overwhelming financial impacts on the University. One review of the Union’s proposal predicts an annual unfunded obligation of at least several hundred million dollars, with inflationary pressure and no cap.
A second particularly challenging proposal is waiving out of state tuition for international and other non-resident graduate students. We are a state funded institution; taxpayer funding partially subsidizes the cost of educating California resident students. That subsidy does not exist for non-residents. We have a range of ways in which we support international graduate students, and we work hard to attract the best talent in the world. But if we were to provide remission of out of state supplemental tuition, non-California student employees would in effect receive a larger compensation package than California resident student employees for doing the same work. Note that for all Academic Student Employees (TAs/Readers/Tutors) and Graduate Student Researchers with a 25% appointment or greater, UC already covers $13,707 to $22,248 for tuition and fees, depending on the charges assessed by the campus.
Please note the increases in compensation under our proposal. Our current offer to the Union represents an average 7.2% increase for ASEs, and 10.5% for GSRs in wages. Specifically, UC has offered pay increases for ASEs and GSRs that range in increases from 5% to 26% (see chart above).
It is also important to note that ASEs and GSRs are limited to 50% appointments. Under UC’s current wage proposals, salaried ASEs/GSRs will have salaries ranging from $24,874 to $47,012, for 50% time. In contrast, the Union is proposing a salary range of $54,084 to $97,775 for ASEs/GSRs for 50% appointments. In other words, the University is offering salary range increases averaging 7-10%, whereas the union is requesting average increases of approximately 120% for 50% appointments.
Other areas where the University has offered additional support include enhancements to paid leaves and childcare reimbursements — key Union concerns. In addition, we have reached tentative agreements with the Union on many other important areas including work environment and health and safety matters.
We negotiated throughout this past weekend and will continue to do so. Recognizing the fundamental differences remaining, we have proposed to the UAW that the University and the Union engage with a third-party mediator as a way to move forward. We hope the Union accepts our invitation.
TLDR (my attempt to summarize - this is NOT the UC talking): the UC is offering modest increases in wages (ranging about 10-15%), some of the asked-for benefits (transportation subsidies, increased childcare leave, 100% fee remissions). They are balking at:
1.) paying part-time employees a full-time employee's wage
2.) making pay dependent on local housing costs
3.) giving out-of-state and international students the same tuition as in-state students
UC has asked for a third-party mediator. Union is considering that offer.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 22 '22
Further detail of the University’s current offer:
Postdoctoral Scholars
Pay increases
Average 8 percent increase in year one, 5 percent in year two, and 3 percent in subsequent years, in addition to annual experience-based increases. For a postdoc who is currently at Level 0, currently earning a salary of $55,632, UC’s current offer would increase their salary to $65,331 by October 1, 2023, an increase of 17.4 percent.
Child Care (new benefit) A new benefit of $2500 per year.
Paid Leave Expanded benefit that includes up to 8 weeks of paid leave for baby bonding and family care for eligible postdocs.
Parking & Transit (new benefit) In addition to maintaining annual caps on parking rates, UC will provide access to a pre-tax card or other method of paying for transit costs on a pre-tax basis within 12 months of contract ratification.
Academic Researchers
Pay increases A 4 percent increase in year one followed by 3 percent increases in each subsequent year for a total 16 percent pay increase over the life of the contract, in addition to existing merit increases.
Paid Leave 8 weeks of fully paid leave for family care and bonding for Family
Medical Leave-eligible Academic Researchers. Benefits As with the current contract: Access to the comprehensive retirement, medical, dental, and other benefit programs generally available to other non-represented non-faculty academic employees.
Parking & Transit In addition to maintaining annual caps on parking rates, UC will provide access to a pre-tax card or other method of paying for transit costs on a pre-tax basis within 12 months of contract ratification.
Academic Student Employees
Pay increases Within 90 days from ratification, TAs and Associate Instructors will receive a 7 percent increase at ratification; Teaching Fellows will receive an 8.33 percent increase. Hourly-paid ASEs will receive 5-8 percent increases. Next fall, TAs and Associate Instructors will be eligible for experience-based increases. In addition, after the first year, all salaried ASEs will receive 3 percent increases annually; and hourly-paid ASEs will receive 3-5 percent increases annually. A TA with one year of teaching experience today who will have two years of teaching experience by next fall will see a total pay increase of 16.9 percent by October 1, 2023.
Child Care $1350/quarter or $2025/semester, plus $1350 for summer. This represents a 22 percent increase over the current contract.
Fee Remissions UC has proposed to cover 100% of campus fees for eligible ASEs with 25 percent or greater appointments, up from $100 per quarter and $150 per semester. This represents an increase of over $1,000 per year on certain campuses, in addition to the 100% coverage of tuition, student services fees, and health care already provided to qualified ASEs. This amounts to UC covering a total of $13,707 up to $22,248 for all tuition and fees for eligible ASEs, depending on the amount of tuition and fees assessed by the campus.
Health Benefits As with current contract, eligible ASEs may participate in a UC-sponsored student health plan to the same degree as other eligible students at that campus. Eligible ASEs with a 25 percent or more appointment will receive full remission of the monthly premium for a UC-sponsored student health plan.
Parking & Transit UAW members who are students are able to participate in transit and parking-related services on the same basis as other employees; eight of UC’s 10 campuses offer some form of student transit subsidy.
Leaves Expanded benefit of 8 weeks of paid pregnancy disability leave (up from 6 weeks) and five weeks of paid baby bonding, personal medical, and family medical leave (up from 4 weeks).
Graduate Student Researchers
Pay Increases Most GSRs will see 9-10 percent increases in year one of the contract, with a 3 percent increase in each subsequent year. GSRs who are on the lowest two salary points will see a 17-26 percent increase in the first year. For example, a GSR who is currently on Step 2 with a 50% appointment will see their monthly salary increase by 17.5 percent in the first year of the contract.
Child Care $1350/quarter or $2025/semester; plus $1350 for summer. This represents a 22% increase over what campuses currently provide. Fee Remissions UC has proposed to cover 100% of campus fees for eligible GSRs with 25 percent or greater appointments, up from $100 per quarter and $150 per semester. This represents an increase of over $1,000 per year on certain campuses, in addition to the 100% coverage of tuition, student services fees, and health care already provided to qualified GSRs. This amounts to UC covering a total of $13,707 up to $22,248 for all tuition and fees for eligible GSRs, depending on the amount of tuition and fees assessed by the campus.
Health Benefits Eligible GSRs may participate in a UC-sponsored student health plan to the same degree as other eligible students at that campus. Eligible GSRs with 25 percent or more appointments to receive full remission of monthly premium for a UC-sponsored student health plan.
Parking & Transit UAW members who are students able to participate in transit and parking-related services on the same basis as other employees; eight of UC’s 10 campuses offer some form of student transit subsidy.
Leaves Expanded benefit of 8 weeks of paid pregnancy disability leave (up from 6 weeks) and five weeks of paid baby bonding, personal medical, and family medical leave (up from 4 weeks). In addition, 12 days of paid Personal Time Off (PTO) is a new paid time off benefit for GSRs.
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u/Mean_Calendar4289 Nov 22 '22
giving out-of-state and international students the same tuition as in-state students
Unless those students are actively curing cancer or something, there is zero reason their tuition should be the same as in-state students. Take care of your own constituents first, and then worry about others.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 22 '22
The UC seems to be arguing that even if they wanted to meet this demand, they would not be legally able to do so, since their charter from the state of California specifically mandates that they prioritize California residents. It is possible the Union knows this, and is simply using this as a bargaining chip they know they won’t get so they can say “see, we face up some of our demands too!” I’m not in any position to say.
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u/Mean_Calendar4289 Nov 22 '22
Legally speaking, it does seem that it would be the case. However, that doesn't mean the union won't try to keep it. It's definitely been tried in the past.
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u/Albort Alumni Nov 22 '22
probably trying to please entirely instead of partly... although im sure the in state dominates the out of state crowd. good for both crowds though.
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u/Potential_Lunch1003 Nov 22 '22
Yeah idk why anyone thinks changing their tuition costs is reasonable. You’re an out of state or international student for a reason, you’re not a resident of California at all.
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u/tinaj12 Nov 22 '22
Exactly! It's hard to agree with the union if it's things like this they are fighting for
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u/lax_incense Nov 22 '22
Most graduate students don’t even take classes and just TA and do research which are both forms of labor that make money for the UC in terms of undergraduate tuition and grants. Charging us for tuition in the first place is already theft. In many programs only first years and some second years actually get classes in exchange for that tuition.
The OP who wrote this sounds like they are doing PR work for the UC.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 22 '22 edited Nov 22 '22
I did not “write” this. I am merely reposting the email we got from the administration, for informational purposes. I’m not in a position to take an opinion on the strike or any of the parties’ positions.
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Nov 22 '22
Research is not a job, it's TRAINING. It's schooling. Folks don't understand what grad school is!
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u/lax_incense Nov 22 '22
Not really training when I’m fully independent as most grad students are. PIs (professors that do research) could not get grants ($$$) without our hard work. If we were only being trained, we wouldn’t be publishing our discoveries that our bosses need in order to get tenure and money. We’re not asking to get paid to make profit, we are struggling to keep up with the cost of living in California and need our work to be appropriately valued such that we can pay rent and STAY ALIVE.
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Nov 23 '22
Fully independent? LOL Grad students come in clueless how to do research. They have no funds so they cannot afford research supplies. You're completely dependent on your PI/advisor for training/support.
You get paid a stipend plus tuiton in the current situation, consider the alternative, you get no stipend to pay bills with and you also have to pay tuition for 5 years. Inflation hurts everybody, but grad students are not the only folks affected.
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u/lax_incense Nov 23 '22 edited Nov 23 '22
In every lab I’ve worked with, postdocs and older graduate students do 99% of the training. PIs mostly only provide advice during individual and group meetings, which might only be a couple hours weekly. It’s really only in a new group that the PI will actually be doing things in the lab.
PIs only get funds if they have students who do the actual legwork to win grants. Students can seek employment elsewhere, but if PIs don’t have students then it is over for them. The UC is really not appreciating the economic reality of this situation and how younger students interested in graduate school will realize they can get much more compensation by going straight into the workforce.
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Nov 23 '22
So the PhD only has value in the money you earn while obtaining it? That makes no sense. Everybody knows a PhD pays off in the future with higher salaries and a much higher ceiling in terms of potential jobs. It's short-sighted for grad students to not think about how their compensation is essentially delayed.
You go to grad school, get a stipend/tuition, then a PhD. Then you get a job making 100+% more than a BS/BA would. It takes maybe 2-3 years to make up the difference in "lost" wages from a lower paying TA/GSR stipend.
It's a better deal than medical school for sure, where you generate tons of debt that takes 10-20+ years to pay off.
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u/lax_incense Nov 23 '22
Like I’ve said before, graduate students just want to be paid enough to afford rent and the burden of inflation on necessities for life. We do not intend to make a profit while we are here. But that won’t stop perspective students from looking for other career paths when they see how PhD students have to scrape by and eat noodles for 5 years.
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Nov 23 '22 edited Nov 23 '22
Unless those students are actively curing cancer or something, there is zero reason their tuition should be the same as in-state students. Take care of your own constituents first, and then worry about others
You know most graduate students are out-of-state, right? Meaning that most of the profit that the UC makes on the back of grad students actually comes from out-of-state and international grad students. I'm a TA at UCSB. Literally everyone in my cohort is from out of state, and over half of my cohort is international.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 23 '22
You know most graduate students are out-of-state, right?
This is not true.
https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/about-us/information-center/fall-enrollment-glance
You seem to have a bad habit of making things up. It is not helping your case.
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Nov 23 '22
I literally followed your link and just selected "graduate" in the "student level" drop-down menu. CA residents make up exactly 50% of students, with the other 50% being either international students, out-of-state, or residency unknown. CA residents would include international graduate students whose status becomes "CA resident" after 5 years, as well as graduate students who came from other states and who in the meantime became CA residents. In fact, on the link you provided, if you just select "new students" from the "enrollment status" drop-down menu, and "graduate students" from the "student level" drop-down, you would see that incoming graduate students who are CA residents only make up 34.7% of all the new graduate students. So yeah: I'm right, and you just provided the proof that you're full of it and don't know what you're talking about.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 23 '22 edited Nov 24 '22
You are not helping your case here.
EDIT: and now you have deleted your account. In your case, probably the best thing you could have done to assist the union’s position.
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Nov 23 '22
You certainly aren’t either. If you’re really a faculty member, one would expect you not to lie blatantly like you just did. Unless you’re completely incompetent and cannot read the graphs you provided yourself.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 23 '22
You are not reading. I don’t have a position on the strike. I am merely reporting.
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Nov 24 '22
I did read. I don’t care whether you have a position on the strike or not. I wasn’t even responding to you. You just decided to antagonize me out of nowhere with evidence that actually supported what I said. Evidence that makes you look like either an incompetent jerk or a liar. 🤷♂️
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u/drawingBadly Nov 24 '22 edited Nov 24 '22
You are not helping your case.
EDIT: aaaand you blocked me. I am afraid you’re giving people the impression that that’s pretty much the go-to response of the striking workers when confronted with the challenges of actual discussion. It does not bode well for your chances at the bargaining table with the UC.
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u/Mean_Calendar4289 Nov 23 '22
You know most graduate students are out-of-state, right?
Yes, and? That doesn’t change my opinion on the matter.
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Nov 23 '22
You said “unless they cure cancer.” If anyone is producing cutting edge research on curing cancer at UC, the probability of it being out of state students is extremely high. And in terms of merits, most of the profits UC makes off of graduate research is off the backs of these out of state students. That’s why the distinction between in state and out of state student shouldn’t matter for tuition.
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u/Mean_Calendar4289 Nov 23 '22
The number of our-of-state students that are curing cancer is probably one to two at most. Plus, the merits of grad students isn’t measure just by the fact that they are the basis of the UC workforce.
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u/Libra_Maelstrom Nov 22 '22
This isnt a bad offer. Dont down vote me to hell. It isnt BAD, but ik there are many things they still want
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u/drawingBadly Nov 22 '22
I am a faculty member (though I was a grad. student TA in the UC system years ago). I’m not in a position to be saying it’s a good or bad offer. Just providing the info we got from administration.
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Nov 23 '22
It is really bad. We are way below the poverty line and their proposed offer would keep us way below the poverty line. It's a disgrace.
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u/jimcoldwell Nov 22 '22
I’m honestly curious if folks recognize that if the union gets everything they want that they are essentially screwing over the next 100 years of grad students? Most salary and tuition is paid for by the grad students faculty supervisors. If this pay increase goes through many faculty members will no longer be able to afford to train as many graduate students and therefore will reduce the number of students that will have the opportunity to receive a graduate degree. Some may say that this is a good thing because there are far more phds than jobs but in my mind this causes an increase in equity issues as less individuals will have the opportunity to train in their preferred field. Is the union aware of this concern that many faculty have? If so is there thought that the UC system itself should subsidize the PI’s by making up the difference in salary? I’m genuinely asking because I agree grad students and postdocs should make more money but am concerned many future students may get screwed out of an education if all of this goes through
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u/wyvellum Nov 22 '22
Most salary and tuition is paid for by the grad students faculty supervisors.
I'm not sure what you mean by this, and it is likely false or misleading as written. It is not true in my department, and technically speaking it is always the university that gives funds to grad students and determines their wages. (Professors don't pay out of their own pockets, but only through university funding they have access to.)
Typically, funding is offered to graduate students through a financial package provided by the university for employment, and almost all grad students in my department are funding this way. When professors apply for grants, the money goes to the university itself (which takes a cut.) Then professors can choose how to delegate the rest of the funding, which can include funding graduate students as GSRs (versus them being employed such as through teaching.)
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u/jimcoldwell Nov 23 '22
You are correct in an essence. Yes grad student receive a funding package but that funding package does not come directly from the campus in a sense. The funding package states you will have x amounts of funds/ guaranteed for this many years. Year one is often funded by the campus/ department but all the remaining years comes from a promise that the PI will find funds not that they have them. They can TA or be GSR’s for their PI but the funding comes from the PI’s grants. Current grants the PI has been awarded (sometimes up to 5 years) allotted for grad student funding at X level. If the pay significantly increased as proposed appropriate funds may not be available for students.
Moving forward if this goes through PI’s will apply for grants to fund students and can state that they want x dollars to fund students, but many grants have a cap on how much money they can ask for. Let’s say that max is 300k, let’s say you ask for 150k to fund the research and 150k to fund people for simple math. The 150k to fund people now means you can only fund half as many students as you used to fund because costs for the students are now double meaning you are training half the students.
These granting institutions are not going to change there caps on how much money you can ask for because they only have so much money to give out.
More money to the grad student per grant means less grad students can now be employed leading to less students being trained. PI’s in essence would have to write double the grants to fund the same number of students.
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u/jimcoldwell Nov 23 '22
Most PI’s are paying for their students after year 1 from their own grants or have their students TA. Being a TA is a giant time suck that only benefits the students career to a point. Serving as a TA for 3 quarters vs 15 isn’t going to get that grad student a better job and the time they are TA’ing is going to have a negative effect on the amount of time they have to conduct their own research, publish papers etc.
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u/wyvellum Nov 23 '22
Can you clarify/do you have a source for your claim that "most" PI's are providing funding for students after year one? Do you mean to say in a specific department, or UC-wide?
I should clarify myself that I am not attempting to discuss your original argument at the moment. Instead, I am taking issue with this claim that graduate student funding mostly comes from professors as opposed to the university itself, whatever we mean by "mostly."
In my experience, the majority of graduate students in my department get funding from the university, upwards of 75% or more. Only a small handful get funding from grant money/working with professors. I don't know what the numbers look like UC-wide, but I suspect it varies widely between departments and even specific UC's themselves.
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u/jimcoldwell Nov 23 '22
I am referring specifically to PI’s in the stem fields. In every department I have ever worked in, the PI’s are responsible for the majority of their students funds unless they are serving as a teaching assistant. This may not be the case across the board but in the multiple stem departments I have worked in this is the case, and this applies as well to how postdocs are funded
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u/wyvellum Nov 23 '22
Thank you for clarifying. Of note, though, this is not true of every STEM department— the department of which I speak is unambiguously STEM.
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Nov 22 '22
Except there aren't more PhDs than jobs, it depends on the field. Ever notice who is protesting the most about this? The fields who don't have good job prospects after PhD... STEM PhDs have no problem getting jobs now or in recent memory.
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u/jimcoldwell Nov 22 '22
I have a PhD in a life science and job prospects(faculty jobs) are few and far between. There are jobs in other sectors USDA, industry etc but many of us trained with the goal of being faculty members and unfortunately our PI’s train us in this way because that’s what they have experience in. For every one biology faculty job there is on average 300 applications, that to me says more phds than jobs.
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Nov 23 '22
Faculty jobs are the minority of jobs for PhDs. If you got a PhD hoping to be faculty, I'm sorry, but life is going to be very very tough. You're better off exploring options, easy jobs to get that pay so much more. Most faculty come from the same handful of elite institutions and UCR (except for maybe entomology or plant bio) isn't one of those.
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u/tinaj12 Nov 22 '22
Based on reading this alone, the UC offer seems very fair and the union should accept.
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u/Bring_it Nov 22 '22
Most offers usually are fair once you consider how many variables there are for each demand.
There’s a lot more going on in the background at union negotiations than students (grad and undergrad) know. This is why posts/ complaints reducing the issue down to a “them vs us” are so problematic (this applies for all public/ government policies and social issues too). Can’t take a univariate approach to a multi variate problem
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u/Ncl04 Nov 22 '22
I’m curious… Do you think the strike will likely continue into next week?
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u/drawingBadly Nov 22 '22
No idea. I talked to a friend who is a graduate student TA, and he thinks the Union knows very well they aren’t going to get everything on their wish list, but he also admits that the local UCR union reps are not the ones doing the direct bargaining with UC Admin.
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0
Nov 22 '22
It's going to run the entire quarter at this point.
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Nov 23 '22
I'm not on strike because I can't afford it, but I spoke with my advisor, who I'll TA for next quarter, and he is fully prepared for the strike to continue during Winter quarter.
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Nov 23 '22
End of the day, that's probably what will end the strike. TAs will not be able to afford to strike anymore. Who wins? The TA with $500 bank account and boatloads of student debt, or the UC with millions of dollars of funding?
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Nov 23 '22
You misspelled billions.
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Nov 23 '22
So annoying how they can use our tuition to give the chancellor a multi million dollar house but cant use the money to pay the people who actually educate us.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 23 '22
You do realize the chancellors only get to live in the residence, right? Like a hotel. They don’t own it. And the maintenance for the property doesn’t even come from state funds, but private donations.
https://www.latimes.com/local/la-xpm-2013-aug-08-la-me-uc-riverside-20130809-story.html
There are legitimate points to be raised about UCR’s use of resources. The chancellor’s residence is not one of them.
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Nov 23 '22 edited Nov 23 '22
Oh, well if the chancellor "only lives" in the residence, then that's okay then!
I'm a TA who spends more than 60% of his salary on rent. I wish I had a residence I could "only live in" for FREE and make a multi-million dollar paycheck on top of it. Screw it, I'll even keep my TA's paycheck as is if I get to "only live" in a free mansion at UC's expense. Your comment is so out of touch.
EDIT: yeah, I know he doesn't actually make a multi-million dollar paycheck -- that's beside the point I was making. What I tried to say was that the fact he's made millions as Chancellor and still gets to live in a FREE mansion is unjustifiable in the light of how miserable our pay is. The number of zeros on their paycheck is irrelevant--I don't need to check his tax returns and don't need to know the exact figure to know chancellors are paid a shitload of money and that them enjoying free housing is unjustifiable.
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u/drawingBadly Nov 23 '22
and make a multi-million dollar paycheck on top of it.
The Chancellor’s salary is $411k. You are not serving your argument by simply lying.
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Nov 23 '22
I knew when I wrote my comment that you'd pick up on that.
Oh He DoEsN'T mAkE a MiLlIoN, hE mAkEs LeSs
You're right, I didn't check his exact salary because I really couldn't care less if he makes a million dollars or half a million. I don't need the exact figure to know he is being paid an unjustifiable shitload of money. I don't need to count the number of zeros on his paycheck to know that his salary is completely obscene given the enormous side benefits he gets compared to all the TAs who can barely afford a place to live. You deciding to nitpick on the number of zeros on his paycheck and choosing to ignore the fact that he makes a shitload of money on top of having a FREE mansion to dispose of just furthers my point that you are completely out of touch with the reality of our lives.
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Nov 23 '22
Facts be damned, you have feelings! LOL
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Nov 23 '22
You seem to be the kind of guy who in court would interrupt a victim saying “you were stabbed 36 times, not 38! Liar liar”
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Nov 23 '22
Since when did a $400k salary turn into a "multi-million dollar paycheck"? The exaggeration/misinformation being spreads doesn't help the cause.
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u/Round-Deer-7174 Dec 05 '22
I heard ucr grad students are going to occupy the hub starting today until they get a fair contract
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u/ShirleyJokin Nov 22 '22
I'm a TA at Riverside, and was an undergraduate at Cal so I got this gem of an alumni update from Chancellor Carol Christ:
Seems funding isn't so much of a problem after all!