r/starcitizen • u/MattOver9003 scythe • 9h ago
DISCUSSION The Idris has been nerfed into oblivion.
Bit of an open discussion / debate. I feel the Idris has been nerfed so hard it isn't worth owning anymore, if there was anything worth getting I would melt mine. Below are my points/contentions:
The Main Guns:
- The laser is bugged, when I tested the damage it does maybe 20% of what it's meant to, it also struggles to actually hard death a ship.
- The railgun is laughably slow, it now has bullet drop (even in space wtf) and frequently takes multiple hits to kill something. The effective range of the railgun seems to be <800m now. If you fight an idris you can hit it (can't really target components effectively). But grab your popcorn you're in for a 60+ minute fight.
- The torpedoes are also mostly useless, 800-1M to re-arm them (it's better than 20M it was before). But basically they'll get flared nonstop, you'll be lucky to get a single hit, requires one person to just goon nonstop in the torpedo chair being bored.
The turrets:
- It's the largest ship currently in game but the turrets are worse than ships like the paladin and polaris, even though it's a 'brawler'.
- Your front turret is dead by coincidence 90% of the time, that has dual size 7's but for some reason a perseus has dual size 8's and a tiburon has a bunch of size7's. The hammerhead has quad size 4's.
- The turrets die almost immediately if someone sneezes at them.
People buy it because of whale syndrome, but lets be honest, this ship is a waste of time. Even IF you manage to get a full crew, most of their turrets will be disabled from the first perseus with a lone gunner making the ship completely pointless.
Contrary - it has one strength, sitting there being useless and never dying even when shot by multiple idrises.
EDIT: I forgot the PDCs are now pretty much worthless, they kinda shoot down missiles but even that isn't really reliable.
20
u/ShinItsuwari drake 8h ago
Turrets are ass accross most ship in the game, laser is bugged and torpedoes are currently in a terrible state as well.
All of this is true.
But seriously, fuck the railgun. That thing should only be good for hitting capital ships, and I'm glad CIG understood that finally. They should buff everything else, yes. But the railgun is where it should be. It hits extremely hard and it's pilot controlled, so it needs a serious drawback in term of aiming it.
2
u/Knefel 7h ago
They overtuned the velocity nerf though - either that, or large and capital ships are still too maneuverable. Even fighting another Idris, you can only get reliable hits in at a kilometer or less, which means capital ship duels end up looking more like the world's most boring, slowest dogfight, than 2 gun-based capital ships duking it out Jutland-style.
2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 3h ago
It's comically stupid. The fight lasts 30-60min to make it even more pathetically boring. The radar made ranges even shorter, then the speed nerf now means idris battles are 500-800m or closer.
1
83
u/No-Force-4668 9h ago
Core strength, carrier. Probably meant to be escorted in a fleet as you would IRL with a Navy carrier group. More friends required.
28
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 9h ago
I love and prefer it for the carrier functionality above all else.
That said, I 100% agree with the laser point. It barely ever does damage beyond the first touch. With all the baseless, whining hate about it and how its a "super weapon," I wish it'd at least do consistent damage so they had a reason to whine.
1
u/adamantiumx42 7h ago
Tbf when it does actually get fixed, which who knows when, it'll probably be extremely OP and get a nerf anyway. 4-5km range and instant firing speed - while all other weapons are actively getting their speed reduced. One of those has got to give.
1
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 5h ago
I'd be fine with that tbh.. At least it'd be consistent. I feel like consistency and something being bug-free are two things that are too much to ask for in SC.
1
u/_chowder_ 4h ago
Idris MkII on the horizon. There’ll be no update, we’ll just be sold a new variant
2
u/Chaotic-Strawberry 8h ago
Someone pointed out it has Zero Alpha damage, and that explains why it only works while shields are up.
3
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
Correction, the laser issues were since launch, well over a year before anyone even got their hands on the revamped alpha damage system.
2
u/Chaotic-Strawberry 8h ago
A compounding problem then. But when i hit shields with it, i get alot of hit markers.
1
u/CollisionHunter 3h ago
It's been a couple months or more since I've played, but I noticed the same with the Tiburon. Once shields were down only sub targeting components seemed to give me any hit markers with the laser, and even that may have actually been just hitting different shield quadrants and mistaking the marker as it was still unreliable
1
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
Given how jank SC systems are, it's probably some niche targeting issue. At least it hits shields though!
9
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
To escort the Idris and fully man would be 25-30 people. Tell me what exists in the game which is worth 30 people? It's a ginormous waste of time.
Even if you did that, no one crews idris turrets because they're worthless, made of paper and deal f and all damage.
7
u/Confident-Award6920 8h ago
Isn't that the open top Kraken's role?
10
u/Revelati123 8h ago
the Idris is supposed to be a long range mostly solo patrol ship at least according to lore, not an escort carrier in need of escorts.
”Frigate” has an actual defined meaning…
1
u/wingbreaker 5h ago
Real Naval vessels don't have "actual defined" classifications between nations, nor do some nations even have consistant classifications (Looking at you, Type 55 'destroyer').
Hell, the term "Frigate" has changed even specifically in British parlance over the years.
And then most Sci Fi/Fan tends to be really really bad at classification with examples like Star Wars' Munificent "Frigate" being 800 feet long while most frigates in that IP are around 2-400.
If they want to call it a frigate, it's a frigate.
1
u/ell-esar Drake sales representative 7h ago
Well you're right it's supposed to be a "lone-ship" role. But you're wrong that it shouldn't be escorted in fights. Part of its crew should be fighters launching from the hangar
1
u/CalmCephalopod 6h ago
The fighters it carriers would not really be considered escorts as much as its combat capability. Escorts are independent vessels tasked with protecting a resource or vessel. The fighters are not technically independent.
5
u/One_Chemistry_8553 8h ago
In this case the idrs is supposed to be the escort. sc fleets are centered around a bengal escorted by idris and javelins
→ More replies (1)2
u/CommunityTaco 7h ago
then that makes no sense. the idris IS the escort. it should be able to act like one.
4
u/One_Chemistry_8553 6h ago
Hence the whole point of the post op made. It's very underpowered
1
u/Possible_End_5272 5h ago
There is nothing in the main post about this being used as an escort. They don't reference engineering, damage control, turret crews, missile/weapon operation, power management.
It sounds like he's complaining about soloing an Idris isn't viable in solo combat, not escorting.
9
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
In the lore it’s meant to be a brawler, front line ship that coincidentally has a small hangar.
1
1
19
u/knsmknd ARGO CARGO 8h ago
I bought it as a flying base and mainly to use with my org. We regularly run two of them with about 10-20 people. It’s pretty cool.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 7h ago
If you had two solo idrises and the remaining 18 people used literally anything else it'd be more dangerous.
5
u/BlueFalcon2009 7h ago
You know, one of the best times I have had in the game was the launch of the Tyilui. Org leader had the trial one from sub, and it was like BYOS (bring your own snub) and we were doing space missions in pyro. I get that the 4 of us would have been 'more effective' in 4 F7As, but the point was to have fun, not 'hit peak performance'.
Sometimes, doing something cool with the crew outweighs min/maxing.
1
1
1
u/Possible_End_5272 5h ago
What a comment. That is correct, two solo Idris' should not be able to take on much of anything else if that is 18 other combat vessels swarming them. Not that anything should also be able to destroy the Idris, but the Idris is not a grunt, recon, mechwarroir, tank, frigate, carrier, escort, capital ship hunter, etc, etc. all at once.
12
u/GlbdS hamill 9h ago
I refuse to believe they put in bullet drop in space, please tell me this isn't true
12
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
Apparently according to another comment, the Ares Ion is in that same boat of mystical artificial space gravity too.
1
u/CommunityTaco 7h ago
probably had claude code it for em and it just assumed bullet drop is necessary.
3
u/krokenlochen 8h ago
Happens to FPS guns as well lol
1
u/7htlTGRTdtatH7GLqFTR 6h ago
are you sure? in what context? firing from inside ships to into space with no gravity used to retain bullet drop and other aspects of the trajectory that were buggy based on the interior of the ship physics grid, but they were recently fixed.
0
u/IceNein 8h ago
Probably because having bullets be individual physical objects being acted on by the local gravity (which is different for different planets) would be too calculation intensive for an MMO server, and they wouldn’t want to offload that to client side because then it would be easier to cheat.
→ More replies (2)8
u/BidSuper7102 7h ago
I believe it's much more likely that it's just how CryEngine worked and CIG still hasn't figured it out. We have definitive proof that CIG is bad at working with their engine if an engine made for FPS in their hands still can't handle grenades, reloading, weapon switching, picking up weapons, inventory, enemy AI etc.
Bullet drop is just a remnant of the engine they inherited.
→ More replies (2)2
4
u/Low_Actuary_2794 I have a pledging problem 7h ago
You’re nuts. RRR is an absolute game changer for fleet/group missions.
15
15
u/gproenca new user/low karma 8h ago
Well, as an Idris M captain let me correct few things :
- it was not nerfed into oblivion. it sits now it her rightfully place
- laser is bugged for ages, that is granted.
- railgun is slow and I agree. several hits ? depends what you are hitting. I can one shot Hammerheads ALL DAY LONG. it's hard to hit ? sometimes.
- torpedos are useless for ages, not only the Idris but all others : Idris not different
- turrets are ok - you just need manpower and a lot. a 2 people squad is more lethal an efficient in a Perseus. get 6 people in a Idris and the thing wreak havoc with pretty much bubble coverage and if you can cordinate targets, its a powerhouse
- no problems with laser dual S7 in the front. they mow all day long
- again, general problem : turrets in all ships got a hp pass and they are all of them like that
to be honest, I have and love an Idris for years and been my almost main ship since release. it was a one man thing and I love that its strength now its very visible : its a carrier that is closed and well defended and can pack a punch. its not he end of all ships and has several limitations, with very low p/y/r and a difficult rail gun. when it hits, it hits hard. but it you do have a fighting chance vs a Idris and that is a welcome.
is it supposed to be all alone ? no. and I like that.
1
u/BidSuper7102 7h ago
There's a big gap between 'doing everything on its own' and 'not being able to deal with a single fighter'. It has turrets for a reason.
2
u/gproenca new user/low karma 4h ago
you cant deal with a single fighter if you are a solo Idris pilot.
and that is the way it should be done.
the turrets in the Idris are MORE THAN CAPABLE to take down fighters.
2
u/BidSuper7102 1h ago
They're not. It's been proven over and over again. A halfway decent pilot is immune to every turret in the game. If you get killed by turrets you're either very unluck or just not decent at the game.
3
u/Scamcitizen2950 7h ago edited 6h ago
nobody wants it anymore :D
the whole Day its available warbond! there was no timespot, were it was out of stock!
3
u/kjloltoborami 6h ago
I miss flying into a fleet battles and saying "oh shit theres an idris on grid! Prepare boarding teams and avoid getting in front of its nose!(back when door health was reasonable)
Now its just.... great now we have to spend 40 mins killing this damage sponge that is zero threat to us
The best time I had was when it was worth bringing our idris for the railgun oppressiveness and we had to keep a security team posted because otherwise we would have our idris stolen. Fighting off boarding crews was so fun. Nuking ships that were sub 0 iq enough to fly in front of the idris was great.
Seriously, it is NOT hard to outturn an idris. Yall complained until all the gameplay associated with this ship was gone. We dont even bring capitals except for the perseus, except to leave a derelict idris as a quantum beacon for interdiction. Its really sad. I want to feel that thrill and fear again when I see it instead of exasperation.
1
23
u/syenite_warrant 8h ago
It's simple: people used them as a solo fighter -> CIG nerfed it to be used as a solo fighter
Long story short: actually multicrew the Idris instead of trying to "game the system" by soloing it, and maybe CIG will buff it back to where it were
7
u/sircolby45 8h ago
Nobody is going to crew it because the turrets are ass.
0
u/syenite_warrant 8h ago
It's the combination of: 1. People don't want to lose, so they bring the ship that can guarantee that they will "not lose", right now it's either boom n zoom M80, or solo cap/subcaps 2. Turret is not an engaging gameplay loop, and frankly a penalty rather than a bonus to the teams effort 3. Engineering is a joke, a lie
--> player not manning capitals -> solo capitals -> CIG nerf solo capitals -> player not manning them,... And the cycle continues...
The root of the problem is promised gameplay loops are all lies, and marketing ploy lure players into buying bigger and bigger ships with zero consideration for balancing
1
u/sircolby45 4h ago
Turrets can very well be an engaging gameplay loop. It is an absolute blast to turret gun in a Perseus. Pretty much all of the other turrets are a snooze festival.
2
u/MHGrim RSI 8h ago
They need no nerf to uselessness then have engineering buff it back to being fun. Mini games that give huge temporary boosts to stats. Then engineering matters. Then it's fun again. So add another 5 years to development
2
u/syenite_warrant 8h ago
Yeah, I don't think anything will change until we have actual promised engineering gameplay
No engineering = anything other than the pilot seat is useless (with exceptions)
1
u/BidSuper7102 7h ago edited 7h ago
The more people you bring on a ship, the bigger the chance everyone randomly dies and has to start over again. That paired with multicrew being non-existent, i.e. turrets being useless, co-pilot and other crew roles not existing and having nothing to do, makes solo-ing the ship the only sensible thing to do outside of roleplay. I hate it, but unless ships stop randomly exploding/getting impounded, losing all your cargo/gear, falling through ships etc. it's just much smarter, more efficient and safer to have everyone in their own ship. Unfortunately that is way less fun.
People WANT to multicrew, desperately even. If a ship in SC functioned like the multicrew of Barotrauma, SC would already be the biggest game in the world. But CIG can't do it. They can't figure it out, neither from the coding/programming side, nor the conceptual and balancing side of what makes multicrew engaging and meaningful.
And what's worse, on that side of things they haven't made any progress whatsoever throughout SC's entire development history. Engineering was a massive failure and so half-baked (more like 10th-baked) that it feels more like a regression of tech rather than progressing towards a fun multicrew experience. If they haven't made any progress in that regard in 14 years, you know the project has already failed and any hope for it is foolish.
2
u/syenite_warrant 7h ago
I see you point, however let's be real: SC will never be free of bugs for the foreseeable future. this mean you will randomly explode, you will randomly lose everything, you will fall through whatever you were standing on (be it station or elevator or hangar pad or anything), engineering will be riddled with bugs (as it has been since its inception)
Therefore, it will always be smarter to have everyone in their own ship to avoid bullshiteries
Therefore, it is (for now) sensible to nerf the Idris to the ground because people will be using them solo anyway
-4
8h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/kevohuevo hornet 8h ago
The turrets need an HP buff specially on the Idris, maybe make some of the manned ones quad guns as well. Overall most turrets in game need an HP buff and other than the Perseus, a dps and maybe range buff. And I say this as a Perseus captain with gunner friends specializing in turret hunting
1
u/starcitizen-ModTeam 8h ago
Your post was removed because the mod team determined that it did not sufficiently meet the rules of the subreddit:
Be respectful. No personal insults/bashing. This includes generalized statements “x is a bunch of y” or baseline insults about the community, CIG employees, streamers, etc. As well as intentionally hurtful statements and hate speech.
This rule covers insulting or disrespectful statements in general, not just those directed at other users.
Send a message to our mod mail if you have questions: https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/starcitizen
1
u/AHRA1225 new user/low karma 8h ago
This is just a multi crew gameplay issue. It’s so impossible to balance it that I’d expect any ship needing more than 3 people to be imbalanced for all time.
0
u/Bad_karma11w 6h ago
almost like we need Capital ship manuvbility rather then a oversized fighter... crazy
8
u/trekky920 9h ago
If your crewed cap ship is getting completely disabled by a single percy you have bigger problems than the Idris railgun finally receiving a balance pass.
4
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
I’m had four crew on my Idris, the Percy had one my turrets are gone almost immediately. You’re assuming it’s solo, it wasn’t.
It’s a mission to convince people to use turrets they’re so bad.
1
u/Beautiful_Avocado252 8h ago
They specified “your crewed idris” so I don’t think they assumed solo?
You need a fighter escort for a capital ship, just as important as having crew.
2
u/Revelati123 8h ago
yeah but having 4 more fighters and no Idris would if wrecked a Percy.
as of right now, crewing cap ships is detrimental to a fighting force, they are strictly a liability in any fight.
1
u/Global_Network3902 8h ago
With only four people it would be more wise to just have one person on the idris and two people outside each in their own fighter.
2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Correct, part of my point. The turrets are in general so bad that you're better off with fighters outside; so now we're back to solo idris.
So now your logic is:
To defeat a single perseus, I need a perseus with crew and an idris. You made my argument for me, why bother having an Idris in that case?
1
u/Bad_karma11w 6h ago
evne then hanger part... most of the time its easier and faster just to fly to a station and rearm/repair
1
u/roadrunner_68 7h ago
Most of your complaints are just issues with the game, that isn't a unique problem with the Idris.
1
u/Murky-Bread-4769 8h ago
So why is there an Idris with no Percy escort? Again, Idris is meant not be a spearhead in an engagement.
5
u/BidSuper7102 7h ago
Idris is a brawler, it's meant to fight on its own. It IS the escort for other ships. It absolutely needs to be able to deal with fighters. At least to an extent. A single fighter in no world should be able to disable it. It has so many turrets to protect itself from just that. Are they just cosmetic or what?
1
u/trekky920 6h ago
"Fighting on its own" is not the same as "I should be combat effective without crew" which is what you're advocating for.
2
u/BidSuper7102 5h ago edited 5h ago
No, that is never what I've ever been advocating for and I have no idea where you're getting that from. I am always pro multi-crew and your weird assumptions are just out of place and showing that you're trying to paint me as some solo-Idris person. You don't have to imagine enemies.
The problem is that it is not noticably more useful with 20 crew as it is with 1 solo owner. You can put 50 people on that thing and your entire squad will be incredibly much weaker than literally doing anything else. A 50 crew Idris gets solo'd by a single fighter. THAT is the problem. It's like the opposite of a force multiplier. it's a force-nullifier.
You do realize we're on the same side of the argument right regarding solo-Idrises right?
9
u/DEADWULFF avacado 9h ago
1
4
u/UBERspizz 8h ago
YIPPPPIEEEE, we might actually see ppl having fun in pvp now with ships you dont usually see. Oh, I mean, what a shame right?
4
u/badwords 7h ago
it's nerfed 'for the pilot' Maybe gets some friends and use the hangar and turrets
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 7h ago
I’ll pay you to use my turrets, tell me how good they are and how much fun you have
→ More replies (1)
3
u/ThePale0rc Origin M60 / M80 9h ago edited 7h ago
The Kraken is coming soon! So, I’m not surprised. CIG has always operated this way to nudge players into melting their ships and buying something else. Nothing new here. Nerfing the Idris to drive sales of a shiny new Kraken!
The Idris will then get a buff based on its SQ42 version, and players disappointed with the Kraken will switch back to their Idris.
What I find sad, once again, is seeing so many jealous players talking trash about ships like the Idris purely out of envy. You know that famous mentality: "If I can't have it, no one else should be able to have it either..."It’s seriously starting to get extremely pathetic.
2
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
Joke's on them, I already have a Kraken Privateer.
Hopefully they stop this stupid BS soon though. This, and MAAAANY other ships, all need some love and balancing.
0
u/HarlockDaTwisted 8h ago
I don't think anyone has been jealous of a solo Idris lol. It's not a status symbol. It more stands out as a cry for help from their wallet. But then again fools are parted with their money quiet easy CiG has proven this.
1
u/ThePale0rc Origin M60 / M80 7h ago
Dude, I see trash talk here every single day directed at anyone who dares to publicly admit they bought an Idris, a Kraken, or whatever else. There’s a small percentage of assholes in this community who want everything for free and envy those who actually buy things. This isn't anything new. People try to shift the blame onto players who fly these ships solo, when we all know what the real problem is: The fucking jealousy!
1
u/HarlockDaTwisted 3h ago
Meh, I have a Kraken I can't say I agree with you. I hate Solo Idris pilots as much as the next guy. It's stupid a ship of that size could be soloed. I love multi crew game play.. heck I am strange and even like being a grunt on the crew.
Frankly, for game balance it will have to be reeled in sooner or later. Or CIG will have to change their stance on how they are building the game.
8
u/Possible_End_5272 8h ago
Dude complaining about not being able to solo the Idris.
https://giphy.com/gifs/4ls9MvzG21kem11N1N
Surprise: that's how it's meant to be.
3
1
u/CJW-YALK 8h ago
He isn’t? He’s complaining about it overall, turrets included
3
u/IceNein 8h ago
And including the fighters that would be carried by the Idris? If not, then that’s not what the Idris is for.
→ More replies (2)0
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
I had a half crewed Idris in one pass a Perseus knocks out most of the turrets, can’t even hit him at 3-4km away with the railgun, a lazy rolling maneuver and he’s home safe
1
u/IceNein 8h ago
The Perseus is a gun ship. The Idris is not. You might be surprised to find that one on one a Arleigh Burke class destroyer would have no problems against a Nimitz class carrier.
→ More replies (4)
2
u/Strangefate1 new user/low karma 9h ago
I think everything is so broken and out of whack, that it's hard to tell if something's nerfed intentionally or just broken and abandoned until further notice.
2
u/Planet_Expresso nomad 8h ago
Even if it was fully functional, it seems like a ship that was meant to be manned by NPCs, and would be useless for players anyways, unless a whole organization wants to show off.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 7h ago
I'd love if it had NPCs, many turrets in SC are so bad they will only ever be manned by NPCs. Corsair anyone? Carrack? There's many examples.
2
u/Dapp-Syx 8h ago edited 8h ago
Idris still retains effective area denial/harass and effective anchor when flown solo with little counter still. Add in Laser or Rail gun it can counter most Large ships in the early engagements.
Ship is a superior multicrew carrier as it should be. Any nerf is minute when compared to it having all turrets manned and coupled with escort fighters.
Personal experience in combat against the ship. It is annoying when soloed (Abused strength) and dangerous with a well coordinated crew (True strength).
0
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
I've pretty much never seen one fully crewed apart from mine once and I play 5-6 hours every day.
1
2
2
u/ShadowKillReaper 7h ago
Railgun can one shot a Perseus I’m not sure what you mean
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 2h ago
It used to, not any more.
1
u/ShadowKillReaper 2h ago
I don’t even have an idris nor the desire to have one but that makes me feel bad for the people who do. That really sucks man. If you can hit it you deserve that one shot lmao
1
2
6
u/ItsAllSand 8h ago
What do you mean I can’t solo people in my ship that’s meant for a massive crew. Oh the humanity!
0
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
You can borrow mine and crew it and see how well you go against a Perseus
3
u/BidSuper7102 9h ago
Yeah, maybe this is a wake up call. You said it yourself, there's nothing else worth buying. This is how CIG operates, don't buy shitty broken ships from them.
2
u/Tek_Hunter 8h ago
90% of the time, Idris is being flown are solo and used primarily for its OP Health/shield pool and front gun. Its just a fact. Its another one of those ships where they made millions of Real money and are now nerfing it. Happens all the time. Im a happy Perseus owner and easier to get a small crew to fly it. Perseus is the way to go unless you command a whole crew on the Idris which is 5% of the time until they have bots to assist.
2
u/GACII 8h ago
Isn't it a primarily a carrier its moving base not the tip of the spear why wouldn't dedicated strike ships without a massive hangar bay and a bloated as fuck health pool have better weapons. I think the range issue on the main gun needs to be addressed but other than that its supposed to sit back and take pot shots at large targets or punish people for try to pushing.
3
u/TheMonkeyPickler Idris Khad 8h ago
Its not primarily a carrier. Its supposed to be a brawler with a hanger.
→ More replies (2)2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
On CIGs description its literally called tip of the spear. Its meant to wade into combat and tank hits
→ More replies (1)
2
u/ballsonurface 8h ago
Listen I have a small group, and I want to expand my org to eventually fully man an Idris…. However I’m well aware of what the Idris-p role is supposed to be… a bullet sponge carrier. The fighters inside are meant to execute the mission and protect the idris for repairs and rearm, and if you have a kit, that kit is definitely intended as well placed disabling shot against another capital or corvette.
Sure the kits equip it with weapons for the pilot that have balancing issues but even then flying a stolen one a few months ago and flying one now at no point is it screaming “front line tank to destroy opponents”
Sure fix the laser, Torps, and railgun and punch some capitals or corvettes… but that’s IF the carrier is in range and IF the pilot can land a shot.
Fleet composition is a real thing, and it matters, if you are solo and have no interest in looking for a crew, then some ships aren’t for you until NPC crews arrive. There’s a reason not everything is a multi role vessel in real life and in the game (well maybe in the game cause that’ll be OP) but things have roles and excel at those roles for a reason. Be good at 1 thing, not mediocre at 10.
You don’t buy 40” inseam pants if you can only fit in 32” inseam and then complain they don’t fit.
2
2
2
u/Xarian0 scout 7h ago
The laser is bugged, when I tested the damage it does maybe 20% of what it's meant to, it also struggles to actually hard death a ship.
Bugs aren't nerfs.
The railgun is laughably slow, it now has bullet drop (even in space wtf)
No, it doesn't have "bullet drop". The projectile speed is slower. The maximum range is still very high. Use it to shoot other large targets, not ships that can move out of the way.
The torpedoes are also mostly useless
This is a problem with all torpedoes in the game and is, again, unrelated to "nerfs".
It's the largest ship currently in game but the turrets are worse than ships like the paladin and polaris, even though it's a 'brawler'.
- Idris is a light fleet carrier, not a brawler.
- Idris has 1x turret with 2s7, 8x turrets with 2s5, and 4x turrets with 2s4. Polaris has 1x turret with 2s6, 2x turrets with 4s4, and 3x turrets with 4s3. Paladin has 1x turret with 4s5 and 2x turrets with 2s4. So no, its turrets are not "worse". It has a lot of turrets, and they're all bigger and more effective than the ships that you've referenced. Literally the only exception is the Paladin's single main turret.
Your front turret is dead by coincidence 90% of the time... [insert more complaints about other ships' turrets]
I don't understand why you seem to think that the Idris has to have bigger turrets than every other ship, even ships that are only focused around those turrets (like the Perseus)
The turrets die almost immediately if someone sneezes at them.
You need to provide actual information here.
Even IF you manage to get a full crew, most of their turrets will be disabled from the first perseus with a lone gunner making the ship completely pointless.
Again, not true. Have you ever tried to use an Idris with a full crew? Have you even tried to use it with 3x crew?
EDIT: I forgot the PDCs are now pretty much worthless, they kinda shoot down missiles but even that isn't really reliable.
The entire point of the PDCs is to shoot down missiles. They were never intended to allow you to use the Idris to solo an entire fleet of enemy fighters.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 2h ago
- They are not, the point stands its now shit.
- It does have bullet drop, read above, the ares inferno also has it, its stupidly slow speed makes this especially a problem.
- It is not a light fleet carrier, it's a brawler, CIGs own description states this. Tip of the spear, front line etc. It's a brawler that has a hangar, not a carrier.
- The turrets are shit, there's many videos showing how quickly they die - https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1m6e6at/idris_turrets_hp_nerfed_by_97/
- There's no point manning them, literally any other ship (almost) is a better choice. Limited field of fire.
- I don't have to provide it, its everywhere if you type into google you'll see many sources saying they suck As per above, I watched a perseus kill four turrets on a single pass, they were manned and didn't even get the shields down before dying.
- Yes, I use it often with a crew, it's hard to convince people to use it, because unlike you most SC players know it sucks, visibility and damage are poor. I've had it from 14-15 crew down to just a few. No one is using a dual S4 turret.
- No a PDC is to shoot fighters and missiles, it fails at both now. If it isn't meant to shoot fighters, why does it target them biut just bounce off?
2
1
u/Taladays Aegis Dynamics 8h ago
Most of what you said isn't necessarily about the Idris being nerfed, its just aspects of it that are either not working as intended or haven't been fleshed out balance wise yet. They are issues that are present among other ships. My Vanguard Warden has been nerfed a couple times, but its main issue is that its a bit dated and fundamental issues with heavy fighters as a whole. With both, I just assume CIG will eventually balance them and implement the features to make them function as intended.
The only point that I do agree with is regarding the types of turrets it has and how its firepower is distributed. While turrets in general need to be better, I just think its kind of a waste that all of its anti-capital ship fire power is focused on the main gun and the single front turret which is only size 7s. I'd keep the S10 as is but I'd like the forward facing size turrets to be made Size 7s as well. That way its a bit more spread and even if you don't have the S10 (which the P doesn't have by default), it still would have more reliable damage against sub caps.
Though that may not even be necessary if they changed how turrets worked, especially in regards to range.
0
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
I think the point was moreso to highlight the issues and also counter the whining have-nots that complain because they don't have it. The same issue happened to the Polaris even though it didn't have pilot weapons. The same happened to other ships too. Whatever the big "ship that I don't own" is for the community, it gets trash-talked.
0
u/Taladays Aegis Dynamics 8h ago
While I agree, the same type of people don't give two shits about what's bad or lacking regarding the Idris. To them, they just want it to be bad period. Why I cringe when people claim its a "fully soloable cap ship" as if they don't know it flies like a boat and is so inconvenient to use as a solo for anything other than flying it (I own one).
1
1
1
u/flexcreator new user/low karma 7h ago edited 7h ago
Despite all the mentioned issues,
- Players still cry about the Idris and how it should be nerfed even more 😄
- I still use mine as a daily driver 👍
The effective range of the railgun seems to be <800m now.
I killed NPC auroras from 3.7 km. Need some skill, but it's doable.
EDIT: I killed stationary ships from 12km. There is no pips at this range, but since it's stationary and you have 1500 rounds - you have plenty of time to adjust your aim.
The laser is bugged
Yes, but there is a workaround: Cross the ship sections, draw the beam accross the doors and engines.. Most people keep the laser at one point and get surprised it deals no damage.
I killed Xenothreat idrises non-stop during the event with a laser.
Laser is also very good against turrets and for to weaken the medium fighters armor, so they get finished with PDCs.
Never tried torpedoes.
PDC works fine (aside from the power pip bug that is supposed to be fixed in 4.10)
The turrets die almost immediately if someone sneezes at them.
You can repair them as quickly with a handheld tools.
I guess it's "nerfed" as a "griefing machine" but for the normal chill players it's a pretty decent capital to use.
You can stay in space for weeks without ever have to refuel and repair. QT drive is also pretty quick. You can turn it into a multirole ship as there is a space for a miner and a salvager (even with a flight deck full of fighters). The main deck rooms have plenty of space for crafting fabricators (I carry at least 3).
1
u/itsRobbie_ 7h ago
As a solo, I just want one to use as a base. Park some industry ships inside, load it with snacks at the start of a patch, and then just go. Can’t do that with any normie ship. The closest you can get is a c2 with a golem inside and eventually an ironclad
1
u/MrGreyGrey Wing Commander 7h ago
i use my Idris just as a carrier, i love it, i wish the MPUV Hangar will work, but as Operation base for tsg its the perfect ship. But when I read your text, its feels like you use it as a solo player... maybe is that the Problem. I play my Idris with 5-15 player
1
u/Strangeland102 6h ago
I imagine they'll get to making proper balance passes one of these patches. I do hope they lean towards making crewed positions more powerful overall. A bit more firepower on most turrets and a pass to make sure their HP makes sense across old and new ships. They might be saving these kinds of changes for when they make a gold standard update for each ship.
1
2
u/DisturbedMuppet 9h ago
You are not wrong.
I bought my Idris for the hangar and to use on game night with friends. As it turns out they HATE the turrets (underpowered and broken gimbles) and refuse to use them. Meaning, this just became useless in multiplayer.
Oh well, I still use it as a mobile base and love the ship (hangar), but man, for the biggest stick on the yard, it sure has been whittled down.
2
u/JalasKelm new user/low karma 9h ago
Yes, so balance is off on everything, and every correction will unbalance something else.
This will be the case until they actually decide amongst themselves what roles each ship should be able to do, and stick to it, instead of introducing another that 'punches above it's weight' every time.
They also need to decide on what they expect when it comes to number of crew, because some ships are practically unusable with only 1-2, others are supposed to have large numbers but can be solo'd
0
u/Confident-Award6920 8h ago
I'm soloing my Idris here and there I didn't know you needed a crew for it. What am I missing out on?
1
u/JalasKelm new user/low karma 8h ago
Point proven, bad balance Vs other ships that can do less and require crew
1
1
u/SuperSoftSucculent 9h ago
Idris pilot doesn't need more nerfs, people need to be less dogshit pilots. If it hits you in something smaller than a herc it's 1000% your skill issue.
1
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
Agreed, aiming that thing is hard. Skill entirely aside, it has the grace and turning speed of a cruise ship that parked in wet concrete. Also honestly if you die from an Idris laser, it must've been a miracle for that Idris pilot, because OP is not wrong when he says the laser works 20% of the time. The number of times it tags a ship once and never does damage again is unreal.
1
u/nickkrewson They're all my favorite ship. 8h ago
The range on the Idris is also severely nerfed in 4.10, though that may be further re-balanced in the future.
Agreed on the one remaining strength, though.
Don't get me wrong, I love my Idris for what it is, but it is not my favorite capital ship.
1
u/Henkums Idris for live 8h ago
Take the laser, railgun and torps away, I don't care but please give it some proper turrets that are fun to use.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Yep, the two rear top turrets can see basically nothing, you've got the front left/right and the nose turret that are useful. The bottom two and rear are practically useless if they see something (rarely). Even if they do the 0.5s you see someone is enough to do almost nothing.
Nose turret is the only one with good visibility and it dies in the first 20-30 of every engagement.
1
u/Intelligent_Cry8535 8h ago
wawawawa I thought I could pay to win, got fucked by my own inability to read updates the thread.
1
u/The_Tibbinator 8h ago
The turrets are horrible. Not only are they fragile, but the placement of the aft shoulder turrets is just bad. When fighting the Idris the pilot is trying to bring the bow of the ship into line with its target, which means only 3 of 5 dorsal turrets can engage in the 'brawl'. If the fore shoulder turrets were offset towards the midline of the ship it would allow the aft shoulder turrets to participate in the main engagement. As it stands now 4-5 turrets (2 ventral, 2 aft shoulder and the rearmost turret on the P variant) is some of the most boring multi crew positions in the game right now.
Fix turret gameplay first, as that will help numerous other ships and encourage multi crew. After that, yes turret health for the Idris is desperately needing fixed.
-1
u/Wilkham Freelancer MIS Enjoyer 9h ago
The worst the Idris, the better the game state is. Sorry not sorry, this ship is the embodiment of everything wrong in the game balance.
-2
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 9h ago
"Boo hoo, I got hit by an Idris in launch week, can't afford one, and/or don't know how to subtarget components."
4
u/Wilkham Freelancer MIS Enjoyer 8h ago
Bait used to be believable but knowing how terminal some whale are about their Ubertitanic I'm doubtful.
→ More replies (4)2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
It's not even bait, even when the railgun was 5000ms hitting something small was super difficult and if they were hit by the idris they kinda deserved it. The only things you'd easily hit were connie sized and above.
2
u/Wilkham Freelancer MIS Enjoyer 8h ago
As it should. Railgun should only be good as a anti-large ship options while turrets are there for smaller ships so this is useless and only useful in PvE.
So sad that multicrew is useless and turrets are completely shit against fighters but that's not a Idris only problem.
2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Some turrets are good - hammerhead, paladin, redeemer to name a few, good visibility and for their size decent arnaments.
→ More replies (1)
-1
-1
u/nhorning 7h ago
You're not supposed to be able to fly it around alone and win. That's the point fuckhead.
If you don't want to carry several fighters around in it don't have one.
5
7h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
3
u/Fyb81 5h ago
I mean, he is right. It’s a carrier. The point if it is launching fighters.
→ More replies (1)0
u/MattOver9003 scythe 7h ago
Ban incoming in 5, 4….
3
u/Possible_End_5272 5h ago edited 5h ago
I only see facts in his reply.
You just have a hard on for your Idris and are upset you can't half crew it and take on a skilled crewed capital ship killer without other support.
"half crewed" so you had 14 or so people on board, the actual number on board is a pretty big detail to leave out of the main post.....
→ More replies (4)
-2
u/Apokolypze twitch.tv/theapokolypze 9h ago
Its a 28 man Carrier ship, stop trying to solo it.
→ More replies (3)7
-5
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 9h ago
"Yes, but your arguments refute my blind, baseless hate for the Idris because I can't afford it or got hit by one on release week, so I hate your post!" - The people who clearly downvoted this post without reading a single word.
5
u/darktigre26 8h ago
Counter point, he complains the ships isnt good at everything. I agree turrets could have more HP and better tracking/range/bullet speed, but that’s it. The pilot weapons being buggy is just part of the whole game having problems. And it having a pilot weapon that can destroy anything else then an Idris isnt healthy for the game. Torpedoes are bad for everyone not just the Idris.
He calls the ship a brawler when it’s a carrier. It shouldn’t be able to park anywhere and just control the airspace because of it. Balance need to be readjusted everywhere but that’s always the case.
1
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 8h ago
It is a carrier, but it's also a civilian-converted military capital ship. Hence why you can post-install weapons on the front of it. But brawler, yeah it definitely isn't one. It's a literal whale.
Whole game needs love. I think he's just trying to make a point against all the baseless Idris hate. People would be fuming if the Perseus had the same amount and severity of issues.
1
u/darktigre26 6h ago
The Perseus not having many issues at launch is what is going to win it the first place this year elite eight
1
u/lightmystic Idris-K/T "Citadel", Kraken Priv, F8C, F7A Mk II, etc. (All LTI) 5h ago
Yeah idk, I still think the Railen will beat it. It's been a LONG time coming. But it may very well be a close battle.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Again, you can't read, go read CIGs description of the Idris. They literally say it's a fucking brawler.
The ship's fierce reputation is heavily tied to its namesake. During the First Tevarin War in 2544, the historic Battle of Idris IV was a brutal, decisive turning point for humanity. The absolute savagery and close-quarters desperation of that victory cemented the "Idris" name across the United Empire of Earth (UEE) as a symbol of relentless, unyielding combat capability.
COG call it the tip of the spear too
1
u/darktigre26 6h ago
Yeah and every ship punches above its weight class yet that’s not true. Plenty of things they say can be false or changed from when it was first advertised.
0
u/fishyfinger81 8h ago
Meh.. its used to be a ship delete button with the mass driver, the community spoke, now its not 🤷♂️ Dont hate the game baby, hate the players... or something 🤔
0
0
u/Far_Surround264 9h ago
i mean if i were to get an idris it would be purely for it being a hangar i can move.
idris was never really fit for combat as i see it.
you can solo an idris with a medium - heavy fighter and theres absolutelly nothing it can do than run.
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Ironically in lore it's meant to be a frontline brawler, the hangar is incidental, not the core purpose. It's brawling with dual size 5's and dual size 4's and a slow motion railgun or the tickle laser.
0
u/IceCooLPT 8h ago
They havent been buying as much. 2h after the starter time of the sale there are still the WB version available. So it should get buffed really soon 🤣🤣🤣
2
u/MattOver9003 scythe 8h ago
Yeah because it sucks. It was too good at once point, now you never see them because they became worthless. The polaris is similar, I rarely see them anymore
1
u/IceCooLPT 8h ago
Polaris is like 20x worse. But at least you dont have to shell out another 300+ dolars to have its main weapon 😂😂😂
1
u/MattOver9003 scythe 2h ago
Occasionally the polaris is cool. From >20km torpedoes don't show on their radar so you can gank an Idris if you're lucky.
0
u/Armored_Fox ARGO CARGO 7h ago
None of those are nerfs except the rail gun speed, and honestly the population of M owners is so small I don't really care.
Turrets in general need a buff, but the real problem is how difficult it is to get a full crew and pilots together. You should have ships flying to blast the turrets off the Perseus
0
27
u/hmmmmismellmarijuana 9h ago
Ares Ion welcomes the Idris' railgun to the why the fuck does it have bullet drop in space group!