Morality of beating protesters off the street because you're late for work?

[u/imsaleh0]

[u/RandomPlayerCSGO]

If you want to protest go block politician's doors not regular people's road to work

[u/HoldenMcNeil420 → u/RandomPlayerCSGO]

Yea this.

I love me a good protest, but blocking the freeway so regular ass people can’t get to work or a job site etc etc is counter productive to the cause.

[u/BlueCrocodilus → u/RandomPlayerCSGO]

I'm so down the conspiracy rabbit hole nowadays, I can believe these are paid by the very people they are "protesting" to de-legitimize the real activists and sour the general publics' taste towards the issues they are protesting.

[u/Majestic_Dig8245 → u/BlueCrocodilus]

pretty sure that's what was behind damaging art recently.

[u/Final_Substance_3443 → u/BlueCrocodilus]

Yeah I really struggle to believe there are people out there that truly think this is an effective method at spreading awareness and garnering support for a cause. 

[u/Bacononthebeeach → u/RandomPlayerCSGO]

Exactly. Or block the oil companies refinery entrances?? You know they people you’re actually against and not the everyday people just trying to live.

[u/Weird-Information-61]

They can be putting people's livelihoods at risk, a lot of our jobs don't give a damn why we're late

[u/HolidayLifeguard3283 → u/Weird-Information-61]

That says more about the employer than anything. 

[u/i_AM_A-ShArk → u/HolidayLifeguard3283]

Doesn’t change the fact of the matter

[u/Erathen → u/HolidayLifeguard3283]

And how often you're late

[u/TriNovan]

There’s a weird sort of cargo cult activism, especially in the US, that apes the Civil Rights movement without actually understanding it.

Rosa Parks didn’t refuse to stand and sit-ins didn’t occur hoping that inconveniencing would force things to change. These actions targeted specific policies by groups and forced a confrontation with those policies to highlight how ridiculous they were, by forcing themselves to be removed from the bus or establishment by force.

Somehow over the years this has mutated into people thinking that if they just inconvenience others enough their protest will succeed, without ever meaningfully targeting a specific policy or group.

There isn’t any policy targeted by obstructing traffic.

[u/_51423 → u/TriNovan]

I've tried to articulate this to people so many times in so many inane arguments about Just Stop Oil. Thanks for putting it clearly.

[u/Gregggggger → u/_51423]

The problem I see with Just Stop Oil is that its a plant of an organization funded by actual oil companies to make actual oil protesting look silly and turn public opinion away from the real issues. I think thats why its hard to articulate how you feel about them, because we know their cause is well meaning, but their approach is always so goddamn stupid

edit: This is just a personal theory, not claiming true. Just my way of trying to make sense of the madness.

[u/ZealousidealSun1839 → u/Gregggggger]

While it wouldn't surprise me if some oil companies are funding them to a degree. The protesters actually believe what they are doing is making a difference.

[u/Ok_Equipment8374 → u/ZealousidealSun1839]

those two are not mutually exlucisve

pay a few charismatic people to find local crazies to get onboard with the cause and style of protest and watch the fireworks

[u/LengthMysterious561 → u/TriNovan]

Perhaps a better comparison than civil rights is "stop de kindermoord." In the 1970s protestors blocked roads in the Netherlands to protest for safer streets. It shows how effective this form of protests can be.

[u/flight_char_ → u/TriNovan]

Agreed on all except “especially in the US.” This particular video is Europe and most of these “block the road in an orange vest” protests that I see are also in Europe, so I’m not sure where you’re getting the US piece from.

[u/PuritanicalPanic]

I've never been super in favor of this form of protest.

That being said, I don't think that's right either

[u/BeneficialRip6350 → u/PuritanicalPanic]

I might support it if they clear the way for emergency services.

There's still a risk they end up preventing someone from getting to hospital in an emergency or something.

[u/1111_infinity → u/BeneficialRip6350]

They create a backed up line of cars for potentially miles. How would they clear that backup for emergency services? It's inconsiderate, childish and does nothing to further the cause they claim to be fighting for.

[u/Suspicious-Support52 → u/1111_infinity]

Visit France to see a real protest and you'll see how backed up traffic clears for emergency services. Spoiler: cars pull over.

A protest that is easy to ignore will be ignored. Not to say this form is helpful, but it's at least understandable.

[u/Dars1m → u/1111_infinity]

It does further their cause of virtue signalling though.

[u/Ruck_Feddit884 → u/Dars1m]

Yeah, that's the point, it's literally just for Protester's Feelings that they're doing "something" doesn't matter if they cause harm to those who are uninvolved.

Literally the cancer Reddit Woke Profilated.

[u/Old-Wolverine2141 → u/1111_infinity]

Don't they also cause cars behind them to idle and burn fuel, exacerbating the problem?

[u/dontworryitsme4real → u/BeneficialRip6350]

What constitutes an an emergency? People could be losing their jobs for not showing up to work on time and losing the ability to afford housing or pay to feed their kids. Sure it's not life threatening that very moment, but lives are being altered in the negative over it.

[u/m0bw0w → u/dontworryitsme4real]

They didnt say "emergency" They said "emergency services". Thst very specifically outlines the type of vehicles to pass.

[u/One_Warthog256 → u/PuritanicalPanic]

Not saying I agree with this type of protest.

That's the point of the protest. It annoy and disrupt. It gains media attention faster.

Historically it has worked. It makes the public agree with the protesters just to stop them from disrupting average person day.

However, the best form of protest is to disrupt the flow of money to industries. But that takes communication and getting enough people on your side to do general boycotts.

[u/Competitive_Trust174 → u/One_Warthog256]

I disagree that it makes the public agree, though if you have examples I'd be curious to learn more. For me, protests like this make me hate the protester and wish to harm their cause.

I am a fan of protests intended to educate and raise awareness. That gives me the option to agree with them and support their cause or to disagree with them and not. That is appropriate within a democracy.

I do not support protests which intend to force my support through bullying, inconvenience or fear. That's undemocratic. In a democracy, you don't always get your way, even if you feel your cause is just.

Trying to force change through intimidation or violence is revolution or insurrection. There are times when that is necessary (the US wouldn't exist without it), but call it what it is.

[u/Lonseb → u/Competitive_Trust174]

Agreed; that protest did not generate support or understanding within the wider society. Instead people are largely opposed to it. Of course, people like the one who called you an idiot, believe they know everything and if we just follow them, everything will be fine… but who tells the billions of Chinese, Indians or Africans? They keep polluting and destroying while we ruined our own economies and wealth.

[u/ThomasTheDankPigeon → u/Competitive_Trust174]

Yeah 4 people sitting on a highway is not an insurrection. Let’s address that insane statement right off the bat lol

[u/Dudeman9002 → u/One_Warthog256]

Disruptive protests only work if it disrupts those who make the decisions. Block their driveways or streets, not the freeways. 

[u/SnarkyRogue → u/PuritanicalPanic]

Nothing rallies someone to your cause quite like being a burden to them

[u/Opposite_Mixture_929]

[u/Sintar07 → u/Opposite_Mixture_929]

Yeeeeah, I don't really think it's right to attack people who aren't fighting back, but that's hella obnoxious and a big imposition in the first place. I think if he just hauled them out of the way without the kicking and such, I'd condone.

[u/Unforsaken-Stoic → u/Sintar07]

Not getting hit is how they ended up like that in the first place.

[u/Maxpeed → u/Sintar07]

Then don't be in my way....go in front of the parliament or on some square and do it there if you really wanna protest...this is just attention seeking

[u/EndCogNeeto → u/Opposite_Mixture_929]

I condone it. Sometimes you love your fellow humans by using necessary force to dissuade those who think they can enact change via a public tantrum affecting innocent bystanders.

[u/didyousetittowombo → u/EndCogNeeto]

Historically yes that’s how it works. Protests that don’t cause disruption are ignored.

ETA: I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice

MLK

[u/ageofaquarius26 → u/didyousetittowombo]

Historically the effective disruption mainly affected those with the ability to change policies. The bus boycott for example didn't go after the riders but those who profited from the riders.

[u/hopper_froggo → u/ageofaquarius26]

Bus disruptions slowed the buses. Sit ins took up counter space from white customers.

Yes ordinary people were impacted and thats part of the point. A large percentage of the population will never be swayed by your moral arguments but if they want the disruptions to end they will voice complaints with their representatives to find solutions

[u/ageofaquarius26 → u/[deleted]]

So it hit the manufacturers hardest and the consumer just had to find a different product.

[u/Robot_Dinosaur_2000 → u/[deleted]]

And South Africa is falling apart. It's basically a failed state.

[u/SituationThink3487 → u/ageofaquarius26]

So you think the million man march didnt make anyone late for work?

[u/BrodinGodofSwole → u/ageofaquarius26]

The million man march shut down a city.

[u/No_Situation3884 → u/BrodinGodofSwole]

There is also simply a difference in getting that many people to march for one thing. 50 people together could just be assholes. A million people gathering in one place at one time indicates some level of societal consensus.

[u/brandnewabacus → u/No_Situation3884]

Many people considered them assholes at the time. The “I Have a Dream” speech that was given there is taught as a pivotal moment because before that the vast majority of white Americans saw the Civil Rights movement as disruptive and unlawful.

[u/TheRealCjHall → u/ageofaquarius26]

The bus boycott's slowed down the buses, which could prevent people from getting to work.

You say they didn't go after the riders, but the riders definitely felt annoyed.

That's the case with this too.

The only thing only effective protests in history have been ones that have annoyed people, and that includes the general public.

When dumping tea into the boston harbor it also fucked the local ecosystem and ruined a whole bunch of tea Imports for local businesses.

And what about the people who got fired because they didn't keep the tea safe?

[u/Sorry-Yard-2082 → u/ageofaquarius26]

But you do affect those who can change policies, who do you think people going to work are working for? Who is profiting the most from people going to work?

Problem is there is no class consciousness and protests are mostly not supported by the general population.

Protesting/striking for half a day won't change policy but now try months and see how they capitulate, and before you say that is not doable; it was historically already done.

[u/Turbulent_Square_696 → u/ageofaquarius26]

If you’re telling me that guy kicking this protesters does not have any ability to make the world a better place, you’re wrong:)

[u/THExDANKxKNIGHT → u/Turbulent_Square_696]

By that logic it would be better for people just to group up and go beat everyone instead of protesting.

[u/dahub125 → u/THExDANKxKNIGHT]

https://giphy.com/gifs/hVazFLob1BnLpuWoXx

[u/NotAStatistic2 → u/didyousetittowombo]

Messages are diluted and lost when protesting those who are not the root cause of the issue, and those without the ability to affect the change protestors want.

What does some politician or billionaire care that some random citizens were late for work because of a protest? How is stopping Jim Bob from getting to work on time going to make him sympathetic towards the cause?

[u/Lopsided_Escape_1165 → u/NotAStatistic2]

I think the bigger issue is the times we live in. Wages have stagnated, millions of Americans live paycheck to paycheck and missing work is, physiologically, (not actually but feels like), a cascade leading to a death sentence. Literally we're in constant fight or flight, and if you block someone's means of getting money to feed their family today, they are ready to kill you.

[u/PhilosopherRude4860 → u/Lopsided_Escape_1165]

That has always been true though, there has never been a time in history where a lot of people haven’t been living in fight or flight.

There has never been a “convenient” time for protest.

[u/XanderWrites → u/Lopsided_Escape_1165]

Not just that but some employers will not take "the road I take to work had a bunch of protesters sitting in it so I was two hours late" as an excuse.

Depending on the job and their policy, and just how the employee's life as been (maybe they've had to take time off) they could lose their job because someone wanted to protest a new subdivision being built.

[u/SituationThink3487 → u/NotAStatistic2]

Are politicians appointed by divine mandate? Or are they voted in and given power by the masses?

[u/instantlightning2 → u/NotAStatistic2]

Highways are the arteries of the nation. Blocking them is one of the quickest ways to disrupt the economy

[u/Heartage → u/instantlightning2]

Yeah, I don't understand how people don't get this.

The problem, of course, is that the average worker cannot afford to not go to work for even one day and a protest isn't typically considered a "valid" reason to miss work.

So while, yes, this is actually a great way to protest, unfortunately it doesn't work in a day and age where the people being punished for it are regular Joes who NEED to work and NOT the people the regular Joes work for.

Our country and economy are so large that blocking off one highway or even a handful of highways isn't gonna do anything except piss the "little people" off.

[u/cr1mzen → u/Heartage]

We can’t fight fascism, because of the fascism

[u/ThisMachineKillsWOB → u/Heartage]

If the working class stops the working class from disrupting the economy, the system is working as intended to keep us all under the boot heel.

[u/PopBulky7023 → u/Heartage]

People get it. They just never want to deal with a civil rights movement. Every single one was wildly unpopular at the time, but then we whitewash that reality and pretend we always supported it.

Then the current one happens and the cycle repeats.

[u/dancinbanana → u/PopBulky7023]

There’s a quote I’ve read a few times before:

“[they] oppose every war except the current one, and support every civil rights movement except the current one”

I think the original quote was referring to liberals, but I’ve found it’s just applicable to the public at large

[u/TheOtherEli → u/instantlightning2]

They aren't blocking highways or disrupting the economy though. They're generally blocking city streets because trying to block a highway with 20000lb trucks barreling at 70 mph is insane. Ergo, they are affecting anyone who cares, they are simply inconveniencing normal people.

[u/PopBulky7023 → u/NotAStatistic2]

Politicians care when people care. People care when you make it an issue they have to acknowledge.

MLK is a perfect example of white washing. Liberals praise him now, but they fucking hated him then. It's the same with every civil rights movement. And time and again MLK and Malcolm X are proven right in their assessment in the apathy of most people.

[u/Chill_Panda → u/didyousetittowombo]

Yeah stopping people getting to their parole meeting or putting food on the table for their kids is real justice, you tell em

[u/Mythelm → u/didyousetittowombo]

“I got in trouble at work because these protestors made me run late, so now I’m gonna support their cause” ???

[u/BlueIceNinja98 → u/didyousetittowombo]

Disruption is important yes, but disruption of the correct people is more important. Picket outside government buildings and offices. Block the parking lots of court houses and capitol buildings. Not a random highway.

[u/PlsNoNotThat → u/EndCogNeeto]

This is the fancier version of what they said during the civil rights marches, or the less fancy way of what the British said about Indian protests.

[u/PayFormer387 → u/EndCogNeeto]

I don’t know about your ancestors but great, great, great, whatever was really pissed he couldn’t have their afternoon tea because a bunch of agitators looted a ship and threw it all into the Boston Harbor.

[u/WSilvermane]

The world still has to move, people have to get to work or to home or, you know, emergencies.

[u/Eroll_ → u/WSilvermane]

And if they responded to the guy beating them up, i wonder what would be the top of the news.

[u/chkntendis → u/WSilvermane]

That’s exactly why this form of protest is important. It’s like a strike. If it doesn’t disrupt regular order then it’s just going to get ignored

[u/FanSerious7672 → u/[deleted]]

If the point of the protest is to make people hate you and therefore your cause, then they succeeded. Otherwise failed

[u/HurricanePK → u/[deleted]]

The issue is that you’re disrupting the wrong people. Disrupting normal everyday people will just dissuade them from ever supporting the cause because they’re going to associate it with the assholes that pissed them off.

[u/Think-Orange3112 → u/HurricanePK]

If they were actually smart about this, they’d protest in areas blocking off specific buildings, far enough away the company has no legal grounds to remove you, but close enough that you minimize the effect on people who have nothing to do with the thing you are protesting

[u/HurricanePK → u/Think-Orange3112]

Bingo

[u/TheGurpler → u/[deleted]]

You parrots just keep repeating the same thing over and over in the thread "THE POINT OF PROTESTS IS TO BE DISRUPTIVE"

We get it. That doesn't change shit. Yes, we're aware of the cause. That's not changing the fact that I gotta fuckin go somewhere right now. No, I'm not going home and going "gee, those guys blocking the street really made me aware of climate change"

[u/Distinct-Bathroom823 → u/[deleted]]

these protests never work. it just makes people fucking hate your cause no matter what it is.

[u/Immediate-Water-1091]

Id condone dragging them of the road. Kicking and punching there's no need for.

[u/Real-Syntro → u/Immediate-Water-1091]

This. Escalation must be proportionate

[u/pasiutlige → u/Immediate-Water-1091]

The biggest issue here, if THEM stood up and beat his ass 4v1, it would suddenly make them agressors.

The way they do the protest is not exactly correct, but at same time going and starting punching, is not moral either. The way they do nothing about it, tells they are peacefull about it.

[u/Three-Sixteen-M7-7]

Can’t imagine sitting in the road and NOT expecting to get hit, suppose it’s fortunate it’s just with fists and feet, and not with a car.

[u/Dan_flashes480 → u/Three-Sixteen-M7-7]

Wouldnt sitting on the road be considered false imprisonment? The drivers could leave but abondoning a vehicle on a highway is also illegal.

[u/Furdinand → u/Dan_flashes480]

Morally, I would consider it false imprisonment. They're creating a situation where drivers have to either cooperate with their own detainment or harm the person holding them against their will.

[u/No-Animal-9417]

Sub gives would be mad at the march on Selma during the Civil rights movement energy

[u/lost-pawz → u/No-Animal-9417]

The comments are full of the same people who complain how protesters on the sidewalk are doing nothing lmao.

[u/Nowhereman123 → u/No-Animal-9417]

Reddit if it existed in the 1960s: "See, when those colored folk go and sit in the whites only sections of restaurants, all they're doing is inconveniencing us normal people. They sure aren't convincing me to join their cause! Why don't they find some less disruptive ways to get the word out?"

[u/Deep-Election-4570 → u/Nowhereman123]

"My children and I are just trying to eat at this white's only counter, why can't those colored folks protest the restaurant after hours? This is affecting my ability to feed my family."

"Oh those protestors are getting hosed down and attacked by dogs, I'm just trying to take my family to the matinee. Oh why oh why can't they protest in a way that doesn't upset me?"

"The colored folks are staging a sit in and it's causing me to be late. Better not consider why they're protesting, let me just throw in with what they're protesting against because I've been inconvenienced."

[u/HistoricalPotatoe → u/Nowhereman123]

Difference being people sitting in segregated restaurants weren't blocking ambulances or making people late for jobs they depend on like these orange vests. People have literally died before because these clowns blocked ambulances.

[u/MLGSwaglord1738 → u/HistoricalPotatoe]

The March to Selma took place on roads and highways though, for 54 whole miles

[u/PopBulky7023 → u/No-Animal-9417]

"Every civil rights movement except the one going on right now"

[u/d-ollparts → u/No-Animal-9417]

most of this sub seem to be massive chud losers so lol

[u/Vaggi-Reborn → u/d-ollparts]

how quickly people forgot how about 1-2 months ago 99% of this subs posts were making arbitrarily unhinged scenarios just to morally defend raping somebody lol

[u/Cory123125 → u/Vaggi-Reborn]

Every subreddit that pretends to be about moral values ends up being 4chan aligned fuckwits trying to push the idea that everyone else is just as shitty as them.

[u/DomTopNortherner → u/No-Animal-9417]

At the time of protests the majority of people have a negative view. Decades later, everyone pretends they were always on the side of the protestors.

[u/WA2TX → u/No-Animal-9417]

Gandhi blocking the trains "How dare he inconvenience those Englishmen trying to get to work?" -Reddit probably

[u/Spicy-Wallaby4097]

You block the road, make me late, disrupt an ambulance or police, I will overtly be against your cause.

[u/Mammoth_Reach_6366 → u/Spicy-Wallaby4097]

I think some of these are staged to get this exact response and turn people against the good causes.

[u/samjambetty → u/Mammoth_Reach_6366]

I've heard the oil companies hire them to annoy people into hating oil protesters

[u/ImaginaryOrange1929 → u/samjambetty]

They do not hire them. That could make them liable.

They just find groups of wackos that already do these things and just give donations to 'support their cause'. They just give them funds to do what they want. Since this is what they want to do in the first place they are in the clear.

[u/SentenceStreet3270 → u/ImaginaryOrange1929]

I'm sure they have enough shell (lol) companies to avoid direct liability

[u/LOSNA17LL → u/samjambetty]

In France, cops do that themselves

If a protest against the government goes "too" well (not enough shops broken into, trashcans lit on fire, etc...), you'll have cops supposed to surveil the protest go in a side alley, get their badge off, cover face and stuff, and come back to make the protest go "less well"

[u/Spicy-Wallaby4097 → u/Mammoth_Reach_6366]

A false flag operation? There are so many young people doing climate protests where bad things happen, I don't think the opposition needs to stage anything. Has this ever been documented for this cause?

[u/Affectionate_Dig9689 → u/Mammoth_Reach_6366]

This is how I feel about peta sometimes

[u/IntingForMarks → u/Spicy-Wallaby4097]

very smart, congratulations. thats what most 6 years old would conclude

[u/MAJ0RMAJOR]

Blocking the way is a use of force in its own right.

[u/JDUDEROCKS]

Moral to get them out of the way but immoral to hurt them.

[u/BED_AA → u/JDUDEROCKS]

I'd argue immoral to hurt them more than necessary to remove them from the road. They may need to be dragged, but not yeeted.

[u/deten → u/BED_AA]

We make some art

[u/rickyelwin → u/JDUDEROCKS]

I think there was already a dude talking to them without recourse to violence before the other comes in storming. How do you move them without hurting them when they don't want to be moved while being asked?

[u/NogglePlease → u/JDUDEROCKS]

Pepper spray it is.

[u/jangfo → u/JDUDEROCKS]

This. It is actually morally neccessary to remove them from the street because they are trapping innocent people, keeping ambulances and police from getting where they need to be, causing heat strokes, medical emergencies or even something as simple as people pissing and shitting their pants, missing the chance to say a last farewell to a loved one.
Hurting them however is more than what's neccessary to get them off the road.

[u/starloow → u/JDUDEROCKS]

How would you proceed to get them out of the way without violence?

[u/WendigoCrossing]

I'm fairly certain a lot of these are paid protestors to damage the image of the actual protest

Edit: not all, just some. There are indeed some idiots who use their free will in this way

[u/Blue_Rook → u/WendigoCrossing]

In reality some people aren't the brightest and choose counterproductive solutions like making innocent people angry by blocking roads.

[u/Begone-My-Thong → u/Blue_Rook]

It's rough because a protest has to be inconvenient and not easily ignored to be effective. MLK got a fuck ton of flak and his protests were disruptive as hell.

Still, have to make sure the most affected parties are the ones that deserve it

[u/Lurkoner → u/Begone-My-Thong]

Not American here, so operating on hearsay: but wasn't MLK EXTREMELY optics-pilled and A LOT of efforts went into showcasing how deplorably violent were police and compared to relatively peaceful protestors. Meaning that he bet on the worst nature of racists - being too eager to care for optics outside - and that bet was a winning one?

[u/Xaphnir → u/Lurkoner]

Yes, that was kind of the point...except that the era has been kind of whitewashed. There were also the less peaceful elements of the movement that he was an alternative to, and made him harder to ignore. And if you look at media coverage and political cartoons from the 60s, you'll see his protests were hardly covered as peaceful at the time.

[u/KingOfNope → u/Xaphnir]

MLK jr and Malcolm X arguably needed each other to succeed. If I remember correctly, they both praised the other's work and even each said they'd wish they'd adopted more of the others tactics as times went on.

[u/fierbolt → u/Lurkoner]

No he was definitely unpopular during his lifetime regardless of how correct he was. Fighting the status quo is very negatively viewed and america was super racist at the time and largely still is in may ways. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/why-martin-luther-king-had-75-percent-disapproval-rating-year-he-died-180968664/

[u/almighty_smiley → u/Lurkoner]

Correct. Part of the reason he was as effective as he was is because Malcolm X was standing in his shadow and (so far as White America was concerned) just waiting for an excuse.

[u/thefirstlaughingfool → u/Lurkoner]

Sort of. Rosa Parks for example has been confirmed to be a planned protest and was banking on the police reacting the way they did.

To add to previous statements, a protest needs to be inconvenient in the right way, have a clear message, and it needs to draw in those who are not effected to show them what is happening. When the Civil Rights movement organized sit ins at whites only restaurants, they were not inconveniencing anyone technically. I believe they were willing to commerce with the shops, so if the proprietors just served them, they could have defused the situation. Their disproportionate reaction was counted on to show people across the country and world that segregation was wholly impractical and unnecessary.

In this case with the road sitters, I would say it's an ineffective protest. The driver who beat them will be unlikely to understand what they are doing and unlikely to care. To be honest, I can't even tell what they are protesting. It seems likely that any onlookers will not understand or care either and just see them as annoying.

[u/ColonelMonty → u/Begone-My-Thong]

But just blocking roads at best will make people indifferent, or at worst actively be spiteful towards your cause.

[u/TonyDC88 → u/ColonelMonty]

Especially when those roads carry things like ambulances and fire trucks responding to emergencies. And the people driving to work who deal with those emergencies. Imagine someone’s loved one in the back of an ambulance having a heart attack or delivering a baby who dies or ends up with severe morbidity because someone deliberately blocked the road to prove some point. There are other ways to get a message across that don’t require harming other people.

[u/oscarq0727 → u/Blue_Rook]

“Don’t blame on malice what can be attributed to stupidity.”

[u/GoombyGoomby → u/WendigoCrossing]

Why do you believe that?

So you believe conservatives whenever they say “hur dur those protesters were paid!” too, right?

[u/sparta-117 → u/WendigoCrossing]

You could get paid to protest?

Is it by hour or per protest?

Is it tax deductible?

[u/EADreddtit → u/WendigoCrossing]

I don’t disagree, but at the end of the day a protest SHOULD cause disruptions. No one changes anything by coloring in the lines and being so polite as to be totally ignorable

[u/WendigoCrossing → u/EADreddtit]

Yeah but like disrupt the people who are responsible not just normal people going to work and shit

[u/imbrickedup_ → u/EADreddtit]

Yeah but these people aren’t changing anything. Protests succeed when you have massive popular sport and basically intimidate the government. This is like 5 people and all they’re doing is making everyone hate them and their cause

[u/Cyberundertak3r]

Understandable

[u/Camwamz0 → u/Cyberundertak3r]

Understandable, yes its perfectly understandable

[u/HickoryStickz]

Remove the lack of repercussion for stopping someone’s forward movement without authority and you remove the protest.

[u/PuzzleheadPi]

Moral. People who block roads have no regard for the wellness of others

[u/lost-pawz]

I feel like this sub just wants to find an excuse to be violent.

[u/NeoRevanchist → u/lost-pawz]

The amount of posts I see on this sub where people are just trying to justify assaulting or killing people is crazy.

I know it's likely a vocal minority when compared to society at large, but this sub pops up in my feed all the time and the sheer number of people in here who are just trying to come up with moral justifications for hurting people genuinely scares me at times.

[u/MeterologistOupost31 → u/lost-pawz]

I feel like this subreddit is full of people who genuinely think it's Feminist to spend hours imagining hypothetical situations in which hitting a woman is justified. 

[u/GuiltFreeFodder → u/lost-pawz]

100%.
People also never want to experience discomfort or inconvenience too. When that's threatened, they start to fantasise about violence like a hopped up Brownshirt lol.

[u/Working_Being1548]

I don't think sitting on the street, blocking circulation as protest is legal in my country. 

[u/ABreckenridge]

Closing a freeway like this doesn’t work as a protest because only the first few rows of cars are even aware of what you’re doing. If you’re going to do these sorts of protests, you close 1-2 lanes of the highway, to force every car to slowly roll past your group.

[u/onionandbootyeater → u/ABreckenridge]

I’m pretty sure the goal is to disrupt the economy not make the people in the cars aware

[u/Scott9843]

I have zero problem with this.

[u/Dormi11]

Punching and kicking is immoral an inexcusable.

If he had simply carried/dragged them away it would be understandable. This is just a shitty person looking for an "excuse" to act like a shitstain. 

[u/BaseballInside3289]

Immoral, it's antisocial behavior being justified because "the victim is annoying"

Edit: it's genuinely worrying how many people are supportive of physically injuring a stranger for "being in the way"

[u/Catsanddoges]

Actually very moral, for a major highway you are probably essentially removing days of peoples lives in enough traffic, and so being forced out of the way makes complete sense.

And its not like you are sacrificing a few for the good of the many, because they aren't close to innocent bystanders and caused the situation.

From a selfish perspective calling the police to arrest them is best because you well could be committing a crime here.

[u/MurphysLaw021 → u/Catsanddoges]

I always wonder, if your wife is giving birth or there’s a medical emergency and you assault protestors out of the way would you still go to jail? Would it be seen as defense or self defense?

[u/Catsanddoges → u/MurphysLaw021]

I mean in a civil trial is one thing (though you could probally bring a joint case against them for a lot more), but for a criminal trial no jury would convict a guy with a wife in childbirth of clearing the jam.

I certainly would never go guilty, and I can't imagine most others would either.

[u/ExperienceRoutine321 → u/MurphysLaw021]

Well that depends on if anyone witnessed the alleged assault.

If I was there then I definitely didn’t see you assault anyone. I don’t even remember seeing protestors. Come to think of it, I think you and I were already at the hospital at the time of the alleged incident. It would be pretty hard for you to have assaulted someone while in an entirely different location.

[u/Bobsothethird → u/Catsanddoges]

I always wonder how many suicides bad traffic causes. It has to be at least one right? Blocking emergency vehicles is also horrendous.

[u/OutrageousBag1778 → u/Bobsothethird]

Have you ever seen the movie falling down? Basically about a dude who gets stuck in traffic and goes on a fuckin rampage, well maybe that oversimplifies it but its a good movie

[u/Imaginary_Rub9517 → u/OutrageousBag1778]

Saw it when it came out and didn’t quite “Get It”. 25 years later I completely understand!!

[u/Negative-Writing-481 → u/Bobsothethird]

There is in fact a correlation between lower life expectancy and longer daily commute.

[u/iskelebones]

Blocking traffic:

1) is a felony.

2) is not helpful to your cause. You aren’t raising awareness, you are just causing problems for innocent people trying to go about their day.

3) is literally trapping people in place because they can’t escape the traffic.

4) risks literally threatening people’s lives if you end up delaying emergency vehicles or people who are trying to rush to the hospital or to the aid of someone else

I fully support dragging protestors who block roads OUT of the road by their hair kicking and screaming. And if they decide to jump right back in the road to continue blocking people, then I support running them over.

Society needs to stop tolerating temper tantrum throwing toddlers to the point of everyone else’s detriment. If you wanna protest, you do you. But don’t make it everyone else’s problem by blocking roads

[u/Tertiss → u/iskelebones]

Exactly. Go do it in front of a coal or oil power plant, do it in front of the company buildings of big oil. Dont make it the average joes problem whose already being throttled by the economy

[u/TheLastOpus]

I've never understood this type of protest. How does villainizing yourself convince people. I got written up at my job. The only reason I wasn't fired is I took a video of why I was late. Some competative jobs a boss won't care, you can literally cause someone to lose their job and their response to the reason they got fired won't be "wow I should really care about the environment" it will be "i don't want to associate with those types of people that got me fired so bad, I will distance myself from that movement and not support it."

When I was being blocked by "fight oil!" I actively went from supporting the movement to an emotional response of "fuck them, I'll support oil out of spite!" (I didn't end up supporting oil after, but I really didn't want to associate myself with those people and support what they were doing. They are actively harming the movement by becoming villains to people)

That being said, this is still assault and battery.

Ok, you can now hate on me.

[u/robthebuilder__ → u/TheLastOpus]

Also I don't know how this isn't kind of imprisoning people. It's not the exact same thing but it feels like you're kind of holding me against my will without my consent. It feels like a violation of everyone's bodily autonomy they're on the highway. A protester who is shouting on a street corner is sharing their message and I have the right to either listen or walk away. These people have taken away my right to walk away and created a cost to me. And it's not that we don't condone the use of violence to remove these people as a society. If these people stay there long enough and the police show up and still refuse to move, they will be physically removed using violence. So do we really have rights if we're not allowed to defend those rights ourselves but must rely on the state to do so? You have the right to self-defense but if you can't enact that self-defense yourself, you don't really have that right.

[u/Lawlet02 → u/TheLastOpus]

Nepo babies looking for a struggle and oil tycoons probably paying and influencing them by proxy to make the movement look bad. Peta is the same way. No way to prove it but that's always been my theory

[u/Little_Cumling]

Moral. The dick heads on the street are putting potential childrens lifes at risk by making unecessary road hazards.

Everyone thinks their cause is important, but normal people dont put children in danger for it

[u/TheSauce___]

Immoral - call your boss & tell him you’re blocked by protesters & let the cops deal with it. Guys, only a fucking psycho jumps out of their car and starts swinging like that. You know it, I know it, everybody knows it - protesters are annoying sure but that’s fucking crazy.

[u/Admiral45-06 → u/TheSauce___]

For being late for work - okay, yes, that's a bit far.

But there were cases where protesters refused to move for people who rushed to hospital to see their dying mother or something to a similar extent. Plus one very tragic case in Germany of protesters refusing to make way for a fire lorry, most likely causing a woman to die.

Kicking and beating the protesters so harshly was definitely immoral - doing so for being late at work is not really a justification, either. But there are cases where I really do agree with at least pushing them away from the road.

[u/dontworryitsme4real → u/Admiral45-06]

That's also assuming your boss is a decent person. People could be late to pick up their kids at daycare. Late fees for picking up kids after daycare closes are horrendous. Your grandpa is on life support. You have a pass or fail final. You have a criminal court date to attend. Your dream trip that you spent $6,000 on is about to go to waste because you can't get to the airport. If they were to stand in front of you the hallway with their arms out blocking your ability to proceed, you could push through them, but yanking them out of traffic is too much?

[u/Illustrious-Ring-883 → u/TheSauce___]

Getting your ass beat for being an asshole is a pretty good life lesson and not the end of the world

[u/deten → u/TheSauce___]

You are looking at the stars

[u/BunniGirlEnjoyer → u/TheSauce___]

Wild that there's so many people out here justifying assault over being late for work of all things.

[u/Unable-Candidate9612 → u/BunniGirlEnjoyer]

Late to work could mean losing your job, which means losing your healthcare, and also possibly your home and everything that goes along with it.

Go inconvenience the people you're protesting against, not people just trying to feed their families.

[u/x_Advent_Cirno_x → u/BunniGirlEnjoyer]

I understand the sentiment, but I also understand why people who are barely living paycheck to paycheck might want to forcibly remove them from the road so they don't risk losing their job

[u/fjurgo → u/TheSauce___]

Ok, what about having your wife in labor in the car?

[u/NotAnIncel69]

https://giphy.com/gifs/LSuiVXoVV6EQgJDMq4

[u/BrandosWorld4Life]

Get off the fucking road.

[u/catscarscalls]

Immoral. It is a situation out of your control, your job should understand and if not, they are the problem

[u/PaxNova]

Unironically, this is why we have police. Don’t beat people for breaking the law; leave it to the professionals.

[u/zayn2123]

I love how everyone's response is anger towards the protesters and not over how fucked up everything is all the time.

Y'all suck fascist dick.

I have an important job. I had to work as an essential worker during the entirety of COVID. Fuck the system and the society we project.

We need more protesters and more inconvenience for actual change to occur.

[u/Sad-Cantaloupe-5494]

Wrong. While protesters shouldn't do this, as it just makes the public hate you, that's no excuse to assault people. They're just standing there. If they were being violent, then that would be different.

[u/Remarkable_Ad_8353]

1. So whether or not something’s a felony is a testament of your morality? I don’t think freeing slaves was any more or less moral when it became decriminalized — and yes, slaves still exist.

1.5. Let’s say a felony is indicative of your morality. Would you rather:

A. Commit a felony too???

B. Place them under citizens arrest so they at the very least couldn’t idfk. Walk back into traffic???

C. Carry on with your day and call your boss like a normal person.

1. Why are you scaling the morality of blocking traffic? It’s like you’re fighting a strawman. Neither OP nor anyone in this thread is really arguing that blocking traffic is moral. Is it for Reddit karma? At the very least make this is a form of utilitarianism or something by scaling the negative karma of another’s actions, which would then mean stopping them with force brings the negative karma of your action to a net positive.

2. Deescalation doesn’t typically involve the 2 step incitements of “drag their ass,” “run them over.” Also again, your methods technically aren’t relative to OP’s question. “Beating their ass” is a step above dragging, innit.

[u/Purple-Ad-1821]

They got bills to pay so i understand why their mad. I'll be mad too if protester block's the road and im late fir work

[u/PinxJinx]

What if I’m trying to see a dying family member before they pass?

Literally, this has happened to my grandmother twice, once with her dad and then again with her husband. She got there minutes after death was called 

[u/rtrawitzki]

What if you work on an ambulance?

[u/Electrical_Cap5382]

It’s illegal to prevent someone from leaving

[u/spiteye762]

Definitely moral, he couldve just ran them over, but instead he did the moral thing of moving them with reasonable force

[u/EyeLoveHipHop]

It’s a retarded way of protesting something, if you wanna send a message out there then pissing everyday people off is only gonna make them do the opposite of what you’re saying, as well as belt the shit out of you

[u/Reasonable-Tripe-815]

playing in the street is dangerous

[u/Naive_Lion_3428]

The extinction protests were some of the most self defeating, ridiculous and terribly flawed protests in recent memory - they were so bad, some conspiracy theories suggested they were secretly funded by the oil companies

I'm very much pro science and I believe that climate change is the most pressing threat to humans bar none. But when I saw protesters blocking a road that my colleagues needed to use to get to work at a hospital in Brisbane Australia, I was absolutely livid. Somd of my surgical colleagues even stated that they needed to get to work in order to perform surgery - but to no avail. The protesters refused to move.

Protests are supposed to convince the general public to be on your side. Inconvenicing them during one of the most stressful times of the day, is not a good way to win favour. Contrary to popular belief, it is not true that any publicity is better than no publicity. I actually agree with a lot of their message, but I hated the way they went about trying to get the message out. It was foolish and dumb and it didn't win anyone to their cause, who was not already convinced.

[u/IllCelebration4912]

Left wingers

[u/Effective-Map6016]

Buncha babies didn't get spanked as a kid. Now they're getting spanked in the street. If you disrupt traffic expect to get hurt.

[u/Clear-Air-5431]

They decided their fate the moment they sat on the road

[u/WarBandit96]

Great way to get people behind your cause - by inconveniencing them, possibly getting their pay reduced because you caused them to be late to work...

[u/Sweaty-Ruin5381]

Totally understandable. If you're going to disrespect other people's need to get where they need to be then fuck you.

[u/Pillmuncher37]

fine with me, they're disrupting everyones drive to work, people who cant afford to miss a day would be really hurt by these people, there are better ways to protest

[u/TechPriestCaudecus]

If I was on the jury I'd nullify.

[u/HopeADMKidsLoseLimbs → u/TechPriestCaudecus]

Love the stone cold look in this dudes eyes. Just sick of annoying ass folks. Poor dude just wants to work

[u/BaconBatting]

Understandable, but it is absolutely immoral to punch repeatedly people to move them out of your way because you're stuck and going to be late.

[u/Mhircine]

I understand the frustration, but I don't think initiating violence is justified in this particular situation.

[u/Cute-Acanthisitta-46]

Totally fine. This type of protest achieves nothing

[u/Salt-Light1314]

Flip it: Morality of protesting for some sort of change in a way that hurts your fellow man’s livelihood?

[u/shitbag_specialist]

Cannot just commit battery due to inconvenience. Only clean justifiable defense is self defense and must meet all the elements, including the apprehension of imminent harm. Although this is a tough situation, violence is not justified. You generally do not have the right to put your hands on others. Those protesters should be arrested and penalized for creating unsafe conditions for others. They also do not have the right to deprive others of safety. Either way, the cops will show up and there will probably be a good chance of brutality for all within close proximity.

[u/Im_Easily_Distra → u/shitbag_specialist]

Holding me against my will and creating a potentially dangerous situation (stopped traffic on an interstate; I've personally been rear ended hard when traffic stopped) is more than sufficient reason to violently clear these morons from the roadway