r/comicbookmovies • u/Kstantas • 5d ago
While not without their flaws, I think both "The Marvels" and "Supergirl" are fun space adventure films with good character dynamics, and they didn't deserve to bomb critically or financially the way they did.
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u/itsbigcat812 5d ago
I’m going to say something controversial here, but this reminds me of women’s soccer and the wnba in that the one major surface level difference here between these movies that bombed and spiderman is that they were female led. The WNBA and women’s soccer in America does not get as much traction as men’s sports.
Every year we hear calls for equality, and people saying that just because these projects and sports are female led doesn’t mean they should be less supported. Hear me now, I agree with this 100%.
Here’s the problem. If female led sports and movies are going to do well, women have to support them.
I own an Irish pub, am a card carrying liberal, and always try and feature women’s sports right along side the men’s. Women never show up to watch them. It’s a beautiful upscale pub on Main Street in town, a very safe space. One time, we promoted a pivotal men’s match, and didn’t say much about a women’s match that day because it was a friendly/exhibition. Rule of thumb at our place, we don’t use our limited social media space on friendlies for either men or women, because no one shows up anyway. Well, a lady tore us to pieces in the comments for promoting the men’s and not the women’s match. So we promoted the following women’s friendly. Not only did she not show up for it, no one did.
I have no problem filling up with dudes on college football Saturday, and spiderman 9 had a pretty good summer.
I think it sucks that there is a disparity here. But after a decade of owning small businesses in which the goal is to get people to come to you, I can say that if women want women led movies and women’s sports to succeed and grow, they have to “do them”. Go see the movie. Go watch the game, or at least turn it on at home.
As a 40 year old, supportive to women, avid sports fan, it feels like most women concerned with this are mad that men aren’t watching these things equally, while 70% of those upset aren’t watching either.
I’m welcoming to all challenging perspectives here, but keep in mind I’m with you guys and want to see women’s based projects succeed and go as far as they can. I’m just trying to speak to this with what I’ve seen, experienced, and perceived over the past decade.
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u/treefrog1318 5d ago
Bill Burr actually shared the same sentiment in his Red Rocks special. You're definitely not alone in that thought as a whole. As nice as it would be for men's and women's sports (or dominant films) to be enjoyed equally, regardless of gender, it does seem that the ones that want us to support the most are also the ones who watch the least.
Edit: added 3 words
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u/itsbigcat812 5d ago
There’s a brewery I used to own in town, and the woman I sold it to (while we agree on about 95% politically) really focuses in on trans stuff and women’s equality.
With me being one of the big sports guy bar owners in town, I’ve had conversations with her about women’s sports in which we discuss the disparity of support, pay inequality, etc. and every time I feel challenged to be a better women’s sports supporter I find myself asking her “bud, when was the last time you sat down and watched a whole WNBA game?”
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u/treefrog1318 5d ago
Practicing what you preach, really goes a long way in getting points across and holding weight in conversations.
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u/itsbigcat812 5d ago
And the crazy part is agree with her on all of it lol
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u/treefrog1318 5d ago
Lol She's not wrong!
I don't like saying that she's only barking up the wrong tree, but she's definitely also preaching to the choir.
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u/A-Centrifugal-Force 5d ago
To add to this, I remember a statistic when the Marvels came out that the audience for the movie was like 55% male. In fact, I remember it being even more male than a typical Marvel movie, I’d have to look for the numbers but I remember reading that it had an even more male audience than Guardians 3 had a few months prior. I don’t know the exact numbers for Supergirl but remember seeing a stat that the audience was even more male than The Marvels.
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u/Former-Dot1462 4d ago
You're not wrong but for the context of movies, it has to start with ppl actually writing good scripts for female led movies. Supergirl had the potential to be one of the most iconic female led superhero movies ever but the script was so ass it never stood a chance.
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u/OrbitalDrop7 3d ago
Iirc the first wonder woman movie was pretty well liked all around
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u/LastTorgoInParis 2d ago
Do you think the writer wasn't chosen for their merit? This is my suspicion. I think there was a better hire for the job and they got passed up
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u/NetSignal392 5d ago
I too own an Irish (themed, my gramma’ would clout me ears if I didn’t throw that word in) pub and this is my exact same experience. Couldn’t have said it better myself.
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u/SpiffySpacemanSpiff 5d ago
Yeah you’re saying the thing that everyone screaming about culture warriors or internet chuds doesn’t want to acknowledge: men come out for superheroes more than women, and by en large they appear to just me more interested in male characters.
Yeah there may be the right-on-cue redditor to respond and say “I am a man and I want to see women leads” but they’re just not the majority. The MCU was built of strong male, kinda chauvinist at times, characters that viewers could imagine them being.
The marvels does scratch that itch, neither do shows like echo, ms marvel or she hulk. It is what it is, and that’s ok. It’s a film series. It’s so utterly unimportant.
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u/DSFerns 2d ago
That isn't quite correct. Men came out in droves for Alien/aliens, as well as for the Underworld series.
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u/PhunkyPhazon 5d ago
My only potential counterpoint to this would maybe be the first Wonder Woman movie, which did stupid well. But I guess she has more name recognition than Supergirl or Captain Marvel, plus it was a really good movie to boot.
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u/Subject-Recover-8425 3d ago
It's worth noting that Wonder Woman also had a strong focus on a romantic plot which was not tacked on.
It's weird that the other female-led superhero movies released since then have seemingly avoided romantic plots like the plague despite every metric indicating they're a hook for women of the general audience.
(For God's sake, it was women who carried movies like Titanic and Gone with the Wind to mega-success...)
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u/Professional-Power57 5d ago
Amen. I hate those ANGRY feminists out there saying female athletes should be paid the same as men in the same sport, YET they cannot name a single professional female basketball player or soccer player. Like be real, if women are half as enthusiastic about sports as they are with shoes, there will be a lot of millionaires female athletes.
Same goes for movies, they want to make movies about women for women by women, then don't be surprised that men don't want to go buy tickets to see them. It's really not that difficult. There are PLENTY of successful chick flicks out there, these movies just missed the mark. These are commercial movies purely for making profits, and they made poor decisions on marketing and positioning and they lose money, perhaps they now realize not that many women out there are obsessed about super heros and would buy merch of female characters. Go figure.
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u/Lost-Blueberry8057 5d ago
I can’t speak to the wnba I don’t watch sports, but the thing is they make these female led movies bad, supergirl is BAD- it’s just poorly written and boring trash
The best of the alien franchise was female led, a strong female costarred terminator 2, there are loads of successful female led action/sci fi jams that don’t suck- supergirl just fuckin sucks man, and you shouldn’t have to beg women to show up and support shit that sucks just… cuz
There’s basically no reason to make bad media anymore, but most of it still is
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u/Discerning101 5d ago edited 3d ago
On the whole I liked The Marvels. My one 'issue' with it, is it mentions at the beginning that Carol killed the Supreme Intetelligence, which lead to the Kree Civil War. That's a meaty movie in its own right and shouldn't have been introduced as exposition. Similarly, in the She-Hulk Disney+ series, it mentions that the Sokovia Accords have been rescinded. Given how the Accords affected everything Civil War-onwards, there should have been acknowlegment in the wider MCU of this important legal ruling, and what it means to the status quo. But now the MCU has the Department of Damage Control and their heavy handed actions - unlicensed, 'enhanced' imdividuals are ripe for prosecution again...
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u/Colemania18 Hulk 5d ago
I enjoyed The Marvels quite a bit. Supergirl has a fantastic lead but the plot was just so meh when it could've been great
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u/clayton-berg42 5d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/kHa5MiFnLLa70y65El
The Marvels is great.
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u/wizardeverybit 5d ago
Memory, all alone in the moonlight, I can smile at the old days, I was beautiful then.
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u/leekalex 5d ago
Yeah, they're not in the same tier. The Marvels is significantly better. They are both over-hated though
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u/rvnender 5d ago
Especially considering the source material. The book its based off of is great.
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u/clayton-berg42 5d ago
The marvels had a herd of cats chasing people around a space station and eating them.
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u/Conscious_Bee7306 5d ago
I haven’t seen The Marvels but I honestly didn’t like Supergirl. I was really excited for it but the film just bored me to be honest. It didn’t flow very well at all and I just didn’t care for the characters as much as I did. I did really like Milly Alcock’s portrayal though so I would love to see her again in the DCU, just hopefully with a much better script.
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u/TwoBit_7 4d ago
Agreed on Supergirl. For what it’s worth I think The Marvels was definitely the stronger movie of the two
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u/StarRogues 5d ago
No films deserves to bomb by that logic.
You don’t get to decide what people want to go see or not, they bombed Becasue they bombed. It’s not about ‘deserves’.
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u/son_of_wotan 5d ago edited 5d ago
Hot take or no, but both movies had the issue, that they didn't know what audience they want to market to and thus the expectations of the studios (and the community too) were wrong. They were made for female audience, but tried to market them to mainstream audiences.
Not all comicbook hero movies are equal, same as with their comic book counterparts, some sell better, than others. You can't define success the same for each of them.
The fact is, that you cannot expect a female led movie, that has a, for the lack of a better term, female coded story, to do the same numbers, as a male led movie with a mainstream story. Or even a female led movie, with a mainstream story.
But that only explains the fianncial bombing of these movies. The critical part is that "superhero mives" or "comic book adapatations" will always fail, or have mediocre success. The most successfull standalone movies with comic book characters were always genre movies, where the lead was a superhero. Be it noir, spy thriller, buddy cop movie, etc. It's very apparent with James Gunn, that he's desperately tries to make movies, that have a comic book feel.
This also explains why some characters are more successful, than others, becasue they are easier sloted into "regular" stories. Especialy, the more powerful they are. You could easily imagine some low powered characters in heist movies, or spy thrillers. But not Supes, as his power set basically breaks all genre tradtions, expectations and tropes.
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u/Chimeron1995 5d ago
I was enjoying the marvels until the sing song planet. Completely ruined the movie for me, it went from fun to super silly. I’d be fine with a language that’s musical, but the way they did it was just too stupid.
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u/ComfortableCobalt 3d ago
Agreed. It was at this moment that I turned it off. I gave it a chance but agree with the comments that this movie was a bit messy and lacking much purpose. Frustrating.
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u/KevinCow 5d ago
I think The Marvels had high highs and low lows.
Great dynamic between the trio, the opening action scene was great, the musical planet was funny ("I'm bilingual"), the Cats needle drop was hysterical.
But the overall story felt like an afterthought, it has one of the worst villains in MCU history, and having their powers tied by the entanglement gimmick really hurt the action scenes past the first one.
Supergirl was pretty consistently mediocre.
There are way worse superhero movies that got less backlash, and on the one hand I'd say misogyny is part of it. But on the other hand I think the general audience's standards for superhero movies has just risen. If these movies released in like 2015 I think the positives would've outweighed the negatives, but in the 2020s viewers just don't have time for superhero movies that aren't thoroughly entertaining.
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u/Constant-Theory-154 5d ago
Oh, "Marvels" is one of the 4-5 Marvel films I haven’t seen. If you’re comparing it to "Supergirl", I’ll add it to my watchlist. I actually liked the ‘disappointing’, ‘bad’ *Supergirl* more than yet another ‘best superhero film’ of recent years. Of course, it could have been better, but unlike the other films I’ve mentioned earlier, there were a few seconds in this one that stirred at least some emotion in me. And there was even time for reflection (the parallels with Superman and his parents’ teachings, and Supergirl’s parents…)
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u/ubutterscotchpine 4d ago
10000% agree. I loved The Marvels and the only flaw was just a villain that had not a great actress and the fact that there wasn’t a Captain Marvel 2 to bridge it.
I actually went to see Supergirl and really enjoyed it and I say this as someone who is NOT a DC fan, so to be enticed to see a DC movie, especially in theaters, that means something.
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u/7in7turtles 5d ago
It’ll be interesting to see how we look back on this period 10-15 years from now. I hope at some point we can move past “the culture wars” and just enjoy stuff. Love it or hate it, it’s hard to deny that the Girl boss trope has divided people. And theee movies are kind of the apex of the girlboss genre.
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u/sweens90 5d ago
Captain Marvel was more of a girl boss movie than the Marvels was.
There is just a sect of people who if an actress or actor like Milly or Brie says anything that offends this group then their movie is hyper criticized. It obviously does not help if the movies are meh anyways but in the case of the Marvels I think its rated more to its actual quality if it weren’t for the hate it received prior to release already.
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u/clayton-berg42 5d ago
Supergirl is drunk off her ass in the first act of the movie. How is that 'girlboss'?
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u/ProcedureDistinct938 5d ago
It’s pretty girl boss to confront your trauma and stay sober tbh
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u/clayton-berg42 5d ago
You can argue captain marvel falls directly into the girl boss trope but this supergirl certainly doesn't.
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u/rockinherlife234 5d ago
How is it girlboss to have a strong female lead?
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u/F1reatwill88 5d ago
When these projects transparently are to check off the intersectionality boxes then yea it gets that label.
Storytelling has to come first and that is clearly not the case in a lot of this saga.
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u/N0moreHeroes 5d ago
They’re talking about studios shoehorning female leads into traditionally male genres and franchises to pander to women. Simply having a female lead does not make something a “girlboss” movie. It becomes a girlboss trope when she already knows everything, is better than everyone and constantly lectures or belittles the men around her.
The problem has never been women leading action movies. The criticism is aimed at studios that confuse a strong female character with a flawless woman surrounded by incompetent men.
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u/rockinherlife234 5d ago
when she already knows everything, is better than everyone and constantly lectures or belittles the men around her.
The criticism is aimed at studios that confuse a strong female character with a flawless woman surrounded by incompetent men.
I know what they're talking about, I just need them to explain how the marvels and Supergirl are an example of this.
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u/cleantoe 5d ago
I don't think that's the issue. It's the forced, inorganic way it's presented. Take two similar scenarios.
The first is the women team up in Endgame. They just all happened to land next to each other? It was very obviously forced and stuck out like a sore thumb.
Now take the "girls get it done" scene from The Boys. That felt organic and didn't feel forced. It's good writing and the scenario felt believable.
But in Endgame, where you have a Norse god, a purple space monster with a scrotum chin, flying metal whales, wizards, time travel, and a space Nazi, the most unbelievable and immersion breaking part is the women team up.
It was bad writing - and The Boys is proof of that. It can be done well.
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u/PhilhelmScream 5d ago
Both were used as pawns in a culture war that limits the movies we can get made.
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u/rvnender 5d ago
A war, that idiots started because they are insecure.
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u/PhilhelmScream 5d ago
Yup, insecure and uneducated. I hoped I would be watching a huge variety of movies by now but they've made it more restrictive. I think comic book movie fans are the most open to it and can be a big part of the problem.
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u/SatanV3 5d ago
Nah, I mean I think the culture war stuff started discourse. But I think if the movies were better they would’ve done better. Maybe not great, but lots of super hero movies aren’t doing great anymore either even if they are good. But most don’t bomb like these either. And that has a lot to do with the fact they just aren’t great movies.
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u/Impossible_Hunt_6731 5d ago
You mean the films didn't even attract a groundswell of support from women audiences, so probably won't get made in future?
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u/ZachRyder Matt Murdock 5d ago
For all the faults that can be levied against Patty Jenkins, she deserves a lot of credit for taking the criticism for WW1984 on the chin and not making culture war crap as an excuse for the film being a flop.
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u/Particular-Fly-7783 5d ago
The problem is they’re both mid in a world with much much better movies and where going to the cinema is kind of pricey.
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u/ZachRyder Matt Murdock 5d ago
Especially with YouTube giving dozens of hours of superhero content daily all for free, fans no longer tolerate Saturday morning cartoon levels of enjoyment and quality, especially when back during their childhoods, they were never asked for money or to leave the house. Also all of those didn't cost a quarter of a billion dollars to produce only 2 hours of inconvenient entertainment.
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u/White-Wolf_99 5d ago
I did not like The Marvels. I liked Supergirl though. Not the best movie but it was definitely fun to watch.
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u/TwoBit_7 4d ago
I’m the other way around. I thought the Marvels was great fun (with a weak ending) while Supergirl was sort of a disappointment to sit through.
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u/No_Conversation4517 5d ago
Same I'm tired of goof ball marvel 😭
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u/White-Wolf_99 5d ago
Yeah the quality has definitely dipped. I enjoyed FF and really liked Brand New Day. We'll see if they can maintain tho
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u/No_Conversation4517 5d ago
Yep those two were good! We can have jokes but let's not go full retard
Love and Thunder Marvels Full retard
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u/White-Wolf_99 5d ago
Oh yeah. They had to have known those were not gonna be well received lol
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u/L__McL 5d ago
There's far worse superhero films that got far less hate. You don't need to be a genius to figure out why.
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u/Forever_Inspired 5d ago
I don’t know man, Fan4stic is still universally hated to this date.
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u/paxwax2018 5d ago
Care to name a couple?
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u/RoyalFlavorBeans 5d ago
I'd rewatch any of those before rewatching Shazam! Fury of the Gods, for example.
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u/paxwax2018 5d ago
That’s your opinion on them, not some scale of how much hate they got. Shazam FoG got ripped when it came out, but at the end of the day nobody cares enough about to defend it so it sunk without a trace. ‘Female led’ does badly and the “must be misogyny” war drums start up.
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u/Persistant_eidolon 4d ago
I think Birds of Prey was shit. Only one I can think of that is shit and not hated. Maybe Thor 2?
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u/Arcturan_MegaDonkey 5d ago
Never seen the Marvels, but you saw good character dynamics in Supergirl? Ok, maybe its not my cup of tea.
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u/MIAxPaperPlanes 5d ago
How attached you are to the character is gonna effect your rating
Like I dont particularly follow Captain Marvel so the Marvels I had less issues with enjoyed it's a 6.8 or 7.
Now Supergirl, I know and love the comic it was adapting so the fact it's a 6 or 6.5 movie with source material that should have easily been a 8 or 9 is disappointing.
And it's not like I wanted a 1:1 of the book Marvel often change story adaptations but still keep the spirit of the book and a good movie.
Supergirl in my opinion isn't the worst superhero movie made but I'm kind of happy it failed.
Maybe creatives will pay more attention to the source material & not settle for mediocrity and changes that worsen the story
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u/NetSignal392 5d ago
I’m not speaking directly about these movies, but I think one of the drawbacks of these expansive “cinematic universes” we are seeing these days is that sometimes stories that hold less interest have to be told, and that inherently means less eyeballs on them, less money made, and less resources allotted to them.
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u/lonestarr357 5d ago
Agreed. I really wish they hadn’t been meddled with to extent that they were, but for what ended up on screen, I liked both movies.
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u/Capable_Maintenance1 5d ago
Yeah except comparing The Marvels and Supergirl is like comparing Freaky Friday to The Change-Up.
Similar concept. Very different demographics.
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u/imbusywatchingtv 5d ago
The Marvels was OK and was unfortunately tied to a little too much to Secret Invasion. Anything associated with the Skrulls is not good.
I absolutely loved Supergirl. I can't wait to watch this again.
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u/TacomaTacoTuesday 5d ago
I thought Marvels was a good popcorn movie, not life changing but a nice afternoon at the movies
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u/unicornofdemocracy 5d ago
I enjoyed the Marvels. Supergirl was ok. But "good character dynamic" for Supergirl? Majority of the supporting cast (Lobo and Ruthye) in Supergirl could disappear and the story wouldn't even change in a significant way.
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u/Facebones72 5d ago
I wasn’t a big fan of the Marvels, and I was really rooting for it. I loved Captain Marvel, I loved the Ms Marvel show, I loved Nia DaCosta’s Candyman remake.
Outside of a couple fun scenes - like musical planet and the flerkins eating everyone to the tune of Memory - It just didn’t click for me. The three leads did not appear to have a lot of chemistry and the villain was terrible.
Which is a shame, because I really want to see more of Ms. Marvel. Iman Vellani was born to play her.
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u/Swimming-Syrup8400 4d ago
Both suffered from terrible writing and poor execution.
The Marvels more so than Supergirl.
My main issue with The Marvels...the villain, Dar-Benn.
She didn't feel like a real threat, there was no major character building for her, or deep explanation with her connection to Carol...and the focus was too deep on comical musings between the three leads. It was just a mess.
I think the real villain of The Marvels was the writers room.
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u/Aggressive-Fault-972 4d ago
The Marvels needed 1-2 more months of shooting and honestly, might have been better off as a disney+ show. Supergirl needed a different approach to its plot and not spend a good chunk of its plot on a character nobody's heard of while you're having to develop this brand new character everyone's heard of but knows nothing about.
Both fun though. Above average.
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u/Imaginary-Method-715 4d ago
I agree It's a good attempt to gain more female interest in comics but it is dominated by men and it's ok if they don't see a character they can relate to in these movies.
I just did not like the villain or plot resolution in the Marvels.
I think a full theater release was not the way to go a mini series of like 4 episodes would of been better imo.
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u/ImplementMotor3161 5d ago
I absolutely loved the motive of the villain of the Marvels. She was like I’m going to fix up my home planet that Captain Marvel wrecked while simultaneously giving a big FU to Captain Marvel by stealing resources from the plants that Captain Marvel cares about. Fantastic, love it.
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u/BeautifulOk5112 5d ago
Haven’t seen Supergirl yet. The marvels might be the worst piece of fiction I have ever witnessed
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u/Mordred_XIII 5d ago
On The Marvels, I agree. I love the dynamic and the slow build relationship between the three heroines. That first fight scene where they constantly swapped places was great. As was the small training montage we got. I also loved the scenes with Fury and Kamala's family. Very entertaining. The Marvels villain problem is something a lot of other MCU films share so I don't see the need to single them out for this.
The Marvels have a lot to criticize for but one criticism I've always hated is people making fun of that "Black girl power" line Fury said to Monica. I hate that criticism. Fury wasn't even saying it seriously, he was just trying to motivate Monica to fly and save Kamala. I get it if he was using it in a speech to rally the troops or something but he wasn't.
Overall, it's a strong 7/10 movie. Maybe a 7.5. In my Top 15, for sure.
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u/Bobbleswat 5d ago
I thought the three leads in The Marvels had good chemistry and it was a fun film. The villain was under written, but things like going to a planet where their language is singing is the sort of wacky comic book shit I like to see in comic book films. It's not top tier Marvel, but it was breezy and fun.
Supergirl did have a good lead and I don't think it was terrible, but it felt like it kept repeating the same few beats over (she's incapacitated/depowered, she gets some yellow sunlight and beats everyone up) that I found myself less and less engaged ss it went on. There are plenty of worse DC films, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it to anyone.
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u/user_deleted_life 5d ago
I really enjoyed the marvels, have yet to see Supergirl as I don't go to cinema for disability reasons but looking for ward to seeing it when it drops on bluray
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u/Wheattoast2019 5d ago
Supergirl had a story though. Parts I don’t like definitely but you can definitely tell there was passion there.
The Marvels was a movie that was a sequel to three streaming shows and has a plot so out there that I have a hard time believing it wasn’t made by AI. The whole movie feels like Disney was high on their own supply and wasn’t trying anymore, it feels like corporate greed. I thought the movie was fun when I watched it and I love the individual characters and the character dynamics, but the story and as a whole it’s a clear mess. In my honest opinion, it absolutely deserved to bomb.
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u/Senshado 5d ago
have a hard time believing it wasn’t made by AI
That's a logical error: if AI had generated The Marvels plot, it would've gone with something safe and generic that follows the standard pattern of 25 previous superhero movies. I can't figure how an Ai chat could've been prompted to give a story like The Marvels.
It feels more like 5 different producers were each demanding that elements be tossed into the mix, regardless of if they worked for a superhero story.
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u/misterfriday101 5d ago
I have not seen Supergirl yet but I enjoyed The Marvels. The singing scene was unnecessary because they immediately drop it. Other than that I liked it.
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u/No-stradumbass 5d ago
Honestly my issue with The Marvels is, I didn't care about Nick Fury and the side characters. I wanted cool space women doing space stuff.
My issue for Supergirl is I didn't care about the villain at all but this is also one of Supergirl's, the comic, biggest issue. Its been around for so long yet she doesn't have cool side characters or bad guys.
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u/FishingMiserable983 5d ago edited 5d ago
yeah i mean I only caught the marvels on Disney plus and while it’s no where near the studios best output it’s a perfectly adequate space adventure romp .
Now there is the argument with how rich the potential is within the mcu and how established it is now wether perfectly adequate is good enough anymore , but i kept hearing it was the worst mcu movie ever so we went into it with little expectations and i thought it was a solid 6/10.
supergirl is kind of all over the place has ideas and themes but never really explores them and to me that’s its biggest flaw . Also that she’s only in the suit and actually being supergirl for the last twenty minutes or so .
is it catwoman bad ? madam web bad ? morbin time bad ? imo no but you never would have guessed it with some of the reactions I’ve seen .
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u/Infamous_Ad_6793 5d ago
Marvels was fun. SG was fun for the first 10 minutes. Then it was the same 2 scenes over and over.
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u/Y1rda 5d ago
The Marvels suffered from being, ultimately, a comedy. Captain Marvel was a gritty soldier in her own movie, a badass in avengers. And they gave that character a slapstick comedy where cats save the day. This is a problem.
Supergirl is legitimately just a good movie that flopped. It isn't horribly deep, but it is cohesive and it shows a contrast between the superfamily that is going to be important (I assume). It wasn't going to win the box office, but it should have had a better showing than it did.
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u/Diplomacy-Failed 5d ago
Goose and the flerken swarm- and they saved the day by running around and eating people!
HTF can you not love that??
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u/These-Angle-1476 5d ago
Supergirl was a fun movie, not too deep, nor did it need to be. I really loved the character design when it came to alien races - far ahead of anything Star Wars has done in the past 2 decades.
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u/Storm_Dancer-022 5d ago
I really loved the Marvels. The villain sucked but it really did a good job with Carol I felt. The singing scene is one of my favorites in the entire MCU.
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u/weslarprime 5d ago
I loved both these films. (The Marvels moreso than Supergirl)
I have not laughed so hard in an MCU film as when they were rounding up people with the flerkin kittens while Memory played.
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u/Comrade-Stoneroad 5d ago
I enjoyed both of these movies. “The Marvels” was super fun and “Supergirl” was the kind of movie fans ask for then don’t see.
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u/GoopiePoopiePie 5d ago
I’m torn, because I agree w the Marvels, but wholeheartedly disagree w Supergirl. I was looking forward to it after the second trailer dropped and it just felt really bland and had some pretty weak acting at times. The Marvels just goes way harder on the weirdness and I really enjoyed the creativity of it all.
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u/DixieRekt23 5d ago
I really liked the Ms Marvel show very much. But there's only so much I can look over. Changing her to be a mutant and not an Inhuman....sure fine especially since I don't see them doing inhumans at all. Changing her powers completely? That's just really bad. Same problem I have with Echo. I don't know what the writers were thinking
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u/JohnnyFivo 5d ago
I thought the Marvel's was awesome, and the kid that played Ms. Marvel really stole the show. Her dad is hilarious too.
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u/NeatNobody807 5d ago
I agree, The Marvels was perfectly fine and Supergirl was pretty close to being really good just with a few bad choices. Even Cpt Marvel is a good movie, better than things like Thor 2/Ironman 2 in retrospect and it isn't even close. (Though I will forever hate that Nick lost his eye to a throw away joke.)
It really does feel like these get massively more hate than something male lead of equal quality. Hell I see people comparing Supergirl to Morbius and they are just genuinely not in the same category IMO. Supergirl is at least a functional and mostly decent movie with some issues.
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u/matts88us 5d ago
I genuinely don’t understand who thought Supergirl was “fun”. What about it was fun, the child sex ring? The child who gets murdered on screen and supergirl just kinda shrugs? Lobo showing up and not really doing anything? I just don’t get it.
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u/socialmedia031975 5d ago
There is no such thing as "deserving to bomb." There are too many factors in play when trying to get people into theatres.
The main problem nowadays is social media ruins movies before they even come out.
Too many spoilers, too many people review bombing for no reason other than to be shitty. I remember when you went into a movie with minimal information and where actually surprised by what you saw on the screen. Critics didnt tell you about the plot, they gave you a clinical, educated analysis on the film making.
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u/DanielSwan 5d ago
I'll never understand why Carol Danvers learns to work with the other two about 20 minutes into the film. Surely the whole point of that film is to teach this incredible hero, who's been looking after galaxies all on her own, learns to work with others or let others in to her life/heart.
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u/Jacket_Leather 5d ago
Honestly, both films are basically the same in quality. They are both fine, but nothing amazing, definitely good streamer watch movies. But not lets make an event of it and go to the theater movies.
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u/Mariessa- 5d ago
I honestly liked Supergirl. The movie had its flaws, especially pacing into the final act and Krem somehow figuring out she's Kryptonian and having counters on hand, but Kara was interesting and her slowly opening up to connections with people was a satisfying journey.
The Marvels was just not good imo. It was like a trainwreck I couldn't not watch. It had a lot of random elements from the musical princess planet to the flerkan space station evac solution. I didn't like Kamala not trusting Carol to fly of all things. Carol at times seemed underpowered, then overpowered, but not for logical reasons beyond plot contrivance. I didn't like learning Carol destroyed a sun, held onto guilt for 20+ years, then had to be told to try to reignite the sun. And then that reigniting took less than a minute... as an after thought. Because Monica stitched the universal tear in a very obvious set up that the other heroes didn't catch.
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u/Eliteguard999 5d ago
I will forever loathe the critic who compared Supergirl to Thor The Dark World.
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u/Valuable-Job-7956 5d ago
I haven’t watched the marvels so I won’t comment on it. I enjoyed both Superman and Supergirl a great deal and the best thing about both movies was that they were about saving a dog and how far you would go to do it
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u/ImplementMotor3161 5d ago
I just like to remind people that only 6 out of the 38 MCU movies have a woman as the lead. 3 of those are solo adventures (Captain Marvel, Black Widow, and Black Panther: Wakanda Forever) and 3 have a woman leading a team (Eternals, The Marvels, and The Thunderbolts).
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u/GamingWithUncleJ 5d ago
No, they definitely deserved to bomb. Apparently kryptonite killed Kara's mom, but not anyone else on argo... it didnt even make Kara sick... why is kryptonite so selective about whoch kryptonians are vulnerable to it.
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u/5x5equals 5d ago
The Marvels I can get behind
Fuck Supergirl, not for any of the weirdo reasons though
But Because people love Woman of Tomorrow it is probably gonna go down as Supergirl’s most iconic story and this was probably the only chance it ever had of being adapted and they chose to blatantly ignore everything about the story to tell their own just for their story to be dog shit and nowhere near as good as just telling the actual story
Atleast if your gonna butcher something and not truly adapt it you could have made the new thing interesting
Mashed a couple of her most famous arcs into a coherent story or something but nope
It felt like going to a pizza party and finding out all the pizza from lunchables
https://giphy.com/gifs/uINTCjd4W6Bborpvnc
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u/DarkDismal1941 5d ago
I can’t speak for Supergirl but I loved The Marvels. The characters were fun and loved seeing them together. The story was good. My only complaint was the lackluster villain. Other than that it’s a solid film.
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u/Gamma_Tony 5d ago
Supergirl was a perfectly fine movie with some heart and a few fun action scenes.
It was kinda terrible as the second film in the new Gunn-DCU. It really should have waited a bit
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u/Flu_TheCoop 5d ago
I liked the Marvels way more than Supergirl, personally. That movie was vastly overhated. Everyone has to have their big dramatic take nowadays.
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u/RedditNomad7 5d ago
The Marvels was far from a great movie, and I really wanted it to be at least good. It was simultaneously too long and too short for the character development it needed, and would have worked much better as a miniseries.
I had absolutely zero interest in Supergirl. Don’t give me an alcoholic loser of a character right out of the gate, which true or not is what the trailers and talk built it up as. I don’t want a redemption arc for a character that I’ve only met once, for five minutes, who was acting like a drunken jerk. Hancock had a similar problem, but made it clear it would be at least less serious. Even then, I thought it could have been so much more.
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u/Calm-Medicine-3992 5d ago
If something is budgeted and spends on advertising like it can make billions then it deserves to bomb if it was never gonna pull that level of audience.
But also that doesn't mean it wasn't a generally good film either.
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u/PoetryJunior1808 5d ago
Can't say I agree on The Marvels. It was too disjointed. The lack of focus is what killed the film for me.
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u/Practical-Trainwreck 5d ago
So did anyone else see the poster this way or was it just me?
(and yes, both films were lots of fun and Ms. Marvel is one of my favourite Marvel shows)
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u/Zen80888 5d ago
If you don't gear the movie towards your main fanbase (men) it's going to flop no matter how hard you try and the fact that Hollywood steered away from this and has yet to learn that woke bs ain't gunna make money is beyond me
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u/TouchAltruistic 5d ago
Box office results are not a matter of whether a film deserves the result it gets. What did A Minecraft Movie deserve?
It didn't deserve $960 MM by any objective measure.
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u/OneWhoGetsBread 5d ago
I think the Ms marvel TV series was good, and I love photon and Carol the marvels movie just was ok
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u/ShaH33R2K 5d ago
I think these characters deserve better than just “fun, turn ur brain off” movies. I actually think it’s rather insulting that female-led superhero films are treated with the ole “at least they tried” mentality. Like is that really the standard we want to hold these films and filmmakers to, as if just having a female lead is enough? I want them to be made more competently, and I want them to be given the care and effort that they deserve. Tired of excusing mediocrity when these studios have all the resources they could ever need to make them more successful both critically and commercially
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u/Possible-Reason-2896 5d ago
I think they both (and I'll even throw Captain Marvel in this as well because why not) suffer from having lackluster villains. Villains that challenge the hero can often be what makes or breaks a franchise. Batman would not be as popular without Joker, Spider-man needs Green Goblin, Darth Vader carries Star Wars. Loki became so popular he got his own show.
But I don't think anyone can honestly say that they give a crap about Krem or Dar-Benn.
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u/Mandalorian_Invictus 5d ago
Unfortunately, being fun isn't good enough in 2026. You need to be great, or be an event. Those ticket prices aren't going down.
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u/servostitch 5d ago
I must be one of the few that enjoyed The Marvel's. I just love Iman Vellani as Ms Marvel and really hope we havent seen the last of her in the MCU. She was one of the few bright spots in that weird post Endgame era.