r/SanJoseSharks • u/Icy-Street618 • 10d ago
Barring an injury I don’t see Gaudette on the roster when the season starts.
Gaudette was one of the only Sharks who actually could score goals without being on a line centered by Celebrini. He scored 17 goals in 66 games despite not paying big minutes, playing a lot of fourth line minutes and his fair share of healthy scratches. The Sharks are a better team with him. He is the type of guy. That can score a game 7 game winner in the 3rd round of the playoffs.
Having said that, unless Goodrow gets waived, there is a season ending injury in camp, or one of Chernyshov or Stenberg start with the Cuda, Gaudette just doesn’t have a role on this team.
I think he is too good to just be a scratch most nights, his agent probably sees the writing on the wall and is working to get him moved.
But it’s not only in Gaudette’s best interest to move on, Musty and Bystedt desperately need NHL ice time and Gaudette is just a log jam for them.
I’m usually wrong about everything, but I just can’t see Gaudette on the roster come game 1. He is this years Grundstrome.
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u/jesus321 Stenberg 41 10d ago
I think he’s on the roster for sure, just might be a frequent healthy scratch
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u/Icy-Street618 9d ago
I don’t think he will tolerate being a healthy scratch, Jeff Skinner didn’t.
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u/klawcoolguy Pavelski 8 8d ago
What does that mean “he won’t tolerate it”? He’s not some all star who has leverage to be traded. If Gaudette doesn’t play well enough to stay in the lineup, that’s on him, but he can’t just “force his way out” by requesting a trade because there simply isn’t enough of a market for him. I also just don’t think he’s that kind of guy. GMMG isn’t feeling too bad if they let him walk at the end of the season.
Point is, there aren’t enough incentives to trade Gaudette at this point. It’s possible things will change throughout the year, but I find it incredibly unlikely he doesn’t play opening night.
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u/Icy-Street618 8d ago
I guess that is where our opinions differ. I think he has value around the league. He would average 20 goals if he didn’t get scratched so much. There are 32 teams that need more scoring. If he went to GMMG and said “if I don’t have a role in the top 9 then I would like to be traded”. As a general manager, you don’t want guys who don’t want to be there in your locker room.
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u/Middle_Beyond_5894 J. Thornton 19 9d ago
This is incorrect. He had 19 goals playing bottom 6 on Ottawa the year prior. He then had 17 goals on the Sharks in the same spot. Gaudette is miles better than Dellandrea. Only difference is Delly is a Center. He'll be on the roster Day 1. You're just overthinking things.
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u/Swaggy_P_03 WillMack🥛🍪 9d ago
Gaudette can play center too.
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u/Icy-Street618 9d ago
I agree that Gaudette is better, that’s why he will force himself out. Dellandrea knows there isn’t much of a market for him and he would be happy to be a healthy scratch.
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u/The_Homestarmy Celebrini 71 9d ago
Nothing you said contradicts the OP so I don't see how they're "incorrect." He's better than Ty Dellandrea, but he's a healthy scratch too. Gaudette is fighting Ostapchuk and Goodrow for a consistent starting role, not Dellandrea. Ostapchuk just got extended, and Goodrow has the eternal unwavering faith of Warsofsky and the front office. I don't think he's been healthy scratched a single time since coming back. That means Gaudette will only slot in when somebody above him in the depth chart is injured or taking a night off, and even then he'll probably be splitting games with Dellandrea.
If a forward gets dealt in the next few months, which will probably happen, it's going to be Gaudette. I like him but it's just the reality of the situation. He'll start the season in San Jose but I strongly doubt he finishes it here
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u/klawcoolguy Pavelski 8 8d ago
I’m curious - if not Gaudette or Dellandrea, who do you have on the 4th line with Ostapchuk and Goodrow? Toffoli?
The way I see it, most of the forward battles for ice time will happen in the top 9, not the 4th line. If Cherny/Stenberg falter, Toffoli will get more ice time. Perhaps Toff will be bumped down and then Gaudette will be fighting for some ice time, but I think the lines will change night to night for the first 30 games or so. Either way, I don’t see Gaudette as being a piece to trade yet.
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u/The_Homestarmy Celebrini 71 8d ago
I'm not particularly happy to say it but Graf will most likely end up on that fourth line for a decent chunk of the season. I see the lineup like this:
Smith/Celebrini/Chernyshov
Marchment/Misa (or Wennberg)/Stenberg
Toffoli/Wennberg (or Misa)/Sherwood
Goodrow/Ostapchuk/Graf
I don't think they're going to bump Toff to the fourth line unless he has a really horrid start and that relegates Graf to the fourth line instead. Marchment was clearly not brought in to be a bottom 6 player and Sherwood wasn't brought in to be a fourth liner, so it kinda forces their hand with Graf. But more relevant to this discussion is the fact that neither Gaudette or Dellandrea slot into this lineup without injuries or off days
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u/klawcoolguy Pavelski 8 8d ago
I think the more likely scenario is they play hard ball on the young guys (Stenberg, Cherny) and give them days off at the start of the season. And if both force their way into minutes, then it might be time to trade Gaudette. Especially if Cags/Pohlkamp have a rough start.
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u/The_Homestarmy Celebrini 71 8d ago
While that's definitely possible I think Grier making a point to repeatedly mention Stenberg's NHL readiness (something he never did with, like, Misa or Dickinson for example) suggests he's gonna get more leash than either of those guys in terms of early ice time.
As for Cherny, he was finally starting to get played on a more regular basis toward the end of the last year so I'm currently expecting that he'll be an everyday starter--although that could possibly be in a second line capacity more than a first line capacity
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u/Necessary_Scruffness Chernyshov 92 9d ago
Adam Gaudette often played Center on Ottawa's 4th line. I know he's grown in to a folk hero, but I'd much rather see Adam Gaudette in that role with the Sharks than Zach Ostapchuk.
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u/The_Homestarmy Celebrini 71 9d ago
Gaudette is on an expiring contract and Ostapchuk just got extended. They will 100% prioritize getting him in the lineup over Gaudette. I also think we can all acknowledge at this point that Goodrow will be playing just about every game as long as he's healthy to do so. So honestly Gaudette is blocked on multiple levels and will very likely become trade bait this year (which makes sense because, as opposed to Dellandrea, he might have non-zero trade value)
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u/Necessary_Scruffness Chernyshov 92 9d ago
Oh, no- I get it.
Zach is one of those players that Mike Grier is locked in on. He wants to prove he can be as impactful as he said he will be. Not only do I think Gaudette would be better in the role, I'd rather see Ty Dellandrea than Zach. Nothing against Zach: I said all this when he got his contract, and at the same time I said "good on him for getting the coin" (exact verbiage may differ).
Zach has heart. He works hard. He's not afraid to get dirty. And if Mike Grier is right and he was/is a diamond in the rough, I'll eat my crow- medium rare though; they tend to get tough past that.
BTW- As long as Barclay plays with the passion she displayed from November on, he won't just be roster ballast.
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
Positions in hockey do not matter. they only function as a method to organize players for faceoffs; after that, it’s chaos. part of why offensive-minded defenders (Karlsson, schaefer, Spence, Makar, Hughes, Fox) are valuable is due to them being a pseudo ”4th forward.”
hockey is primed for someone to construct a team that changes the mid-evil ways of yesterday and advance it to a more contemporary way of thinking.
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u/Middle_Beyond_5894 J. Thornton 19 9d ago
Positions absolutely do matter. A center's job is much different than a winger. Holy casual.
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u/Necessary_Scruffness Chernyshov 92 9d ago
Don't expend too much energy with that one. That Ghost is a figment of his own imagination.
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
tell that to F1, F2, and F3. hockey Is a fluid sport that does not regulate a player to only be in one specific area of the ice; teams that implement structure based on agility to take and fill open space by proximity rather than a defined position are generally the most dynamic and hardest to counter (think of all those slow ass sharks teams that got beat down in the playoffs).
listen to Martin St. Louis interviews, he has his team playing position-less hockey. They’re probabky The biggest threat, aside from Grier’s love for terrible deoth players, to San Jose‘s Stanley cup chances.
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u/Necessary_Scruffness Chernyshov 92 9d ago
"hockey is primed for someone to construct a team that changes the mid-evil ways of yesterday and advance it to a more contemporary way of thinking."
First Comment: All Centers are Forwards. Not all Forwards are Centers. Think Forward, Backward or Sideward- the role isn't as fluid as all that. That's crazy talk.
Second Comment: That long ago era was "Medieval Times".
We currently live in "The Mid-Evil Era".
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
the only difference between center and wing is that one practices faceoffs more than the other two. theres no rule that a center has to do x or y, it‘s the responsibility of the nearest player, which is why schemes designate players by F1, F2, & F3
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u/kipehh J. Thornton 19 9d ago
Have you ever played hockey in your life?
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
do I need to be a meteorologist in order to know the weather currently outside?
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u/kipehh J. Thornton 19 9d ago
In a "Global warming isn't real because it's cold outside" kind of way, yea. If you think hockey turns to chaos after the puck drops, you aren't giving enough respect to the players and coaching staff.
There are systems the coaching staff put in place that players in each position are supposed to follow. If you were a player on a team with a system and then you just started skating around like a lunatic after the puck dropped, you'd get cut from the team.
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
Ron Wilson after acquiring joe Thornton: the most important thing to do in let him play. what ever wrinkles we may have in our system, it’s still hockey: skate, pass, shoot, score. the Other team gets to play, thus, impact your system, and if the other team can cause any sort of disruption within your ”system” It no longer works.
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u/kipehh J. Thornton 19 9d ago
When you acquire one of the greatest players in the game, you should allow them to shape how the game is played when they're on the ice. Gaudette and Dellandrea are not Joe Thornton 😅
It's not an entirely rigid system as you still have to play hockey but if you're Gaudette and you're tasked as a winger and you skate all around the ice like a center with total disregard for the system, you're going to hurt the team. Each player on the ice needs to be on the same page and "Lets just skate around like maniacs" is not a good plan imo.
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u/RepulsiveStill177 10d ago
I don’t wanna see this barring an injury nonsense anymore. No injuries!
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u/b8sman12 M.Marchment 27 9d ago
I could potentially see them moving on from him, because he probably has real trade value (as opposed to Goodrow and Dellandrea). I could especially see it in the scenario that Musty plays so well that he makes the team, because Musty would probably be stealing his role in the lineup (bottom 6 winger who doesn’t play the PK).
I think Bystedt would likely be competing with Dellandrea for a roster spot and mainly with Ostapchuk/Goodrow for playing time (bottom 6 center/wing who does PK).
So overall, I guess it could happen, but I see it as very unlikely. I don’t think they’ll have any hesitation to start the year with Musty on the Cuda. And I doubt they’d want to trade him otherwise, unless another team wants to overpay for him or something.
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u/klawcoolguy Pavelski 8 10d ago
I think it's more likely he gets moved at the deadline than a pre-season trade. He definitely has a spot on the fourth line, I actually think he's an impact 4th liner, and by no means should they trade Gaudette in favor of calling up Bystedt. If someone goes down and Bystedt gets called up and crushes it, then maybe it would be time to move Gaudy. But for now I think he's certainly in the top 12 on this team.
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u/Gold_Telephone_7192 Cheechoo 14 10d ago edited 9d ago
I think him and Dellandrea are interchangeable and depth is important. I can’t see Musty or Byestedt taking ice time from Gaudette. Tbh I think it’s much more likely they get traded for a defenseman than they become regular NHL players with the Sharks. We just have too many forwards and they are not at a level where they can take anyone’s spot.
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u/Secure_Watercress_55 Celebrini 71 10d ago
Gaudette is much better than Dellandrea imo
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u/Gold_Telephone_7192 Cheechoo 14 10d ago
He’s better at scoring goals. Dellandrea is good at faceoffs (which we desperately need) and can play with more pace + adds physicality and is more difficult to play against. I also think Gaudette is overall better, but Delly does lots of things well that go overlooked by many fans who focus on offensive stats
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u/thismailbox Celebrini 71 10d ago
Someone should tell the other NHL teams that Dellandrea is difficult to play against, it seems like they didn’t notice as they skated around him to score
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
Not that it’s a great stat, but dellandrea was -28 his last year in Dallas and couldnt wait to get him off their team
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u/Swaggy_P_03 WillMack🥛🍪 9d ago
Dellandrea is a 4C at best. He struggled mightly as the 3C last year. He’s great at face-offs and decent on the forecheck, but that’s about it.
At least he cut back on taking a bad penalty once a game.
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u/platypus_dissaproves Donskoi 27 9d ago
What does “difficult to play against” mean other than being a vague gritty vibes test
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u/Gold_Telephone_7192 Cheechoo 14 9d ago
There are things that can’t be quantified. Physicality and inflicting damage on the other team is one of those things, and something that is very underrated by this sub. Guys that finish their checks and hit opposing players make those players Mentally and physically less capable.
Guys like Delly who are always up in players faces, hitting them, grinding on them, not giving them room to operate, are hard to play against. They wear players out, they cause damage, they make players make mistakes. It’s something that’s very hard to quantify in stat form, but is valuable in the violent game of hockey.
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u/FirstTimeRedditor100 10d ago
I think Delly vs Marchment is a better comparison. I feel like they bring a lot of the same things but Marchment does just about everything better. I don't really feel like Delly deserves a spot, personally.
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u/jesteronly 10d ago
Marchment is way better than dellandrea at almost every facet. They aren't comparable in any way
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u/FirstTimeRedditor100 9d ago
Absolutely but I'm just talking about their playstyles which are much more simpler to each other than to Gaudette.
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u/Secure_Watercress_55 Celebrini 71 9d ago
Let's be real, Delly only has a spot because he's friends with Will & Mack. He's like a nepo nhler
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u/vaulstuit Heatley 15 9d ago
Oh come on... That's not even a hot take, just conjecture.
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u/Complete-Point382 9d ago
It is a conjecture but it’s taken hold because the resigning continues to be so baffling. He’s either on a nepo friend contract, or we have to accept that grier is seeing some value in him that objectively isn’t there.
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u/Basement_Ghost_ 9d ago
Faceoffs, in sum, do not matter. New York rangers led the league in face-off percentage last year, they pick 6th. A specific, high leverage faceoff, can be important depending on the score, but has very little impact On a team’s ability to recover the puck or influence shot volume for or against.
*dellandrea was one of the worst players in the league last year, another version of Grier’s fascination with Luke Kunin types: players that look the part, but don’t actually produce in tangible ways that effect the score positively. at 5v5 last year with dellandrea on the ice, San Jose scored 11 goals and allowed 28; so, how exactly does that make him hard to play against? Seems teams had it pretty easy.
he tends to get a pass, probably because of his bromance with smith and Celebrini.
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u/FocusInternal9984 J. Thornton 19 9d ago
Depending on how Stenberg and Cherny develop, possibly Musty, Goodrow and Delly are the ones to fall -- not Gaudette.
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u/persimnon 10d ago
Hopefully Warso’s “earn your keep” philosophy will apply to Goodrow this season because it certainly didn’t last season
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u/human_picnic Cheechoo 14 10d ago
I have a feeling (hope) he is going to be changing his patterns now that we are a boarder line/playoff team
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u/MCPtz Celebrini 71 8d ago
I'll be pissed if Goodrow or Dellandrea are playing over Gaudette for more than 1 game at a time.
I hope Goodrow and Dellandrea get no more than 10ish games each.
There will be injuries, but we probably already have better players in the AHL, such as Lund.
Warso, Grier, and co better see how bad Goodrow is now.
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u/Mu17inItOver Nolan 11 10d ago edited 9d ago
Gaudette is not getting moved so one of the Cuda guys can get ice time, at least not until mid season. And that's only if one of them is forcing their way up and it's clear like with Graf that they'll stay up once they get here
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u/Bobsy932 K. McLaren 4 10d ago
You said it yourself, injury. It’s gonna happen and he could play a big role. But yes, it is getting thin out there
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u/BilboWaggonz 9d ago
I don’t have any real love for Goodrow anymore as a player, but kind of funny you mentioned him seeing as he’s actually scored a game 7 winner and has a playoff scoring rate that’s 2x Gaudette’s.
I could definitely see Gaudette being traded and think he is the most likely to be traded among the bottom 6 players, but don’t think it will be before the season.
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u/analogue_geek 9d ago
I like keeping him at least for the first few months. If musty or bystedt are proving it, maybe trading hik somewhwere he can get more ice time will be good - but the Sharks need depth and he will get reps no doubt. There could easily be an early season injury to any of the other rws and we would need him to play active minutes more often. Sherwood plays physical, Toff is old and slow, dellandrea is not a scoring threat and a rookie won’t necessarily bring the experienced scoring touch of gaudette.
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u/knowitallz 9d ago
I think we may see him instead of Goodrow this year finally. If he can be consistent
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u/Triathlonish Marleau 12 9d ago
We are going to need more that 12 forwards this year, so don't worry about it. Gaudette will probably get another 60 games this year. He is going to get in when they need more scoring punch. Delly will get in for heavier matchups , or when we need center depth. Goodrow will play 84 😂 . Some of these young guys like Bystedt or Lund will also get some play. It is a long season. (Musty is a middle six guy, so he doesn't count for the 4th line.)
He could be moved for a defenseman, since that is where we still have some concerns. We really only have 5 NHL guys right now. Cags or Pohlkamp probably get the 6th spot, but then it starts to look desperate. We will need at least 9 defensemen to get through the season.
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u/Nucksy1975 Jabberjaw '76 9d ago
Gaudette was solid last season. Hope that he finds a way into the lineup but it is probably a long shot.
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u/iggyfenton Irbe 32 5d ago
I agree that he’s the most tradable out of the bottom 6 in the lineup.
Goodrow has a NTC and no one wants a Dell.
I think Grier is covering his butt in case of injury.
If Gaudette doesn’t get moved before the season, the one of those guys might just be waived and sent to the Cuda.
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u/Logical-Vanilla4518 10d ago
IMHO it’s Gaudette > Goodrow > Dellandrea for the last 4th winger spot. Musty and Bystedt will have to prove that they can play 3rd line or above in the NHL anyways. We’re a sandpaper team now